My stance on religion

[bnwchbammer]

Another thing I see in people with religious views is that they have some reason to believe in their religion vs just going with faith. For example, if there was no such thing as an afterlife, how many religions today would be affected and how many followers would still believe in the religion? The belief of an afterlife draws in many people into the crowd of a specific religion which seems like something humanistic to do.

Really, that's the biggest thing that keeps me tied to religion.
Most of the morals and everything have long passed me
(I'm a nice person, not because religion tells me to be one, but because it's just better to be a good person, right? Why do I need religion to tell me that?)
The only thing that I need an answer to is what comes after death?
Death gives people fear.
Fear is the perfect environment for faith to arise.
For too long, though, religion has struck humanity with fear, therefore the people following have been more easily manipulated.
Though that also goes with what TrolleyDave was saying about words vs messages.
Perhaps people are now going more towards the messages.
But that's not my point now.
The whole death thing is really all we need to figure out.
Personally, I don't believe in ghosts or souls or anything like that.
But I want to because I don't want death to be the end of my existence.
I also don't want people telling me exactly what happens after death unless it's been proven
(which is impossible unless you look at it without any bias of there being an afterlife)
It seriously scares me shitless to think that when I die it's all over.
There's no more me, there's nothing.
That's what draws me to religion
(as you said)
Though I still find it hard to believe in organized religion.
It's all a bit more manipulative than it has to be.

 

[TrolleyDave]

I think this sums up my thoughts of religion. I feel many churches (where church is defined as a place to discuss religion) today rely on 'words' rather than the 'message.' It's extremely rare (although I have met a few) when a person knows the actual 'message' of a religion. The amount of churches that heavily emphasize the words rather then the message is a very big motivation to not bother with a specific religion.

Unfortunately, I lack all motivation for Faith in respect to religion. I have tried several times, I was even raised as a Christian for the last 75% of the years of my life. I sense an extreme amount of distrust in credibility from the Christian religious leaders I have encountered especially when they make statements such as everything about genetics is wrong, evolution cannot possibly exist, and other radical statements such as a homosexuality is wrong (I am heterosexual, there just seems to be logical inconsistencies with that kind of stuff).

Generally, I do have some faith, but it's got to be something trustworthy and most religions today have lost that title. For example, I have faith in rev 20 is going to be a good CIOS. While I have no details of what to expect, I still make an accusation of it to be a good CIOS. I have not disproved it or proved it, so its more rather an opinion based on bias feelings

It seems that faith is tied into the concept of opinions. Trustworthy is a heavy topic especially since being trustworthy means that an unpredicted action is something you can trust. Unpredicted being defined as a future action and what not. All of this is for a different topic though and I didn't want to steer too far away from the original intent of religions.

I started to lose faith in religion when I was really young. I was actually kicked out of Sunday school simply for questioning too many things which led them to label me as a "bad influence". lol There's far too many contradictions in the teachings. Is there a God? I'm not so sure, but I definitely don't believe in one as defined by the Judaic religions. I do however believe in something like Karma. I believe the universe is an entity that we can't even begin to comprehend, and one that has it's own system of checks and balances. I have faith similar to yours, but probably a bit less logical. Even though there are so many times that make it look like good doesn't prevail, I have faith that good always will prevail over bad. Sometimes it may take centuries, but it always does. My roots lie firmly in logic, but like I say, I also believe in the illogical. Sometimes not following logic gives us the answer that we're truly looking, and being too logical blinds us to things that we should have noticed. I totally agree with you that faith is tied to the concept of opinion though, the problem is not every person is capable of forming their own opinions. They rely on others to think for them and go with what "feels" right. It's not the fault of the people though, it's the fault of a system that relies on us wanting them to do the thinking for the common person because that way they can influence society without having to revert to "muscle". Make a blind man trust you and you can practically lead him anywhere.

QUOTE(bnwchbammer @ Jul 6 2010, 09:53 PM) The whole death thing is really all we need to figure out.
Personally, I don't believe in ghosts or souls or anything like that.
But I want to because I don't want death to be the end of my existence.

