Hacking '3x' drive speed.

[Saladman]

'bushing boys' like jacobian, never wanted a backup loader and have always scorned Waninkoko at every opportunity. They have claimed he has no coding skills and claim that everything he has put out is actually their work.

These people have their fingers in a few pies no doubt and will do anything to stop a software based backup loader. They claim Waninkoko software has bricked peoples wii's and use illogical arguments to prove their case.. see downgrader debical, just because the tools needed were not in one they actually will try and tell you that his software 'DOES' brick your wii. Anyone with an ounce of honesty and has followed the wii scene can tell you that the only 'bricking' cases were a result in fact of the 'bushing boy' brigrade, but amazingly Waninkoko's downgrader gets the blame. These people (ugh) have manged to convince themselves and try to convince others of Waninkoko inabilties all the time and will even LIE point blank to your face.

GBAtempers grow a set of 'BALLS' and stop these jokers, they will never give you a backup loader. Make 'bushing boy' a term credited to all Waninkoko haters and chase them from the forum.

If these jokers are told to go away after everyone of their posts they will eventually, one man cannot do alone though.... so grow some BALLS.

 

[djtaz]

Isnt it more dependant on how the firmware is stored ? If someone manages (though yes unlikely) to manipulate the firmware then the drive speed would once again be set back to its natural limits - the hardware is capable of it , its limited by the firmware , which is in effect a program (though usually hard coded)
The issue is with the firmware (which is software in a different form) and not the drive itself - this is a software issue and not a hardware one.

 

[Jacobeian]

no because the only way to manipulate the drive firmware is by using a hardware modifiction, aka a modchip
so litteraly yes, firmware is software but this is a hardware limitation

@saladman: I'm so sorry to hurt the image of your beloved, I won't do that again

 

[CMac1988]

First of all, Waninkoko is still working on the backup loader. He recently stated that his current version has much, much better compatibility. Still I wouldn't hold my breath for a release, if there ever is one.

Secondly, don't expect a workaround on the 3x drive speed soon. In fact, don't expect one at all, it is neither Waninkokos nor the DVDx's team fault. The reason this backup loader was possible in the first place is that the Wii's disc drive has a mode for reading non-original-Wii discs: DVD-Rs, to be precise. This mode is fixed at 3x speed by the drive's firmware. This mode is used by waninkokos cIOS to start Wii game data from a DVD-R. "Fixing" the problem means finding a way to alter the drive's firmware and it's functioning without a modchip - Which, far as I understand, is impossible.

No, if I were you, I'd keep an eye out for coders to crack Nintendos speed-cap on the USB-ports. The Wii has USB 2.0 ports, which would be fast enough to stream game ISOs to the backup loader. In fact, the speed of USB 2.0 could even decrease loading times. But Nintendo, clever as they are, limit the USB transfer rate to USB 1.1, which is even slower than the 3x DVD-R reading, even though the ports could potentially work faster. From what I've read, getting the console to use full USB 2.0 speed is seen as "more realistic" goal by coders than working around the 3x speed limitation of DVDx.

USB 2.0 would be Nintendo's nightmare, as it would enable the easy, simple and fast booting of game backups from any USB drive (put all your backups on a hdd, plug it into the console and never swap discs again), so I expect it to be difficult. But as far as I know, it is not regarded as impossible.

Edit : Streaming via ethernet cable is also an option that would improve the 3x speed limitations, and should theoretically be possible.

Bril, cheers for clearing that up. Not sure if it was your post but i seen a post in another thread regarding the speeds that were capable from different methods ie. USB 2.0 w/ USB HD, SD, 3x limitation DVD Drive etc..

Through the network, similiar to how the Phantasy Star Online hack worked for the Gamecube. I take it the ethernet adapter for the Wii is 100Mbit? Wouldn't it also be possible to stream games across wireless then? Although you'd most likely need to have a 125, or n1 transfer speed?

All in all, hopefully some1 is able to bypass the 3x limitation. Even a method similiar to the 360's patching of the drive would be pretty neat, just dont tell my sis if it ever happens...

