Hardware Official 3DS Technical Discussion

[VMM]

No shit, an image from E3 2010 doesn't count. The game came out more than a year after, that was an old build.

Even been an older build, the graphics are almost the same

Still far away from Mario Kart Double Dash(GC) screenshots

wich takes down your argument that 3DS is more powerful than GC.

PSP games are plagued with dithering, no AA and low poly models (good for its time but not now). It's essentially a PS1.5 while the 3DS is a Gamecube+.

You know, looking for the worst blurry screenshots you can find don't prove your point. An upclose view of the character model also doesn't.

I posted a multitude of pics for Tri G and a couple for Freedom Unite to show the difference and unsurprisingly, Tri G has better visuals (more polygons, effects, better textures). I don't know why you're continuing on your one-man crusade when it should be clear as day to anyone.

Do you want an easily recognizable improvement? Look at the ground in both games. Improved texture quality thanks to more RAM.

Tri G:

Freedom Unite:

I used a valid screenshots for Monster Hunter, instead of a shitty animation.
Use real screenshots.

No shit, I'm picking the best looking games to prove my point. The entire argument is that the 3DS is significantly more powerful than the PSP which I have proven with the games I've shown featuring advanced effects, better textures and overall better visuals.


You know that Super Mario 3D Land video that you ignored, look at the castle at 6:41. That features bump-mapping.

[media]http://www.youtube.c...sX0NFOo&#t=401s[/media]

Now look at other examples of advanced effects used by the 3DS,

That's HDR being used in Revelations.

Motion Blur.

Self-shadowing and surface shaders.

None of that is possible on the PSP. Some 3DS games also feature anti-aliasing.

If there were this large gap from 3DS over PSP the 3DS games would look a lot better.
Few 3DS games surpass the graphics of PSP top games.

3DS is superior to PSP in graphical terms,
the same Wii is to Gamecube,
but none show this large gap you always say,
they have graphics a lot similar.

I don't understand why you're been so stubborn
with something so simple and so true.

 

[JulietStMoon]

VMM, you must be the only person who genuinely believes Mario Kart double dash looks better than 7. Even in your screenshots, aside from the jaggies, I honestly think 7 looks better in every way...

and the gap from GCN to Wii is STILL about 50%, which is a pretty big gap (though not as phenomenal as between other systems), is what you compare to the gap between the PSP and 3DS. So if that's true, you basically admitted that SoulX is completely right about there being a large gap between them.

Also you've argued all this time that the PSP looks as good or BETTER than the 3DS. And now you're trying to quietly spin your argument so you say the PSP isn't more POWERFUL, it just isn't that much WEAKER than the 3DS.

So which is it?

 

[heartgold]

What the fuck is this shit. You have to be a retard to claim PSP and 3DS have similar graphics. If 3DS actually has some effort put into game development, PSP can't touch it.

Lets look at one game, we see 3ds running a direct port of Wii's monster huntet tri assets with no downgrades, plus better lightening and shadows. Try PSP? Oh wait we seen the shitting looking MH it display. Let alone the PSP, not even the gamecube can do it. Monster hunter tri G puts most GC games to shame as well.

Mario kart 7 is hardly focused on graphics, it looks slightly better than double dash to some extent cos of lighenting and what the gpu is capable of but slightly less polygons. Still impressive when you take into account it renders the image twice, in saying that, the PSP is in no 3ds league when the 3ds is rendering images twice and displaying graphics that PSP can ever dream of.

 

[Rydian]

Er, power versus resolution again, guys?

Hello? Anybody listening?

 

[DiscostewSM]

How can anyone really make a comparison between a highly-compressed JPG image with artifacts, and one that doesn't have those artifacts? If you want a true comparison, make them both with the artifacts.

EDIT:

For instance in terms of quality (not actual artifacts, but still), which of the two images would you use for comparison?

This one?

Or this one?

 

[Deleted_171835]

Spoiler

No shit, an image from E3 2010 doesn't count. The game came out more than a year after, that was an old build.

Even been an older build, the graphics are almost the same

Still far away from Mario Kart Double Dash(GC) screenshots

wich takes down your argument that 3DS is more powerful than GC.

