Hacking WiiFlow Lite

[dishe]

Gentlemen. Thank you for your concern. Really. Appreciated. I understand the concepts involved and what I am trying to acheive.

Good, because apparently we don't. LOL

It doesn't involve any upscaling.
Thanks

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Ok so I'm totally lost then. Are you saying you want to avoid up-scaling by making it appear only in the center of the TV? Like as in displaying 480p image 1:1 pixel size on an HDTV? I don't think that's something the Wii has any control over. It doesn't dynamically change output resolution based on how big the graphic is, it's always either outputting 480p or 480i (or in special cases 240p apparently). Many TVs can be set to not upscale and sort of keep everything in a bounding box, but that doesn't seem like what you'd want either, so I'm totally lost!

 

[fledge68]

@dishe if theres any delay difference its only like a half a second to maybe a second. very minimal. and hardly noticeable.

 

[kaisersozeh]

Good, because apparently we don't. LOL



Ok so I'm totally lost then. Are you saying you want to avoid up-scaling by making it appear only in the center of the TV? Like as in displaying 480p image 1:1 pixel size on an HDTV? I don't think that's something the Wii has any control over. It doesn't dynamically change output resolution based on how big the graphic is, it's always either outputting 480p or 480i (or in special cases 240p apparently). Many TVs can be set to not upscale and sort of keep everything in a bounding box, but that doesn't seem like what you'd want either, so I'm totally lost!

OK - I can only really say the same things again Let's have a go
Lets say your tv can display a 1000 x 1000 pixel screen
But your console can only display a 250x250 screen
So, in order to proportionately display
a 10x10 image from
a 250x250 console on
a 1000x1000 screen,
the TV actualy blows up your 10x10 image to 40x40 - each dimension by exactly 4
BUT - I don't care about the size of the image - i think a 40x40 image doesn't look nice - I'd rather it displayed the image at 20x20,
or better yet, 10x10 - the original size of the image.
Now - if we're talking about a feature image that is meant to amuse or otherwise provide chewing gum for the eye, one might expect that front and center.
However - I'd like to experiment with very small simple, quick to load icon-like animations that merely indicate the passage of time in some corner of the screen - perhaps accompanying a big beautiful splash screen

@dishe if theres any delay difference its only like a half a second to maybe a second. very minimal. and hardly noticeable.

This is the difference between loading images from sd and loading from the embedded images?

 

[fledge68]

This is the difference between loading images from sd and loading from the embedded images?

yes

 

[kaisersozeh]

yes

Very cool

 

[dishe]

OK - I can only really say the same things again Let's have a go
Lets say your tv can display a 1000 x 1000 pixel screen
But your console can only display a 250x250 screen
So, in order to proportionately display
a 10x10 image from
a 250x250 console on
a 1000x1000 screen,
the TV actualy blows up your 10x10 image to 40x40 - each dimension by exactly 4
BUT - I don't care about the size of the image - i think a 40x40 image doesn't look nice - I'd rather it displayed the image at 20x20,
or better yet, 10x10 - the original size of the image.
Now - if we're talking about a feature image that is meant to amuse or otherwise provide chewing gum for the eye, one might expect that front and center.
However - I'd like to experiment with very small simple, quick to load icon-like animations that merely indicate the passage of time in some corner of the screen - perhaps acompanying a big beautiful splash screen

Ah hah. So you ARE still upscaling!! Saying there is no upscaling is totally inaccurate (and why I was confused). In this case, as I said before, you're going to be upscaling a smaller image with less detail. Granted you aren't upscaling to the same size as before, but considering the way upscalers work, it will have a smaller data set to work its algorithmic magic on, and therefore possibly be uglier. Either way, you won't be adding "pixel depth" to the final output. You'd be sending the same pixel information as a smaller resolution file would have to begin with. To be clear: there would be absolutely zero benefit that I can think of by having the Wii scale it down before sending, at least not that would have been archived by just using smaller source images and NOT having the Wii scale anything.