 

[djdynamite123]

i really do hope they don't crack the backup loader, i mean every forum, its nothing but questions on why, how and ohhhhhh discs keep failing, what a waste, well do us all a favour and go get a cheap modchip, i mean mines basicly the first chip to come out, as ive had my wii since it came out, never done me no harm, if you complain about backup loaders speed, either get a chip or "put up with it and shut up". correct?

 

[MeowMix]

The Wii's DVD Firmware can be changed, but its Most likely really hard, However If Waninkoko code some 2.0 USB drivers, we could have like, 10x speed isos, even more possibly! imagine that hardly any loading times.

 

[CMac1988]

Isnt it more dependant on how the firmware is stored ? If someone manages (though yes unlikely) to manipulate the firmware then the drive speed would once again be set back to its natural limits - the hardware is capable of it , its limited by the firmware , which is in effect a program (though usually hard coded)
The issue is with the firmware (which is software in a different form) and not the drive itself - this is a software issue and not a hardware one.

QUOTE(Jacobeian @ Oct 2 2008, 05:41 PM) no because the only way to manipulate the drive firmware is by using a hardware modifiction, aka a modchip
so litteraly yes, firmware is software but this is a hardware limitation

@saladman: I'm so sorry to hurt the image of your beloved, I won't do that again

lol, techinically its a bit of both. djtaz is right in saying that it is a software limitation, as anything that is coded (in this case the firmware) is regarded software. Albeit this piece of software is what is causing the limitation itslef, and the firmware is needed in order for the hardware to work, tus citing it as also being a hardware issue...

Actually im starting to confuse myself thinking of a better way to out this across so i give up, lol. So if this doesnt make sense then ignore it

 

[MeowMix]

USB 1.1 - rate of 12 Mbit/s (1.5 MB/s)
USB 2.0 - High-Speed (2.0) rate of 480 Mbit/s (60 MB/s).

Now you people see the difference? 1.5mbps (1.1usb) vs 60mbps (2.0) the wii usb ports are 2.0 due to a driver its limited to 1.1.. cmon waninkoko or wiigater make a 2.0 driver =]

 

[Kaer]

Bril, cheers for clearing that up. Not sure if it was your post but i seen a post in another thread regarding the speeds that were capable from different methods ie. USB 2.0 w/ USB HD, SD, 3x limitation DVD Drive etc..

Through the network, similiar to how the Phantasy Star Online hack worked for the Gamecube. I take it the ethernet adapter for the Wii is 100Mbit? Wouldn't it also be possible to stream games across wireless then? Although you'd most likely need to have a 125, or n1 transfer speed?

All in all, hopefully some1 is able to bypass the 3x limitation. Even a method similiar to the 360's patching of the drive would be pretty neat, just dont tell my sis if it ever happens...

You could technically with wireless, but there wouldn't be that much difference in speed if not slower when compared to current backup loaders. I'll assume the Wii has your typical 54mbps G wireless card. Now in an OPTIMAL environment (meaning minimum interference) you'll get a Max of 3 Megabytes per second speed in a G network. Now most setups will never see this kinda speed unless you upgrade to N networks (I once saw it go up to 7.5MBps), but the Wii doesn't do N so you can throw that out the window right now.

So...

LAN 100Mbps: MAX 12MBps
Wireless: MAX 3MBps
DVD 3x: ~4MBps

Better off using LAN if you're going the network route.

 

[denzil]

I know I shouldn't ...

These people have their fingers in a few pies no doubt and will do anything to stop a software based backup loader.
Please note that there is a distinct difference between "doing nothing to further piracy" and "doing something to prevent piracy" (let alone "do anything"). You sound as if Bushing, Team Twiizers and all their supporters are dedicated to only one cause: To stop Waninkoko from making his software and making your life miserable. That is a bit paranoid, don't you think? If, as you say, Waninkoko is the coder he is, he is certainly not dependent on what Team Twiizers would be withholding from him, right?

