Ground Zero Mosque. Yes or No?

[Slyakin]

I though the video I posted before would of sorted everything out, but everyone ignored it. And I can see there are quite a few Anti-Islam tempers and I'm not surprised to see there all idiots.

I fucking love that video. It explains everything.

 

[Bri]

1) Sorry, you've lost me. Put it like how now? Simply because they twisted a religion in order to justify their goals doesn't change the fact that it was done in the name of religion.

Perhaps you mis-typed, but here's what you said:

Simply because it would feel like a religion not understanding the concept of how disturbing it is to another person that someone could be twisted enough by a religion, any religion, to massacre thousands of innocent people.

I was pointing out that religions don't tend to twist people to cause them to act a certain way as much as people twist religions to justify their actions. I also suspect that if religion didn't exist, people would justify immoral actions by committing them in the name of something else. If I commit a crime in your name, does that make you responsible?

Alright, I'll go down another route. What's your opinion on the censoring of the South Park episode? Rational or unrational?

South Park chose to censor their own episode. I find their decision inconsistent with the nature of the show considering other topics they've covered in the past, but I guess that's their call and not mine.

All I've stated is that if people are offended, which in my opinion they have every right to be, then they should be allowed to speak out. Well, as long as they're not paranoid right wing propaganda pushing alarmist lunatics like our anti-Islamic poster.

Even our paranoid anti-Islamic poster has a right to his opinion. That said, if someone wants to convince others of their opinion, they might want to present some evidence that their position is rational.

QUOTEFor some it's just feels a little wrong, and feel it would be more respectful just a fraction further away. I'll even join the camping to have it built if someone then opposes it, just not there.

It seems to me that it would only feel "a little" wrong if you're "a little" conflating terrorism and Islam.

QUOTE

I was just going to show an example of how something can be justified with rights yet still be morally wrong. I misunderstood what Bri was getting at though.

Yes, immoral acts can be (and usually are) rationalized by the perpetrator, making them no less immoral. But that's not what we were discussing. We were asking whether your position, which you admitted was irrational, could be the morally right position. I still don't see how it can be morally right if it's irrational.

-Bri

 

[Blood Fetish]

So you know, South Park did not censor their own episode. Comedy Central forced the censorship on them at the last minute.

 

[Bri]

I stand corrected. In that case, a similar comment would hold for Comedy Central, who chose to censor the show. I find their decision inconsistent with the nature of the network considering other topics they've covered in the past on that show and others, but I guess that's their call and not mine.

-Bri

 

[Canonbeat234]

Personally, the Ground Zero Mosque is just a religious figure. The reason I say that so bluntly is because the mosque reminds people about muslims which triggers the thought of 9/11. I find this kind of ironic because when the African Americans were dwelling on slavery they were told that 'it's in the past'. Despite the emotional torment it have caused, no one seem to notice the pain from the other side. Now a religious building is being built NEAR not on, near the site of Ground Zero, the people in New York are now being reminded about those horrid images on that fateful day. When I'll say 'It's in the past'!

You can't have your freedom without sharing its meaning, that Mosque is only going to give people memories of 9/11 when they dwell on it. Others will feel insecure due to the culture shock of a different building they don't see near Manhattan. It's time for NY- America needs to wake up and see the fucking JAVA (Tons of it!). We ARE America!! We stand for tolerance, freedom, and liberty. We need to stop being so close-minded on matters that effects our influence with other cultural backgrounds. We need to start realizing that we already accept Asians, Jamaicans, Europeans, and a few others I can't recite at this moment.

Why not Muslims? They have the same right to live here and express their religion. However, they need to realize that their God is only accepted those who believes in their religion. NOT ALL will except their allah which is the main reason I believe the complaint of the Mosque is the force teachings it can cause.

 

[.Chris]

I say no.

 

[wolffangalchemist]

i'd have to say no.

 

[Pimpmynintendo]

Personally, the Ground Zero Mosque is just a religious figure. The reason I say that so bluntly is because the mosque reminds people about muslims which triggers the thought of 9/11. I find this kind of ironic because when the African Americans were dwelling on slavery they were told that 'it's in the past'. Despite the emotional torment it have caused, no one seem to notice the pain from the other side. Now a religious building is being built NEAR not on, near the site of Ground Zero, the people in New York are now being reminded about those horrid images on that fateful day. When I'll say 'It's in the past'!

You can't have your freedom without sharing its meaning, that Mosque is only going to give people memories of 9/11 when they dwell on it. Others will feel insecure due to the culture shock of a different building they don't see near Manhattan. It's time for NY- America needs to wake up and see the fucking JAVA (Tons of it!). We ARE America!! We stand for tolerance, freedom, and liberty. We need to stop being so close-minded on matters that effects our influence with other cultural backgrounds. We need to start realizing that we already accept Asians, Jamaicans, Europeans, and a few others I can't recite at this moment.

Why not Muslims? They have the same right to live here and express their religion. However, they need to realize that their God is only accepted those who believes in their religion. NOT ALL will except their allah which is the main reason I believe the complaint of the Mosque is the force teachings it can cause.

I always thought the whole african americans dwelling on slavery thing kinda funny considering 2 things. African tribes sold their own people into slavery they weren't taken forcefully. And in the past Africans enslaved jews/caucasians and treated them a lot worse than african american slaves were.

