Homebrew Moonshell2.0beta5(english)

[enarky]

Which flash cart is going for a single digit price? And where? because I haven't seen any except for old R4's going for less than $20 US, most are at least $30 and those that are less are lacking in features and capabilities.

The main problem is that M3 products always were terribly overhyped in the first place. M3 Real can't do stuff the competition can't, besides loading Sakura and we know how that turned out. DSTT clones sell at DX for 6.50 USD, they can basically do everything a M3 Real can. You could of course argue that it's doubtable that DSTT clones will see any further updates, but from my experience with M3 you can bet that this card is dead now, too. This would've happened sooner or later, anyways. And if that's your concern you could always get an Acekard 2.1, which is a quality card with large third party support for only 11.70 USD.

Now, let the excuses for not ordering from DX roll...

 

[Styles420]

How about bad reviews for DX? I've heard more bad than good, and I've done my homework. The biggest complaint I've seen so far is duped cards, which seems reasonable if they're selling at such low prices while EVERY other reputable cart dealer has a higher price (and they all match each other to within a few dollars, except, of course, for DX).

And as far as I know, DSTT is still an M3 product, so that would defeat the purpose of a boycott - we're supposed to make the company hurt, not just one of their product lines. And if they suddenly have a massive wave of orders for the DSTT while everyone replaces their M3s, then they're getting double the customer base, when we need to be cutting it down to zero.

EDIT: I think I was confusing the DSTT with iTouch

And I checked DX just out of curiosity... their DSTT packages start at 11.80 USD, which is clearly double digits... cheap, though, you were right about that, enarky. The only single digit carts I saw were R4's and I think one other obscure media cart that seems to only play media - so nowhere near the same as an M3.

But if I'm wrong about DX's reputation, then I will publicly post my incorrectness... just don't know how I'll prove it unless I place my own order or two, so it may be a while

 

[enarky]

Not sure myself if DSTTs really are made by M3, but I recommended buying a clone, anyways. DX is a reliable online shop, it's just idiots that don't get that you won't get an original for 6.50 USD who give it a bad name. I never had a bad experience with them.

 

[Styles420]

Okay, that makes sense... but I would rather pay full price for the real thing, clones are cheaper for a reason

 

[George290506]

If this happened long time ago, why he want to stop coding now?
Also, is the "no commercial nds launching" a must be paid to moonshell add-on like M3 which should had paid him?

I hope FlashCart producers to pay him and adopt his software so as to make their best for their products.

Only once I bought M3 and this was a Slot-2 (due to RTC and compatibility). I never trusted them for Slot-1 cards; they update them nery regurarly.

 

[Ein-kun]

Yes! Boycott those products! I've already posted on our DS forums to boycott M3 products.

Screw those ****.

 

[Toni Plutonij]

OK, there are so many false information here, and bunch of you are bashing without knowing what actually happened!!

I'm not taking any sides, I'm not defending M3, if it's true that Moonlight didn't get payed, that was a very low blow from them, and there is no excuse..
But I'm just telling that this what are you doing should stop here and now, we don't know the whole story, your suggestions for Moonlight to release Sakura source is pointless, because M3 Team added commercial ROM support themselves, Moonligh only coded multimedia part of Sakura, and there are already DLDI hacks for it, so there would be no point..

Also, didn't it crossed your mind that maybe M3 DID pay him, and he didn't finished Sakura, and maybe asked for more money, and they refused!

You are looking just from one point of view, and I trying to stop this thread to go into big flame..

And just so you know, there will be NO removing support on M3 products, because we're supporting users that use it, there are always questions about some stuff, and there is not chance in hell that we'll remove M3 boards..also, whoever decides to break his M3 Real or i Touch cart is free to (DSTT isn't M3 product!!

), but that would be most stupid thing you could do..

Think people, think!!
You can't make judgment by hearing one side of story, and just blindly believe it!!

 

[enarky]

Toni, that's an incredibly laid back opinion of yours, but there was too much shit from M3 in the past to believe a single word from them. What Moonlight says sounds entirely convincing, IMHO.

Sakura has been around for... how long now? Six months, longer? It's "finished", people are using it.