Meanwhile, I DO understand the corner thing. If all you want is an indication that it is alive and don't necessarily want to stare at a pixelated upscaled image front-and-center, I get that. Probably possible with a bit of work, but I'll do you one better: Why not use a loading graphic that doesn't look bad being upscaled? Simple graphics that use flat edges upscale fine. Like a square or rectangle or straight lines. Imagine 3 boxes in a row, that come on 1, 2, 3. That could be scaled to any resolution and not appear scaled.

 

[kaisersozeh]

The image i want to reproduce is smaller - the scaling is downwards, the 'pixels' smaller, the image quality 'improved' edit - subjectively

Ah hah. So you ARE still upscaling!! Saying there is no upscaling is totally inaccurate (and why I was confused). In this case, as I said before, you're going to be upscaling a smaller image with less detail. Granted you aren't upscaling to the same size as before, but considering the way upscalers work, it will have a smaller data set to work its algorithmic magic on, and therefore possibly be uglier. Either way, you won't be adding "pixel depth" to the final output. You'd be sending the same pixel information as a smaller resolution file would have to begin with. To be clear: there would be absolutely zero benefit that I can think of by having the Wii scale it down before sending, at least not that would have been archived by just using smaller source images and NOT having the Wii scale anything.

Meanwhile, I DO understand the corner thing. If all you want is an indication that it is alive and don't necessarily want to stare at a pixelated upscaled image front-and-center, I get that. Probably possible with a bit of work, but I'll do you one better: Why not use a loading graphic that doesn't look bad being upscaled? Simple graphics that use flat edges upscale fine. Like a square or rectangle or straight lines. Imagine 3 boxes in a row, that come on 1, 2, 3. That could be scaled to any resolution and not appear scaled.

I appreciate you're trying to help - sorry if i appeared a little terse or you felt patronised in any way.

 

[dishe]

The image i want to reproduce is smaller - the scaling is downwards, the 'pixels' smaller, the image quality 'improved' edit - subjectively

I don't see how that would be a possible outcome of what you describe. Downscaling an image which your TV will then upscale won't make any improvements, subjective or otherwise IMO.

 

[dishe]

Ok, I timed the original WiiFlow, the version with my loading circle baked in (thanks @fledge68), and the new one both with and without using the custom loading pngs. The verdict? They all seemed to take between 6-7 seconds before the screen comes to life. Crazy as this might seem, the one with loading wait files stored on the SD actually felt faster. Weird! To be fair, I tried my shorter "LOADING..." graphic which has only 3 or 4 frames and is monochromatic. Maybe that made it a bit faster and counteracted whatever slowdown the SD could have had on load time. Or maybe it's my imagination.
Either way, I noticed a glitch in the animation- I don't think it is taking the frames in order. It jumped around a lot. My frames are labelled <name of loop><number of frame>, so it would load in alphabetical order, but I don't think it is.

 

[fledge68]

Ok, I timed the original WiiFlow, the version with my loading circle baked in (thanks @fledge68), and the new one both with and without using the costom loading pngs. The verdict? They all seemed to take between 6-7 seconds before the screen comes to life. Crazy as this might seem, the one loading wait files stored on the SD actually felt faster. Weird! To be fair, I tried my shorter LOADING... graphic which has only 3 or 4 frames and is monochromatic. Maybe that made it a bit faster and counteracted whatever slowdown the SD could have had on load time.
Either way, I noticed a glitch in the animation- I don't think it is taking the frames in order. It jumped around a lot. My frames are labelled <name of loop><number of frame>, so it would load in alphabetical order, but I don't think it is.

Weird i never noticed that on my end. But you could be right which means i will need to add a alpha sort. Shouldnt be too hard.

edit: @dishe try this one with sorting added - http://www.mediafire.com/file/pl64appezf293al/boot.dol

 

[dishe]

Weird i never noticed that on my end. But you could be right which means i will need to add a alpha sort. Shouldnt be too hard.

edit: @dishe try this one with sorting added - http://www.mediafire.com/file/pl64appezf293al/boot.dol

Nope, strangest thing, it still plays at least one frame out of order. One out of three I tried seemed to be in order, I'm wondering if it has to do with the order they are written to the card? Without sorting, how does it decide which to pull first?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Ok- If I copy them 1x1 in the right order, it seems to work ok, so I guess that's how it is choosing them. Not sure why the sort doesn't work, but there's a workaround at least.
Meanwhile, I've been testing it from my home wii (not the one in the car- yes I have two LOL) where I'm launching it from the HBC. I just tried installing it to Priiloader, and sure enough it does not do the loading animation bit anymore. Goes back to stock anim. Didn't someone say it worked with their priiloader?