If you lead your life right then death isn't the end of your existence. That's another problem I have with religion. It teaches that this existence is fleeting and just a testing ground for the next "life". It gives people a reason not to care about the betterment of society and to work on providing a better life for the next generation. Who cares if you leave this world in a mess, so long as you accept God/Christ as your saviour. However, that's kind of digressing from what I actually wanted to say! lol

People think that death could be the end of their existence. This isn't true. Even if there is no afterlife it still isn't the end of your existence. It may be the end of your physical existence but your spiritual existence lives on if you've led your life right. All the people you've ever touched, influenced, taught or changed even in the most minute way will remember you. And if your words are good, true, helpful, educational etc. then you may live on for generations. If your lucky enough you can change the lives of entire generations, guide society in a direction that it needs or any number of things. The end of the physical does not necessarily mean the end of the spiritual or mental.

 

[ProtoKun7]

I was actually kicked out of Sunday school simply for questioning too many things which led them to label me as a "bad influence".

Which Christian group was that for? They were obviously scared about being outwitted.

 

[Infinite Zero]

religion blog?

 

[Zetta_x]

I was actually kicked out of Sunday school simply for questioning too many things which led them to label me as a "bad influence".

Which Christian group was that for? They were obviously scared about being outwitted.

My dad was kicked out of Sunday School for peeing on the teachers desk. Apparently he had to use the bathroom and the nun told him he couldn't. So he told the nun that someone's going to get embarrassed and it is not going to be him (my dad). So he went up and peed on the teachers desk. Apparently my grandparents didn't find it funny given how religious they are and how much they wanted him to be in Catholic schools, but it sure makes me laugh to this day.

QUOTE(Infinite Zero @ Jul 6 2010, 11:06 PM)

religion blog?

While it is a controversial topic, it has many key elements that can be discussed. Contradictory what has been repeated a number of times Guild posted earlier, there has been a pretty good discussion of our opinions on religions today. It's also a good way to get to know people who use the boards and encourages interaction on a specific topic, for example, I know a bit more about a few GBAtemp users creating a social atmosphere.

 

[Panzer Tacticer]

I'd like to quote Bertrand Russell who wrote in Skeptical Essays I 1928

'it is undesirable to believe a proposition when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it true'.

No matter how long you read the Bible, and regardless of what flavour of text or whatever manner version of Christianity you work with, you will always and I do mean always, end up with the same result. There is NO reason to believe in god, and just because there are thousands and millions willing to believe, does not validate the fact they ALL have nothing. And faith people, is the same as nothing.

I have faith there is alien life out there in the cosmos, but, I am not objectionable to people stating I have zero proof. I can state a mathematical case for them existing, but, I have nothing to prove they are out there. So in the end, I have to suck it up and live with it.

Religion is a wasted effort. You have zero reason to support it. Zero proof that it will matter.

I can say there is no god, and not possess a shred of proof he isn't there, but so what, you have zero proof he is.
I hardly need to fret over being unable to prove a non existent being is not there.

I don't care if people claim to be 'saved'. They never had anything to be saved from.

 

[TrolleyDave]

I was actually kicked out of Sunday school simply for questioning too many things which led them to label me as a "bad influence".

Which Christian group was that for? They were obviously scared about being outwitted.

I couldn't tell you mate! I was living in Canada at the time and my Nana had me sent there. It was pretty much the only time she was ever disappointed in me! lol And you can laugh, they looked at me like I was the son of bleedin Satan! I can remember the frustration in the womans face really well, she got flustered really quickly. I was only a nipper! lol

 

[Sterling]

Well I guess I will take the plunge like a few other people. I won't mention my religion, but most of you either already know, or you will be able to figure it out. Well here goes my take:

I am a God fearing man, though that hasn't stopped me from doing things I know are wrong. Take piracy for example. I download lots of things every day, and I know it's wrong but I know that after it's all said and done the things I have done wrong will have been long out weighed by the things I did right. I drew my own conclusions about the things that are wrong and right. The little things don't bother me, but does that make me immoral? No. I made a few rules to live my life by, and I will most certainly make more of them in the future. I know the things I do in life have no meaning to THE Deity above, the things I do in life stay in life and do not transfer between. After death, I believe everyone (common people) is equal, and the society I will be in would be similar to Communism, only it will actually work. xD (sorry Guild/Dave). I believe that my place in Heaven was sealed after I accepted a certain someone as God's son.