 

[Mbmax]

@toni : I will just boycot them. It's my opinion and i think moonlight is a good person. But i could be wrong you are right. Let time give us more clue on this story.

BTW, today moonlight has updated his blog with a nice PS. He has left the link to his last moonshell 2.00 release (Screenshots are also available).

 

[Toni Plutonij]

Toni, that's incredibly laid back opinion of yours, but there was too much shit from M3 in the past to believe a single word from them. What Moonlight says sounds entirely convincing, IMHO.

Sakura has been around for... how long now? Six months, longer? It's "finished", people are using it.
I wouldn't call it "laid back", I'm telling that everyone should think for themselves, and not blindly believe everything and everyone..

In this particular case, I DO believe Moonlight, but I won't be flaming (as that IS against rules)..
Also:
QUOTEthere was too much shit from M3 in the past to believe a single word from them

They are company, they are NOT our friends!!

Moonlight is convincing..but attitude of most people posting here is just childish!

You want to break your carts and send them to M3 team, do it and see if they'll care!!

They already made profit from those carts you bought!
This is just prime example of not thinking straight!

And remember, Firmwares don't make profit, actual carts does!
If bunch of people decide not to use Sakura firmware, M3 Team won't be loosing anything!
They can only lose if people stop buying their carts, and I really HARDLY believe that will happen, there are lots of people outside this community that buy flashcarts, and also, there is bunch of people that just don't use homebrew (and don't care about supporting it), and they will be extremely satisfied with M3 Real!

Sakura is here almost for a year (last year, spring)..

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

Oh come on.
Thge M3 team aren't the only ones who used a loader based off Moonshell.
In fact they're the only team that publicly admits it.
Sure moonlight made a mistake, but then again, I wouldn't care if I made something and put time into it and got no money, how about everyone using it?

Also the M3 team were just gonna release a different version of touchpod, I think that if they took initiative and made a moonshell based loader, then good for them.

I agree with toni, and everyone who posted against the M3 team is a retard, they brought you the R4 you noobs! and they also gave us this card, which is better than the cyclo. (i.e. cyclo in my opinion is R4 with RTS and firmware updates)

Moonlight doesn't get it and after you bought you the card, they don't make profit from anything, they could just stop updating altogether!

Sure I feel sorry for him... but he missed the point, unless he made the cart and then they stole THAT off him, he has no argument. the M3 Sakura at first was just a M3 Real under YET another company. Then they decided to make a new firmware cause touchpod sucked and... well theres a new cart we made that sounds good. I know lets call it M3 Sakura!

 

[Styles420]

OK, there are so many false information here, and bunch of you are bashing without knowing what actually happened!!

I'm not taking any sides, I'm not defending M3, if it's true that Moonlight didn't get payed, that was a very low blow from them, and there is no excuse..
But I'm just telling that this what are you doing should stop here and now, we don't know the whole story, your suggestions for Moonlight to release Sakura source is pointless, because M3 Team added commercial ROM support themselves, Moonligh only coded multimedia part of Sakura, and there are already DLDI hacks for it, so there would be no point..

Also, didn't it crossed your mind that maybe M3 DID pay him, and he didn't finished Sakura, and maybe asked for more money, and they refused!

You are looking just from one point of view, and I trying to stop this thread to go into big flame..

And just so you know, there will be NO removing support on M3 products, because we're supporting users that use it, there are always questions about some stuff, and there is not chance in hell that we'll remove M3 boards..also, whoever decides to break his M3 Real or i Touch cart is free to (DSTT isn't M3 product!!

), but that would be most stupid thing you could do..

Think people, think!!
You can't make judgment by hearing one side of story, and just blindly believe it!!

Good to hear the voice of reason - like I said in one of my posts, let's have some patience. So far my ideas have been speculation, but I agree with Toni, let's wait until we know the full story.

(Also, I realized my mistake about the DSTT - looked it up after I posted, lol)

If it turns out that Moonlight was, in fact, screwed, and that he wasn't at fault in some way himself, then I think the best course of action is to boycott and flood every pertinent site with bad reviews. But that's IF we have the story correct - let's not be rash. Thanks Toni, for reminding us not to get carried away and march to M3 with pitch forks and torches - at least not until we really know what's up.

