Homebrew Why are hackers so against piracy?

[shinyquagsire23]

FEAR, thats the word.
In my case it is for other reasons (check rxtools thread page 103), but developers have fear of dont find any new exploit to have fun with. The most powerful actual exploits (beside Ninjhax) where found by the Gateway TEAM (they have many hidden hacks since 2012, check OOT save for details) and they have fear of dont be able to find any new exploits. In other words "they are ***** in their pants"
but anyway, thats good for now (check my opinion of why at rxtools thread page 103)

Legal trouble is a valid fear tbh, especially after geohot and the PS3, and especially now with the ESA trying to remove the fair use clause from digital software in the DMCA. Removing fair use from digital software and protection circumvention would make all 3DS hacking illegal because it would technically be bypassing their set restrictions they placed, piracy or no piracy. I definitely wouldn't want to risk legal trouble over something that's just a hobby for myself.

 

[Chelsea_Fantasy]

Legal trouble is a valid fear tbh, especially after geohot and the PS3, and especially now with the ESA trying to remove the fair use clause from digital software in the DMCA. Removing fair use from digital software and protection circumvention would make all 3DS hacking illegal because it would technically be bypassing their set restrictions they placed, piracy or no piracy. I definitely wouldn't want to risk legal trouble over something that's just a hobby for myself.

come to cuba, that laws does not affect this country at this time

in cuba does not exists real and legal video game market. all it is imported and re-selled by people

we even have a law that allow us to sell / re-sell burned discs!!!!!

 

[froggestspirit]

Legal trouble is a valid fear tbh, especially after geohot and the PS3, and especially now with the ESA trying to remove the fair use clause from digital software in the DMCA. Removing fair use from digital software and protection circumvention would make all 3DS hacking illegal because it would technically be bypassing their set restrictions they placed, piracy or no piracy. I definitely wouldn't want to risk legal trouble over something that's just a hobby for myself.

Still, even if so, there hasn't been many cases of people finding out if you hacked a said console, unless you just tell them flat out. And even if they make hacking (for homebrew) illegal, I'm sure that it would still be legal to write hombrew apps for it.

 

[dubbz82]

Legal trouble is a valid fear tbh, especially after geohot and the PS3, and especially now with the ESA trying to remove the fair use clause from digital software in the DMCA. Removing fair use from digital software and protection circumvention would make all 3DS hacking illegal because it would technically be bypassing their set restrictions they placed, piracy or no piracy. I definitely wouldn't want to risk legal trouble over something that's just a hobby for myself.

While I can certainly appreciate not wanting to put your neck on the line, one could argue that allowing emulators to be ran within a supposedly "piracy free" environment (which is quite hard to control with recent changes and discovery that so called "legit" .cia's can in fact be installed to sysnand, and provided there's a loader out there, emunand as well) could in fact be taken by nintendo (or whoever the IP holder is for which ever console) as enabling piracy, and cutting into their VC sales. To them, it doesn't matter if you're pirating brand new games, or games from 1986 - it's one in the same. At this point, it's a heck of a lot harder to argue against rom loading now than for it, since there's a rather sizable list of "legit" .cia's and most of the emunands in the works are promising region free eventually (source of list of games: https://gbatemp.net/threads/what-is...makes-them-different-from-illegit-cia.386478/ roughly halfway down the first page). I'm sure as nintendo continues to release new consoles, that list will either continue to grow, or nintendo will have no choice but to provide download codes. That being said, looking at that list, and taking out region restrictions, i see a list of almost every AAA first party game released for the 3ds. Ever. Along with at least one major 3rd party game (monster hunter).

 

[shinyquagsire23]

While I can certainly appreciate not wanting to put your neck on the line, one could argue that allowing emulators to be ran within a supposedly "piracy free" environment (which is quite hard to control with recent changes and discovery that so called "legit" .cia's can in fact be installed to sysnand, and provided there's a loader out there, emunand as well) could in fact be taken by nintendo (or whoever the IP holder is for which ever console) as enabling piracy, and cutting into their VC sales. To them, it doesn't matter if you're pirating brand new games, or games from 1986 - it's one in the same. At this point, it's a heck of a lot harder to argue against rom loading now than for it, since there's a rather sizable list of "legit" .cia's and most of the emunands in the works are promising region free eventually (source of list of games: https://gbatemp.net/threads/what-is...makes-them-different-from-illegit-cia.386478/ roughly halfway down the first page). I'm sure as nintendo continues to release new consoles, that list will either continue to grow, or nintendo will have no choice but to provide download codes. That being said, looking at that list, and taking out region restrictions, i see a list of almost every AAA first party game released for the 3ds. Ever. Along with at least one major 3rd party game (monster hunter).