My moral codes were dictated by what the Bible taught me, but I have developed my own codes. Partly because I was afraid but also because I want to be the best person I can be in the eyes of my fellow man. I do not know the Ten Commandments by heart, so don't ask me to recite them.

I may be considered a bad _______, but I know damn well that my place is waiting. I have doubted, I have sinned, but none of that makes any difference in my interpretation of my God's love.

Wow I got all emotional.

Oh @ Panzer: Question: Are scientific theories in the same category as God. Not able to be proven?

 

[Slyakin]

Oh goodness, these threads never get anywhere. It would be best to lock.

I believe in God, and that's all I'm gonna say.

 

[Sterling]

Oh goodness, these threads never get anywhere. It would be best to lock.

I believe in God, and that's all I'm gonna say.

They can try can't they? I say as soon as the first troll/nut walks in and posts religion hate werds lock this.

EDIT: well without valid reason. If they provide points and stuff, who am I to say no to a good debate?

EDIT2: Also this is the blogs, no post count up age.

 

[Tanas]

These threads often end up as Bible education for the religious.

 

[Sterling]

These threads often end up as Bible education for the religious.

I am not sure what you mean by that. If you mean lots of people trying to prove the other wrong, then yes. But so far so good, there has been no Bible quoting.

 

[Danny600kill]

My view is wary when relating to ''faith''

I do believe there is some higher force but I believe it is more relating to how Dave put it ''Karma'', I think like science ( Forces ) everything has an opposite and equal reaction, if something goes wrong, something else will go right.

Now my problem with Christianity is that is has changed to much over the years, if it is all true then how can it be changed? You can't change fact so this points towards it being false, I'm not saying it is I'm just saying it has changed to much for me to take it seriously

Islamic belief on the other hand has not changed since it was first believed, this helps me believe it and backs up my earlier point of facts not being able to be changed. The Qur'an is the same now as it was when it was written, which can't be said for the bible.

Now what worries me about religion is why did all of these miracles happen in the past and then seem to stop when the relative holy book was finished, after for example the bible nothing happened? No more miracles, no more saviours ect, it can't of just stopped, if they were 100% true and ''God'' ( Allah ect ) was real then why shouldn't we get the same treatment as they did back when the holy books were written

I always had a thought that the reason religion was created was thanks to the fear of death, ''faith'' is your best friend in many situations including death and so is doing its job but originally I think that people were afraid of what happened in the afterlife. Nowadays ''faith'' is great, it gets people through bad times, helps people feel confident ect and my favourite, it brings people together, so even if it is nonsense how can you hate it, you may not believe but it's not a bad thing to have on earth

To conclude I class my self as not religion, but I don't class my self as Atheist or Agnostic either, I have my own views and opinions and don't want to categorized into a group, I don't see religion as a problem of any kind respect peoples right to believe, people are people, they have a heart, lungs just like I do, they are human, no matter what sex, race, religion, sexuality, taste, looks ect we are all just Human beings, non of what I mentioned should affect our lives in a bad way, so people shouldn't look down on people, we are all equal and we are all put on this earth to do the same thing, unfortunately I like many others don't know what this thing is

 

[Magmorph]

Oh @ Panzer: Question: Are scientific theories in the same category as God. Not able to be proven?
Theories are not in the same category as God. Theories are based upon fact. For example plate tectonics is a theory. It cannot be proven to be true but it is the most plausible explanation we currently have. God would be in the category of a untested hypothesis.

I do believe there is some higher force but I believe it is more relating to how Dave put it ''Karma'', I think like science ( Forces ) everything has an opposite and equal reaction, if something goes wrong, something else will go right.
On the topic of Karma,
Good and Evil are so subjective. A combatant would consider it good if he took out one of his enemies but the soldiers he is fighting against would consider it evil. (I can't think of a better example right now)

QUOTE(danny600kill @ Jul 6 2010, 06:45 PM)

I always had a thought that the reason religion was created was thanks to the fear of death, ''faith'' is your best friend in many situations including death and so is doing its job but originally I think that people were afraid of what happened in the afterlife. Nowadays ''faith'' is great, it gets people through bad times, helps people feel confident ect and my favourite, it brings people together, so even if it is nonsense how can you hate it, you may not believe but it's not a bad thing to have on earth

When you look back on history and see the wars that have been caused by religion and the religious terrorist organizations that exist today do you still think it brings us together? When you see the religious protests against homosexuality and protests against life saving medical practices do you still think it brings us together?