 

[seren]

If what happened was true, I'd like to at least see gbatemp do a front page article to expose it and let the community decide what to do. Better hurry gbatemp reporters! I smell a front page article!

And remember, Firmwares don't make profit, actual carts does!

That may be true but a cart is both hardware and firmware. My decision on buying a cart is based on an overall package. Would a person have bought the m3real had they not had the sakura option? I know I had only considered it because of sakura.

QUOTEwe don't know the whole story, your suggestions for Moonlight to release Sakura source is pointless, because M3 Team added commercial ROM support themselves, Moonligh only coded multimedia part of Sakura, and there are already DLDI hacks for it, so there would be no point..

I don't think that releasing the code is pointless. The DLDI hacks only allowed multimedia playback, but if he released the source code other companies could also integrate his interface to their own firmware allowing ROM support. If he coded it and wasn't paid I don't see any problems with him releasing the code if he wanted. I know the AK:RPG could benefit from this.

 

[Styles420]

I need to step back and clarify my position on this issue - many of us are getting a little carried away.

First, my suggestion about returning the M3's (and breaking them) is purely fantasy - it would make a great statement of protest, but only if EVERYONE joined in. I certainly can't afford to do that, and I would hate to think that anyone else would do it at my suggestion - it just wouldn't have the right impact if we didn't coordinate it properly.

Second, I still think that the M3 itself is a great flash cart. I am beginning to have some doubts about the M3 team's quality of support, but perhaps I'm just being a little too impatient waiting for an official English Sakura... And, as Toni pointed out, we don't know the full story - a lot of this has been our speculation based on a translation, which may or may not be entirely correct (Though Densetsu's translations seem to be pretty damn good as far as I can tell). But even if the translation is correct, it's still just one side of the story, with a lot of details left out. We have been filling those holes with pure speculation so far - give it a week or so until we can find out more.

I would like to stress one of Toni's points as well - that support for the M3 won't be removed from GBATemp. I have been against the ban since I first learned of the vote, because it wouldn't affect M3 anyway. But those of us in this community who use M3 products would be hurt by it - why should we be punished?

So the main point is, give it time. IF the version of events that has been generally accepted on this forum turns out to be the way it really happened, then I would fully support a ban - but we don't know enough yet (I can't seem to stress that enough).

 

[Vague Rant]

Oh come on.
Thge M3 team aren't the only ones who used a loader based off Moonshell.
In fact they're the only team that publicly admits it.
For one, no they aren't, teams like the EZ-Team are very open about the fact that their firmware runs on Moonshell. For two, what they apparently are is the only team to contract Moonlight to continue development of Moonshell then refuse to pay him.

Sure moonlight made a mistake, but then again, I wouldn't care if I made something and put time into it and got no money, how about everyone using it?
Have you ever worked a day in your life? Moonlight was working and wasn't paid for it. If you got yourself a job under the falsity that you would be receiving a pay check, you would be rightfully pissed.

I agree with toni, and everyone who posted against the M3 team is a retard, they brought you the R4 you noobs! and they also gave us this card, which is better than the cyclo. (i.e. cyclo in my opinion is R4 with RTS and firmware updates)

And the M3 is what, R4 with RTS and no firmware updates? I think you'll find yourself pretty lonely touting the M3 as the best card in existence. Besides which, the quality of their cards is completely irrelevant to their defrauding of developers.
QUOTE(Antoligy @ Jan 17 2009, 05:31 AM)

Sure I feel sorry for him... but he missed the point, unless he made the cart and then they stole THAT off him, he has no argument. the M3 Sakura at first was just a M3 Real under YET another company. Then they decided to make a new firmware cause touchpod sucked and... well theres a new cart we made that sounds good. I know lets call it M3 Sakura!

Except that you're entirely wrong. You make it sound like Moonlight has nothing to do with developing Sakura. It's what he was contracted to do, and it looks like he wasn't paid. That is the definition of bullshit.

 

[Toni Plutonij]

And remember, Firmwares don't make profit, actual carts does!