PSP games are plagued with dithering, no AA and low poly models (good for its time but not now). It's essentially a PS1.5 while the 3DS is a Gamecube+.

You know, looking for the worst blurry screenshots you can find don't prove your point. An upclose view of the character model also doesn't.

I posted a multitude of pics for Tri G and a couple for Freedom Unite to show the difference and unsurprisingly, Tri G has better visuals (more polygons, effects, better textures). I don't know why you're continuing on your one-man crusade when it should be clear as day to anyone.

Do you want an easily recognizable improvement? Look at the ground in both games. Improved texture quality thanks to more RAM.

Tri G:

Freedom Unite:

I used a valid screenshots for Monster Hunter, instead of a shitty animation.
Use real screenshots.

No shit, I'm picking the best looking games to prove my point. The entire argument is that the 3DS is significantly more powerful than the PSP which I have proven with the games I've shown featuring advanced effects, better textures and overall better visuals.


You know that Super Mario 3D Land video that you ignored, look at the castle at 6:41. That features bump-mapping.

[media]http://www.youtube.c...sX0NFOo&#t=401s[/media]

Now look at other examples of advanced effects used by the 3DS,

That's HDR being used in Revelations.

Motion Blur.

Self-shadowing and surface shaders.

None of that is possible on the PSP. Some 3DS games also feature anti-aliasing.

If there were this large gap from 3DS over PSP the 3DS games would look a lot better.
Few 3DS games surpass the graphics of PSP top games.

3DS is superior to PSP in graphical terms,
the same Wii is to Gamecube,
but none show this large gap you always say,
they have graphics a lot similar.

I don't understand why you're been so stubborn
with something so simple and so true.

I would say Mario Kart 7 looks better than Double Dash simply because of the extra effects added. It may have less polygons but overall, it looks better. You know what proves the 3DS is roughly more powerful than the Gamecube? Those damn specs I posted earlier.


(1:20)

Neo Bowser City is pretty damn impressive at 60FPS, 3D On with the rain effects.

That isn't an animation. It's a gif showcasing multiple screenshots of Tri G and is perfectly valid. With @klim28 giving his first-hand opinion, the many images and videos, I don't know why you continue on with this crusade.

Now the PSP->3DS gap is akin to the Gamecube->Wii (2x as powerful)? What, you changed your mind now?

Even then, I disagree with that. The 3DS is a fair bit more powerful than the PSP (even more than the comparison). I've already shown you the advanced effects it can pull off (HDR, Motion-Blur, Self-shadowing and surface shaders) as well as the bump-mapping in Mario 3D Land and anti-aliasing in many 3DS games and you haven't said a single thing.

 

[Rydian]

When in non-3D mode, the 3DS only has to render one third as many pixels as the gamecube in 480p though? Meaning there's more power to spare.

It's like making 3 cakes versus 10. If you spend the same amount of time/power total for each set, the set of 3 is going to look better.

 

[chris888222]

Graphics =/= Power actually.

3DS graphics are very good but I doubt it is more powerful than GC.

but still...

the 3DS is a fair bit more powerful than the PSP (even more than the comparison). I've already shown you the advanced effects it can pull off (HDR, Motion-Blur, Self-shadowing and surface shaders) as well as the bump-mapping in Mario 3D Land and anti-aliasing in many 3DS games.

This is true, and impressive for a handheld (which many claim 'weak').

 

[RodrigoDavy]

I actually own Mario Kart 7 and I should note that I almost didn't see any decent screenshot of the game, I noticed that the gamecube version did seen similar but it looked fishy it just looked worst then the 3ds version and I couldn't actually put my finger on it. Than I remembered how the floor on Mario kart 7 looked so much detailed and then I looked on how the gamecube version looked so simple.

Look at the floor on the Double Dash:

Now look at the how the floor is more detailed at Mario Kart 7

The retro tracks comparison won't show this difference because they're less detailed to give a retro feeling. It's not just the floor, I noticed a lot of the background textures on gamecube just seems less detailed than the the 3ds version, that's why I think the Mario Kart 7 wins if not in graphical superiority at least being the most beatiful one. (and I think the Double Dash has too many information on the screen, the 3ds bottom screen takes care of the map and, c'mon, who the hell needs an speedometer?)