But getting back on topic I would have to say no. At least not yet. Mainly because the attacks were from people who were muslims even though they were fanatics they still were muslim. To me it kind of seems like a "if you believed like us this wouldn't have happened" kind of thing. Now even though I personally say we aren't ready for it, I am not totally against it for one reason, if they have the money to purchase land and build one they can. Now I personally would be totally for it if one thing were to happen. If multiple religious denominations purchased lots in that area and each built their own Ground Zero prayer area and were ok with being right next to each other to be able to pray for better times I personally feel that would be a huge step forward to everybody living with less hate for other religions/ethnicities.

 

[AsPika2219]

I vote NO!

 

[Revolution [9]]

I voted no. Not because I'm against the mosque nor am I a conservative (no offense intended to those who are), but because of the attitude of Americans.
Think about it: a mosque near Ground Zero on the site that was attacked on 9/11. Americans are extremely xenophobic, so regardless of the mosque's (which isn't even a mosque) opposition to terrorism, these Muslims are grouped together in the same category as terrorists. I mean, if brown people are being pulled aside for "random" security checks at the airport, what makes you think that it'll be any different at this mosque? Sooner or later, innocent Muslims will be subject to the biases of these Americans; it could be just jeering or it could escalate to some extremist bombing the area in "response to 9/11". Now, this may be a worst-case scenario, but worst-case scenarios DO happen.

 

[Ferrariman]

When they have a mosque it will make it easier for them to steal our freedom.

 

[Aeladya]

I really don't see a problem. It's not like it's right on top of where the WTC used to be. I can understand why people would be suspicious, and why this would stir up controversy, but I don't honestly see a problem with it. Worse things could be built there honestly. That's like when you have a loved one who was killed by cancer and you're boycotting doctors because they couldn't cure them (my grandmother died of cancer). If it was built right on it then I would have to disagree, but since it's only near it, I don't think it should be that big of a deal. Besides that I have to agree granville. It's dumb to judge an entire religion based on some stupid fucks. That would be like me blaming all Christian's for everything that the Westboro Baptist Church does. I'm not going to blame an entire religion based on some crazy stupid idiots, I'm going to blame the individuals responsible.

 

[duhizy]

hey guys im muslim and im an engineer that lives in canada and iv got 4 years of unversity physics behind my back when i say that its is physically IIMMMPPOOOSSSIBBBLLLEEE for the towers to fall from a plane of its weight and the amount of jet fuel would not have been enough to do bearly anything except cause a fire on the floors near were the planes hit and if the tower were to fall not all of it would fall and it would fall to the side not straight down. a good example would be to try to playing jangaa and imagine removing one of the blocks from the side like what the planes did when they hit, the parts from were you took the piece out and above woul come tumbollingdown side ways however the bottom parts would be alright. this is just a good example and best part is that the twin towers were build so that they wouldn't fall at all lol isn't that interesting. it gets even better because owsama binladin was a pakistany and his whole family was rich and they eventually got to know the bush family because of it and the entire binladin family with a few known exeptions were all atheist lol muslim extremists my ass bush is retarded for thinking that this would bekeep a secret so hows that for prooof of consperacy. dont build a mosque because they would get to much hate and they would probabliy get attacked by the people but other than that they have the right to do what they want to do

 

[Blood Fetish]

a good example would be to try to playing jangaa and imagine removing one of the blocks from the side like what the planes did when they hit, the parts from were you took the piece out and above woul come tumbollingdown side ways however the bottom parts would be alright.

Let me ensure I am clear on this. You claim to be an engineer and are comparing the structural integrity of two 400 meter towers to that of a game of Jenga?

 

[Pimpmynintendo]

hey guys im muslim and im an engineer that lives in canada and iv got 4 years of unversity physics behind my back when i say that its is physically IIMMMPPOOOSSSIBBBLLLEEE for the towers to fall from a plane of its weight and the amount of jet fuel would not have been enough to do bearly anything except cause a fire on the floors near were the planes hit and if the tower were to fall not all of it would fall and it would fall to the side not straight down. a good example would be to try to playing jangaa and imagine removing one of the blocks from the side like what the planes did when they hit, the parts from were you took the piece out and above woul come tumbollingdown side ways however the bottom parts would be alright. this is just a good example and best part is that the twin towers were build so that they wouldn't fall at all lol isn't that interesting. it gets even better because owsama binladin was a pakistany and his whole family was rich and they eventually got to know the bush family because of it and the entire binladin family with a few known exeptions were all atheist lol muslim extremists my ass bush is retarded for thinking that this would bekeep a secret so hows that for prooof of consperacy. dont build a mosque because they would get to much hate and they would probabliy get attacked by the people but other than that they have the right to do what they want to do

this is one of the most idiotic posts i have seen in awhile. If this isn't supposed to be a joke, how come you can't even spell university? And if it is supposed to be a joke you should get the hell out of this topic instead of making fun of things people take seriously.

 

[ChuckBartowski]

I am not promoting it in any way, but i feel that they have the right to put it wherever they want. And that people who see it as a problem are ignorant. I think it is meant to mend, not hurt. Plus theres the fact that there is a strip club closer to the site than this will be. And they have plans to put a Mall in the ground where thousands of people died, and some may still be buried. Those two things are more offensive than the mosque in my opinion.

 

[monkat]

Isn't it like...not even a mosque? On like...private property? Like...two blocks away?

...who cares?

 

[Clookster]

Yes. So they can't destroy it another time.

 

[Clookster]

That's the best R4 ever:

http://www.r4i-fifa.com/

 

[BlueStar]

Out of interest, how far away from Claudy should there be a ban on Catholic Churches?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11064647