Once could certainly say allowing emulators would be the same as enabling piracy, however I was not the one who allowed the emulator to be ran, that would be smea+friends with ninjhax. I merely ported an application to their framework. However, Nintendo has not won a single DMCA on emulators even today, and since emulators are legal I'm not worried there. I've already had this debate before so I'm just going to leave it at the fact that I happen to very much enjoy the legacy of the GBA and gpSP, so I ported it. It's really nothing more than that.

And on legit .cias, that's just Nintendo being stupid, they really need to move to download codes like they started to with the 2DS but didn't continue with for some reason...

 

[Chelsea_Fantasy]

While I can certainly appreciate not wanting to put your neck on the line ...

come to cuba, dudes. you will not have to put your necks in the line

 

[dubbz82]

--SNIP-- especially after geohot and the PS3 --SNIP--

His issues were with the posting of copyrighted system keys, not creating a rom/iso loader. If they were to go after someone for that, I'm sure they could very well track down DeanK...If they wanted to go after someone in the 3ds scene for something similar, it'd be Govnify...

 

[Chelsea_Fantasy]

His issues were with the posting of copyrighted system keys, not creating a rom/iso loader. If they were to go after someone for that, I'm sure they could very well track down DeanK...If they wanted to go after someone in the 3ds scene for something similar, it'd be Govnify...

they all come to cuba.

leaving jokes besided, if developers keep their things in the scene and does not accept donations or something that could give a clue of who they are, the can just hack the console JUST FOR FUN and show advances like is happening right now in the scene and day after day create good HOMEBREW applications and HOMEBREW games for all of us and keep the piracy capable applications/modifications to other people that wanna take the risk.

if you dont say that you created a hack or hacked your console, you are safe

 

[WeedZ]

Legal trouble is a valid fear tbh, especially after geohot and the PS3, and especially now with the ESA trying to remove the fair use clause from digital software in the DMCA. Removing fair use from digital software and protection circumvention would make all 3DS hacking illegal because it would technically be bypassing their set restrictions they placed, piracy or no piracy. I definitely wouldn't want to risk legal trouble over something that's just a hobby for myself.

You guys do know geohot was let of the hook right? It's hard to convict someone of piracy when all they did was modify software. That and the whole anonymous taking down Sony servers for months thing.

But you guys would be retarded if you believe any of these devs that are trying to restrict piracy arnt pirates themselves. Yeah they say morality this and that, but the truth is, there's less risk if only a handful of people pirate. Like how does roxas test that his emunand tools won't boot roms converted to cia? Or yellows and smealum testing a slew of games looking for entry points, you think they bought every game tested? Or the fact that they are obviously gateway owners having reversed gw code. They sold you guys a lie in the guise of morality. Like politics or religion.

 

[Chelsea_Fantasy]

You guys do know geohot was let of the hook right? It's hard to convict someone of piracy when all they did was modify software. That and the whole anonymous taking down Sony servers for months thing.

But you guys would be retarded if you believe any of these devs that are trying to restrict piracy arnt pirates themselves. Yeah they say morality this and that, but the truth is, there's less risk if only a handful of people pirate. Like how does roxas test that his emunand tools won't boot roms converted to cia? Or yellows and smealum testing a slew of games looking for entry points, you think they bought every game tested? Or the fact that they are obviously gateway owners having reversed gw code. They sold you guys a lie in the guise of morality. Like politics or religion.

i know that but cant do nothing

 

[shinyquagsire23]

You guys do know geohot was let of the hook right? It's hard to convict someone of piracy when all they did was modify software. That and the whole anonymous taking down Sony servers for months thing.

Or yellows and smealum testing a slew of games looking for entry points, you think they bought every game tested? Or the fact that they are obviously gateway owners having reversed gw code. They sold you guys a lie in the guise of morality. Like politics or religion.

geohot cannot hack the PS3 any more, at least not publicly. But regardless of whether he was let off the hook or not, it shows that Sony and possibly Nintendo is willing to protect their stuff at any cost. And for yls8 and smea, I'm fairly certain they bought most of their games actually considering the games they were looking for costed hardly anything at the time of buying. And with roxas, it's a simple test really. If you aren't patching sig checks, you aren't patching them, so .cias won't load, it's as simple as that.

 

[TecXero]

I'm against piracy, but I also see it as partially a service issue. If, for example, VC games weren't so expensive (like $1 for a GBC game instead of $5) I bet there would be more people willing to just go the VC route than just buying a flashcart and loading it up with emulators or using an Android with a gamepad attached. It wouldn't stop people from pirating but I'd be willing to bet there would be less people pirating.