 

[VMM]

Now the PSP->3DS gap is akin to the Gamecube->Wii (2x as powerful)? What, you changed your mind now?

Even then, I disagree with that. The 3DS is a fair bit more powerful than the PSP (even more than the comparison). I've already shown you the advanced effects it can pull off (HDR, Motion-Blur, Self-shadowing and surface shaders) as well as the bump-mapping in Mario 3D Land and anti-aliasing in many 3DS games and you haven't said a single thing.

From the start I said they had similar graphics.
I never denied 3DS have better graphics over PSP,
but nothing like the huge gap you say.
Wii is like a 1.5*gamecube
A little bit better but that's all
Not the gap we expected or even half of this gap.

From PSP to 3DS this difference is slimmer
Some games look the same in both, like Kingdom Hearts.

This discussion is endless and we won't convince each other,
let's end for the benefit of the topic(unless you want to discuss until the end of time).

 

[JulietStMoon]

From the start I said they had similar graphics.
...
but nothing like the huge gap you say.
Wii is like a 1.5*gamecube
A little bit better but that's all

How the heck is 1.5x the GameCube NOT a huge gap? And if you really believe that, why were you arguing about how much better the GameCube looks than the 3DS all this time? You keep flip flopping on your stances to the point where it's impossible to discuss with you because you yourself have no idea what you even believe.

 

[RodrigoDavy]

But, you know, I actually learned a lot about the PSP, Gamecube and 3DS from all of this discussion, so I think it was productive, at least for me... Maybe now there'll be comparisons with a more powerful system like the Wii.

 

[VMM]

How the heck is 1.5x the GameCube NOT a huge gap? And if you really believe that, why were you arguing about how much better the GameCube looks than the 3DS all this time? You keep flip flopping on your stances to the point where it's impossible to discuss with you because you yourself have no idea what you even believe.

Don't confuse the things.
I was arguing that Gamecube had better graphics than 3DS because @soulx told 3DS was a Gamecube 1.5, just for it.
When I said Wii didn't was a huge gap to Gamecube, and 3DS wasn't a huge gap from PSP it was a complete different aspect than the first sentence I just said.

For me, the difference in power and graphics from PS2 to PS3, or Xbox to X360 can be said a huge gap.
Wich is a lot different then the gap from Gamecube to Wii.

 

[JulietStMoon]

For me, the difference in power and graphics from PS2 to PS3, or Xbox to X360 can be said a huge gap.
Wich is a lot different then the gap from Gamecube to Wii.

50% is still a pretty big gap. Not an astronomical gap like the PS2/PS3 or XBox/360, but it's definitely not a "small" gap either.

 

[VMM]

50% is still a pretty big gap. Not an astronomical gap like the PS2/PS3 or XBox/360, but it's definitely not a "small" gap either.

Big or small is relative, we have to consider a pattern.
And in case of the gap from sixth to seventh generation of game consoles, PS3 made the pattern the way it is.
And comparing the gap of GC to Wii to the pattern gap, we have a little and almost none gap.

The best powered console make the pattern. You probably already have heard a thoushand times that Wii is a weak console.
That's because what I said.

 

[JulietStMoon]

Big or small is relative, we have to consider a pattern.
And in case of the gap from sixth to seventh generation of game consoles, PS3 made the pattern the way it is.
And comparing the gap of GC to Wii to the pattern gap, we have a little and almost none gap.

The best powered console make the pattern. You probably already have heard a thoushand times that Wii is a weak console.
That's because what I said.

No argument there.

 

[Deleted_171835]

From the start I said they had similar graphics.
I never denied 3DS have better graphics over PSP,
but nothing like the huge gap you say.
Wii is like a 1.5*gamecube
A little bit better but that's all
Not the gap we expected or even half of this gap.

From PSP to 3DS this difference is slimmer
Some games look the same in both, like Kingdom Hearts.

This discussion is endless and we won't convince each other,
let's end for the benefit of the topic(unless you want to discuss until the end of time).

Previously, you said that Kingdom Hearts on the 3DS was worse than Birth By Sleep and now you say it's the same? Even so, KH: 3D merely shows that Square Enix reused some assets and didn't push the system.