That may be true but a cart is both hardware and firmware. My decision on buying a cart is based on an overall package. Would a person have bought the m3real had they not had the sakura option? I know I had only considered it because of sakura.

I knew someone will write that..
You didn't catch my full point, of course that Firmware is selling point, I was merely saying that braking your flashcart and sending it to them, and also "not downloading" firmware, won't do any harm to M3 Team, because they already earned money from sold carts, and they aren't earning any money from people that already have flashcart, but just update their firmware..
That was my point, I hope you get it..

QUOTE

we don't know the whole story, your suggestions for Moonlight to release Sakura source is pointless, because M3 Team added commercial ROM support themselves, Moonligh only coded multimedia part of Sakura, and there are already DLDI hacks for it, so there would be no point..

I don't think that releasing the code is pointless. The DLDI hacks only allowed multimedia playback, but if he released the source code other companies could also integrate his interface to their own firmware allowing ROM support. If he coded it and wasn't paid I don't see any problems with him releasing the code if he wanted. I know the AK:RPG could benefit from this.

Nope, it's still pointless, because MoonShell is released with the source code, and any team can already implement it in their firmware, but they are not doing it, why I don't know..But he wouldn't get anything by releasing the source of a Sakura!!

And also, if other teams make Sakura firmware, it still wouldn't be anything good, because that would mean that all carts have same firmware, and the main point of GUI is that every cart personalize it and make it more appealing! Not to make all GUIs same!


And @ Styles420, thanks you

You get what I mean, I'm not taking any sides, I'm just preventing you people to make this thread only about flaming, and to think for yourself, not that others think for you!!
I have my opinion about all this..but I'm not going to say FUCK M3 THEY LIE AND STEAL, or THAT MOONLIGHT IS PATHETIC, WHY IS HE DROPPING SUPPORT!!

I'm going to have serious and clear discussion about it!

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

Sure Moonlight was cheated. but if he set up a donation fund, I'd pay him exactly the same as what I payed for the M3.
I don't say they're the best card in existence, I just say that the Cyclo isn't.

And yes I have worked and had a similar situation, I have had code stolen off me, but that got resolved.

The EZteam aren't as open as the M3 team... but the EZteam provide support...


Meh, they didn't say anywhere (I read) that moonlight was payed... that changes things.

 

[Searinox]

I propose providing Moonlight with donations aswell as shunning M3 support from the website. GBAtemp is a huge resource of software and solutions that many flashcarts depend on. No doubt boycotting team M3's software will have an impact on them. GBAtemp has offerred free gifts as part of contests many times I'm sure they can reward Moonlight in some way!

The M3 are horrible. What they did and argued with rudolph and now scamming our beloved Moonlight over is unacceptable without an appropriate response from the GBAtemp community!

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

I personally think that if we made the M3 Team pay moonlight for his work, that we could let them off.
But he still deserves extra. After all, pretty much all flashcards wouldn't work without his work.

 

[seren]

Nope, it's still pointless, because MoonShell is released with the source code, and any team can already implement it in their firmware, but they are not doing it, why I don't know..But he wouldn't get anything by releasing the source of a Sakura!!

And also, if other teams make Sakura firmware, it still wouldn't be anything good, because that would mean that all carts have same firmware, and the main point of GUI is that every cart personalize it and make it more appealing! Not to make all GUIs same!

Supercard was based on an older moonshell and it was slow. Afaik they weren't allowed to use a newer code base because of the author not allowing it (using his source code to sell a commercial product after all). The sakura code is suppose to be based around ROM loading and seems to be more refined for that purpose, so there is a difference between the two codes. People looking at the code could find it more beneficial compared to code that had all traces of ROM loading removed. I don't know what code he wrote for m3, for all we know moonshell v2's code could be better, but it might not have been. Whether it's pointless to see the code depends on the code itself, If you haven't seen the code how can you say that it's pointless? If you have seen it, then I apologize. He didn't gain anything by helping M3 develop sakura either, so why not release it and give permission for other companies to use his code?

'Sakura' firmware is not all about the GUI looks, it's also about media integration.

QUOTEYou didn't catch my full point

I know the point you were trying to make, but you said that "Firmwares don't make profit, actual carts does!", which is quite incorrect.