 

[Cermage]

The whole soul concept has not been proven or disproven so, as you would most likely agree, a discussion of that will always boil down to speculation. This thread is more trying to state the facts for example, there is a god or there is not a god under a specific definition of god. While an obvious one, it would be logically contradicting if there was a god and there was no god. Logic can be used at a very basic level to identify key points of religions sometimes showing inconsistencies in a specific religion thus implying that it could not have been formed by a perfect being or God. The only alternative would have to be something humanistic or something that is not perfect. Maybe aliens =P

thing is, religion stems from that. all the mythos (miracles and wonders and whatnot) behind it can be disproved with what we know quite easily, some people probably accept that but choose to believe in a religion as answers can't be found anywhere else. but as for there being a god, hell, heaven and whatever else. that kind of stuff will always just boil down to speculation and conjecture.

 

[ProtoKun7]

I was actually kicked out of Sunday school simply for questioning too many things which led them to label me as a "bad influence".

Which Christian group was that for? They were obviously scared about being outwitted.

I couldn't tell you mate! I was living in Canada at the time and my Nana had me sent there. It was pretty much the only time she was ever disappointed in me! lol And you can laugh, they looked at me like I was the son of bleedin Satan! I can remember the frustration in the womans face really well, she got flustered really quickly. I was only a nipper! lol

See, in reality, questions are ideal, unless they're loaded questions trying to force someone into a corner maliciously, and it's best for people to get their own grasp of the beliefs they're learning about. If they kick you out for asking questions then it's a sign that they either don't know, or want to maintain superiority with "what I say goes and that's final". Not a good way to be. Not all religion is like that though, questions are valued.

 

[Panzer Tacticer]

Well I guess I will take the plunge like a few other people. I won't mention my religion, but most of you either already know, or you will be able to figure it out. Well here goes my take:

I am a God fearing man, though that hasn't stopped me from doing things I know are wrong. Take piracy for example. I download lots of things every day, and I know it's wrong but I know that after it's all said and done the things I have done wrong will have been long out weighed by the things I did right. I drew my own conclusions about the things that are wrong and right. The little things don't bother me, but does that make me immoral? No. I made a few rules to live my life by, and I will most certainly make more of them in the future. I know the things I do in life have no meaning to THE Deity above, the things I do in life stay in life and do not transfer between. After death, I believe everyone (common people) is equal, and the society I will be in would be similar to Communism, only it will actually work. xD (sorry Guild/Dave). I believe that my place in Heaven was sealed after I accepted a certain someone as God's son.

My moral codes were dictated by what the Bible taught me, but I have developed my own codes. Partly because I was afraid but also because I want to be the best person I can be in the eyes of my fellow man. I do not know the Ten Commandments by heart, so don't ask me to recite them.

I may be considered a bad _______, but I know damn well that my place is waiting. I have doubted, I have sinned, but none of that makes any difference in my interpretation of my God's love.

Wow I got all emotional.

Oh @ Panzer: Question: Are scientific theories in the same category as God. Not able to be proven?

Oh @ Panzer: Question: Are scientific theories in the same category as God. Not able to be proven?

There is a loooooong list of science that is at the level of speculation and pure mathematical muse that is almost impossible to really prove.
Some things we can discuss seemingly intelligently, but impossible to really 'see'. How for instance, does one see a 'string' from string theory?

The problem with the use of the term 'theory' is not all 'theory' is unproven and merely 'theory'. But we generally use the same term in both cases, both with proven and merely speculative thinking. It is this term that too many get too wrapped up with though in the usual debates.

For instance, it is not debatable if evolution works. It most certainly does. What might be debatable is precisely what we evolved from.
And most people forget, evolution was not a steady slow plodding never interrupted process. This planet has been subjected to 11 known instances of near total life extinction level events. We are hear thanks to a lot of bad luck happening to other creatures.

But the libraries are full of past sciences that were simply was full of crap

It's not always correct.