The Gamecube -> Wii gap isn't the same. The Wii was essentially an overclocked Gamecube with more RAM. It was reasonably more powerful but it wasn't a large leap.

With the 3DS->PSP, its different. Here we have tons of new stuff including modern shaders, 4x more RAM, much higher polycount than the PSP and more. That isn't a small leap.

Nano Assault:


Shaders, mapping, great textures, particle effects...all at 60 FPS.

Monster Hunter: Tri G:

This is a Wii game running at 60FPS at 800x240 (and with improved shadows). PSP can't do this.

Resident Evil: Revelations:

Modern shaders, anti-aliasing and high-quality models. Once again, not possible on the PSP.

Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D

I hate to bring this up since it's a pretty shitty port (that doesn't really show off the 3DS's power) but since you brought up Peace Walker before, look at this. Rendering at 800x240 (higher resolution than PSP) at the same frame-rate at Peace Walker, and it looks better.


While whether it's significantly more powerful than the Gamecube is arguable, the large gap over the PSP should be a no-brainer.

 

[VMM]

From the start I said they had similar graphics.
I never denied 3DS have better graphics over PSP,
but nothing like the huge gap you say.
Wii is like a 1.5*gamecube
A little bit better but that's all
Not the gap we expected or even half of this gap.

From PSP to 3DS this difference is slimmer
Some games look the same in both, like Kingdom Hearts.

This discussion is endless and we won't convince each other,
let's end for the benefit of the topic(unless you want to discuss until the end of time).

Previously, you said that Kingdom Hearts on the 3DS was worse than Birth By Sleep and now you say it's the same? Even so, KH: 3D merely shows that Square Enix reused some assets and didn't push the system.

The Gamecube -> Wii gap isn't the same. The Wii was essentially an overclocked Gamecube with more RAM. It was reasonably more powerful but it wasn't a large leap.

With the 3DS->PSP, its different. Here we have tons of new stuff including modern shaders, 4x more RAM, much higher polycount than the PSP and more. That isn't a small leap.

Nano Assault:
[media]http://vimeo.com/33235830[/media]

Shaders, mapping, great textures, particle effects...all at 60 FPS.

Monster Hunter: Tri G:

This is a Wii game running at 60FPS at 800x240 (and with improved shadows). PSP can't do this.

Resident Evil: Revelations:

Modern shaders, anti-aliasing and high-quality models. Once again, not possible on the PSP.

Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D

I hate to bring this up since it's a pretty shitty port (that doesn't really show off the 3DS's power) but since you brought up Peace Walker before, look at this. Rendering at 800x240 (higher resolution than PSP) at the same frame-rate at Peace Walker, and it looks better.


While whether it's significantly more powerful than the Gamecube is arguable, the large gap over the PSP should be a no-brainer.

I didn't say Kingdom Hearts DDD looked worse than Birth by Sleep,
neither compared MGS from PSP to from 3DS.

If we take in consideration the gap from PSP to PSVita
we can see a astonishing difference.
Such a difference that we can even call this a huge gap.

As I said to @[member='xwatchmanx'],
this difference from PSP to PSVita became a pattern of graphical and power differences.
And compared to PSP-PSVita, PSP-3DS graphical and power differences doesn't look that big,
making it illogical to call this a huge gap.

 

[Deleted_171835]

I didn't say Kingdom Hearts DDD looked worse than Birth by Sleep,
neither compared MGS from PSP to from 3DS.

If we take in consideration the gap from PSP to PSVita
we can see a astonishing difference.
Such a difference that we can even call this a huge gap.

As I said to @[member='xwatchmanx'],
this difference from PSP to PSVita became a pattern of graphical and power differences.
And compared to PSP-PSVita, PSP-3DS graphical and power differences doesn't look that big,
making it illogical to call this a huge gap.

The gap from the PSP to the 3DS is big. It's not as large of a gap as the PSP->Vita but it's still quite significant and not a small Gamecube->Wii gap like you said. That's what I'm arguing.

 

[ShadowSora13]

Still far away from Mario Kart Double Dash(GC) screenshots

Propably these photos are from an emulator which upscales the GC resolution So.... come on guys deal with it 3ds>gc graphics as terms of advanced effects like motion blur aa etc gc didnt have those even if gc wins on polygons 3ds will make it look better