 

[fledge68]

Nope, strangest thing, it still plays at least one frame out of order. One out of three I tried seemed to be in order, I'm wondering if it has to do with the order they are written to the card? Without sorting, how does it decide which to pull first?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Ok- If I copy them 1x1 in the right order, it seems to work ok, so I guess that's how it is choosing them. Not sure why the sort doesn't work, but there's a workaround at least.
Meanwhile, I've been testing it from my home wii (not the one in the car- yes I have two LOL) where I'm launching it from the HBC. I just tried installing it to Priiloader, and sure enough it does not do the loading animation bit anymore. Goes back to stock anim. Didn't someone say it worked with their priiloader?

Lol i screwed up! I was in a rush this morning and i put the sort in the wrong spot.

Maybe this evening ill put it in the right spot.

 

[Hakaisha]

That's interesting. The custom boot animation does indeed work in Priiloader for me. I also haven't been experiencing any out of order frames. I've been naming my files "wait_01.png", "wait_02.png", etc, if that possibly changes anything.

The only oddities I've been experiencing are the animation going back to default after you switch to a different theme, and that blank last frame issue I mentioned earlier when the animation is sized smaller than 200x100.

Edit: Concerning the Priiloader issue, are you updated to the latest Priiloader version 0.8.2? It does mention something about fixing arguments when loading dol/elf files.

 

[fledge68]

That's interesting. The custom boot animation does indeed work in Priiloader for me. I also haven't been experiencing any out of order frames. I've been naming my files "wait_01.png", "wait_02.png", etc, if that possibly changes anything.

The only oddities I've been experiencing are the animation going back to default after you switch to a different theme, and that blank last frame issue I mentioned earlier when the animation is sized smaller than 200x100.

Edit: Concerning the Priiloader issue, are you updated to the latest Priiloader version 0.8.2? It does mention something about fixing arguments when loading dol/elf files.

@dishe this one should work with sorting - http://www.mediafire.com/file/34xo1nfbogsf7e1/boot.dol

as for switching themes - it goes back to default wait images because after switching themes wiiflow just boots itself from the boot.dol in the apps folder without the args from the meta.xml.
the wiiflow forwarder channel and the HBC 1.07 both read the meta.xml for args and send them to wiiflow when it starts.

solution would be to have wiiflow launch the forwarder channel or i add code to read the meta.xml and send them as args when launching wiiflow boot.dol

 

[dishe]

That's interesting. The custom boot animation does indeed work in Priiloader for me. I also haven't been experiencing any out of order frames. I've been naming my files "wait_01.png", "wait_02.png", etc, if that possibly changes anything.

The only oddities I've been experiencing are the animation going back to default after you switch to a different theme, and that blank last frame issue I mentioned earlier when the animation is sized smaller than 200x100.

If the files get written to the card in the correct order, its fine. Like I said, 1 out of 3 animations I tried were out of order. Ironically the first one was fine, it wasn't until I deleted them and pasted others, which likely fragmented the data somewhat and did not necessarily write them in sequential order to the storage. If I copy them one by one, it works fine.

Edit: Concerning the Priiloader issue, are you updated to the latest Priiloader version 0.8.2? It does mention something about fixing arguments when loading dol/elf files.

Ah, the Wii in my car is the one I'll be using, and the one in my house that I'm experimenting with is definitely NOT up to date. I guess I'll have to try it in the car after the weekend, chances are you are right.

@fledge68 thanks! I'll try it over the weekend if I can find some time to do some maintenance on the car wii. This is awesome!

 

[kaisersozeh]

I am going to start a new thread,the wiiflow functionality is new...@fledge68 I found a competition with a load of entries. Things are quieter, but how would you feel about using the most popular download in the wiiflow lite official skin for a couple of builds? It generated content....