On the note of why so many coders are against piracy. As for me, if I'm going to develop on a platform, then that means I probably have an interest and maybe even a passion for it. I wouldn't want to see my work used to possibly hurt the platform.

I don't even pirate music, though, so maybe I'm a bit extreme in this situation.

 

[WeedZ]

geohot cannot hack the PS3 any more, at least not publicly. But regardless of whether he was let off the hook or not, it shows that Sony and possibly Nintendo is willing to protect their stuff at any cost. And for yls8 and smea, I'm fairly certain they bought most of their games actually considering the games they were looking for costed hardly anything at the time of buying. And with roxas, it's a simple test really. If you aren't patching sig checks, you aren't patching them, so .cias won't load, it's as simple as that.

So I'm guessing you missed out on the latest rxtools news? He patched sig check and is creating a sort of white list for official software which he says is working. The point being to allow homebrew as cia. The rest of your post sounds naive. Yeah geohot can't share his findings, but that shows that no matter how pissy game companies get, they're not able to enforce any punishment. Govanify himself stated when he leaked the keys that he was leaking them from their private group and that they would probably be pissed.

 

[WeedZ]

Phone issue

 

[Kippykip]

The hackers probably just don't want to get arrested
they probably do pirate but call say, roms as backups
"Oh er gateway was made to play 'Backups'", "Can't wait to use wiiflow to play 'Backups' " that's obviously bullshit and you know it
However another possible reason is because say, didn't the DS have such a massive piracy problem and developers stop making games for it?

Spoiler

 

[the_randomizer]

The hackers probably just don't want to get arrested
they probably do pirate but call say, roms as backups
"Oh er gateway was made to play 'Backups'", "Can't wait to use wiiflow to play 'Backups' " that's obviously bullshit and you know it
However another possible reason is because say, didn't the DS have such a massive piracy problem and developers stop making games for it?

Spoiler

The DS sold nearly over 150,000,000 units in its lifetime, the very fact that piracy had any notable impact on the sales of its games is pure BS. And that picture in the spoilers, they have to oppose piracy to cover their asses legally speaking. What the members do is no one's business. Also, for the record, I really don't give two shits about having so many *ahem* backups of my Wii and Gamecube games. Moving on

 

[Xenon Hacks]

The DS sold nearly over 150,000,000 units in its lifetime, the very fact that piracy had any notable impact on the sales of its games is pure BS. And that picture in the spoilers, they have to oppose piracy to cover their asses legally speaking. What the members do is no one's business. Also, for the record, I really don't give two shits about having so many *ahem* backups of my Wii and Gamecube games. Moving on

Nice to know you dont have the piracy stick stuck in your butt

 

[TecXero]

The hackers probably just don't want to get arrested
they probably do pirate but call say, roms as backups
"Oh er gateway was made to play 'Backups'", "Can't wait to use wiiflow to play 'Backups' " that's obviously bullshit and you know it
However another possible reason is because say, didn't the DS have such a massive piracy problem and developers stop making games for it?

I'm not going to flat out condemn piracy, the world isn't that black and white. That said, there are people that stick to playing their own backups, including myself. I have some expensive equipment specifically for dumping my own games. I can afford to go that far, though I know of people that aren't that fortunate, so I don't judge them for pirating. Especially since they'd have to choose between a game or rent otherwise. That said, I won't help people pirate.

 

[Katlanie]

I really don't understand why this topic keeps coming up. Think about it if the 3ds console is opened up to all then its the end of new games being developed. Nintendo makes money off of their games and this is how they are able to keep support of the system for a few more years. If developers just recklessly opened up their hacks for all then say goodbye to future main titles. If I was a software developer I would rather spend my time on making it for other systems than a widely opened one.

Also piracy is already supported, while not free you have the choice to pay a SMALL sum of money for a sky or gateway. Now I know some will say they only want free so if thats the case then just wait it out for a few years for something to be released.

 

[Ryccardo]

Think about it if the 3ds console is opened up to all then its the end of new games being developed. [...] If developers just recklessly opened up their hacks for all then say goodbye to future main titles.

In 2007, the original DS and the Lite were hacked to the point it could run literally anything if you could:

1. afford an investment of half the price of a 3DS flashcard (which also worked on every firmware)
2. be computer literate enough to copy and paste files

yet the platform was supported until at least 2011 (2012 if you consider Black/White 2 as original games, which IMO they should)!