I don't see how that would be a possible outcome of what you describe. Downscaling an image which your TV will then upscale won't make any improvements, subjective or otherwise IMO.

Thanks. Is everyone clear? I know I am...
Mate. It's just an experiment. It may not work. Conceptually, I dont see why It shouldn't. I appreciate and understand your points, I don't disagree on the facts, only your interpretation. It may be I haven't the means to describe what I'm doing, perhaps it is you who does not understand? I dont mean to be harsh but can you lay off the obnoxious a tad?
Thanks

Wait Animation Thread
https://gbatemp.net/threads/wiiflow-lite-wait-animations-r1148-or-higher.507827/

 

[dishe]

Edit: Concerning the Priiloader issue, are you updated to the latest Priiloader version 0.8.2? It does mention something about fixing arguments when loading dol/elf files.

Ah, the Wii in my car is the one I'll be using, and the one in my house that I'm experimenting with is definitely NOT up to date. I guess I'll have to try it in the car after the weekend, chances are you are right.

So to update, yes, it worked fine on my wii in the car since it was recently modded and had the most recent priiloader already. I updated the priiloader on my home wii and it works there now, too. So yeah- works fine as long as you have latest priiloader.

Meanwhile, I'm going to start playing with the categories to clean it up even more instead of using favorites (as we discussed earlier), but I'm wondering now, how hard is it to transfer a setup between two wiis? I've been bringing the Wii from my car back in every time I make changes then putting everything back under the seats when I'm done. Its a bit of a hassle, and would be a lot easier to just bring the SD/USB in to work on my home Wii setup, then bring those back out to the car when done. In order to do that, I'd also need to copy the the save game information, right? I'm not sure if that would make my task easier or even more annoying.

 

[fledge68]

So to update, yes, it worked fine on my wii in the car since it was recently modded and had the most recent priiloader already. I updated the priiloader on my home wii and it works there now, too. So yeah- works fine as long as you have latest priiloader.

Meanwhile, I'm going to start playing with the categories to clean it up even more instead of using favorites (as we discussed earlier), but I'm wondering now, how hard is it to transfer a setup between two wiis? I've been bringing the Wii from my car back in every time I make changes then putting everything back under the seats when I'm done. Its a bit of a hassle, and would be a lot easier to just bring the SD/USB in to work on my home Wii setup, then bring those back out to the car when done. In order to do that, I'd also need to copy the the save game information, right? I'm not sure if that would make my task easier or even more annoying.

you should be fine just swapping the SD/USB. i don't see any problem with that.

 

[dishe]

you should be fine just swapping the SD/USB. i don't see any problem with that.

But not everything moves with me when I do that- aren't some things contained in the save game file? How do I move that?

 

[kaisersozeh]

Fledge, would it be possible to audition wait animations from within wiiflow?
That could rock.
Also, if the maximum size could be set to full screen, 620 480, it would allow for experimentation with the position and size of the animation by embedding it in a full screen image.
The limit on size is an artifact of the limit on memory, it must be, so this would allow anyone making an animation to work to the actual limiting factors.
Ditto number of frames - could that also be defined in the meta.xml?
Hate to pile on feature requests for something you've only just added, it's really ace as is!

So to update, yes, it worked fine on my wii in the car since it was recently modded and had the most recent priiloader already. I updated the priiloader on my home wii and it works there now, too. So yeah- works fine as long as you have latest priiloader.

Meanwhile, I'm going to start playing with the categories to clean it up even more instead of using favorites (as we discussed earlier), but I'm wondering now, how hard is it to transfer a setup between two wiis? I've been bringing the Wii from my car back in every time I make changes then putting everything back under the seats when I'm done. Its a bit of a hassle, and would be a lot easier to just bring the SD/USB in to work on my home Wii setup, then bring those back out to the car when done. In order to do that, I'd also need to copy the the save game information, right? I'm not sure if that would make my task easier or even more annoying.

If the car wii can get on your home network, it could be relatively simple to do it from a pc over ftp. Even automate it to some degree. Wiiflow has an ftp client built in.
Big file sizes might be quicker to swap media.

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