They claim Waninkoko software has bricked peoples wii's and use illogical arguments
Marcan, besides bushing one of the few people actually having reverse engineered a large part of the boot process, has explained in great detail what exactly the dangers are. Explain how these are "illogical arguments", please.

to prove their case.. see downgrader debical (...) the only 'bricking' cases were a result in fact of the 'bushing boy' brigrade
Check the forums and the blogs especially after the announcement of SaveMii, there are quite a few incidents of bricked Wiis after using that "downgrader" software. The only reasonable explanation is that they have only been silent until then.

QUOTEthey will never give you a backup loader.

That is actually true. "They" will, however, also not do anything to stop a backup loader.

QUOTE

Make 'bushing boy' a term credited to all Waninkoko haters and chase them from the forum.

You're using the pseudonym of one of the people who gave you Wii homebrew in the first place as a deprecatory term? Really?

 

[djtaz]

lol, techinically its a bit of both. djtaz is right in saying that it is a software limitation, as anything that is coded (in this case the firmware) is regarded software. Albeit this piece of software is what is causing the limitation itslef, and the firmware is needed in order for the hardware to work, tus citing it as also being a hardware issue...

Im still adament that this is a software issue.

You could theoretically extract the update files (firmware) from the Newest Nintendo Game from your region and obviously someone who knows what they are doing , would be able to examine the firmware update.
If they know the system well they would be able to manipulate this firmware to remove the speed block on the dvd drive, then re-create the update files and flash them manually with the WAD installer.

Its all possible in theory , and firmware is software that limits the hardware , but it is still a software issue that can in theory be overcome.

 

[teq]

Thought I'd come by to clarify:


+ 3x speed is not a limitation, but a default for the Wii drive. The speed is variable from 3x to 6x and can be set via software.

+ Neither DVDx, nor the Custom DIP set the register that controls the drive speed, thus it remains default.

+ The Wii DVD drive does not have writable firmware.

+ Bushing and anyone associated with him took no part in Waninkoko's loader being leaked. If anyone should be blamed, it should be users from GBATemp, such as samsam12, who created threads and mirrors for the loader.


Now, in regard to the influx of users who appear to have fouled the forums with finger pointing, rumors, and downright stupid ignorance, I suggest you choose your words wisely from now on. It's not appreciated when you people spout nonsense -- of which you've simply pulled from your asses -- and state it as common law.

Either put up or shut up; continuing to do neither will simply earn you a corner and monogrammed dunce hat.

 

[djdynamite123]

teq i like the way you kept my quote at the end of your reply!

"Put up, and shut up" lol


well to be honest its true, none stop moaning regarding the 2 loaders, good grief save yourself trouble and get a chip, and stop with the questions on backup loader if your not happy.

 

[FGOD]

Thought I'd come by to clarify:


+ 3x speed is not a limitation, but a default for the Wii drive. The speed is variable from 3x to 6x and can be set via software.

+ Neither DVDx, nor the Custom DIP set the register that controls the drive speed, thus it remains default.

+ The Wii DVD drive does not have writable firmware.

+ Bushing and anyone associated with him took no part in Waninkoko's loader being leaked. If anyone should be blamed, it should be users from GBATemp, such as samsam12, who created threads and mirrors for the loader.


Now, in regard to the influx of users who appear to have fouled the forums with finger pointing, rumors, and downright stupid ignorance, I suggest you choose your words wisely from now on. It's not appreciated when you people spout nonsense -- of which you've simply pulled from your asses -- and state it as common law.

Either put up or shut up; continuing to do neither will simply earn you a corner and monogrammed dunce hat.

yes indead, but as bushing quoted, the dvdx is limited to 3x becuase it is not set to read faster. cause it was only made for dvd video...

 

[MeowMix]

dont you guys ever think that Bushing and crew must have set 3x limit to stop piracy a tad bit but to keep DVD Video play back, released the DVDLIB and then said its not possible for 6x? while they keep all the goodies of 6x? I mean Bushing and crew made Mplayer DVDLIB Edition Beta, and said they were gunna update it, but they didnt because to remove most bugs they'd have to up the limit a tad bit, which would influence piracy.

 

[djtaz]

+ 3x speed is not a limitation, but a default for the Wii drive. The speed is variable from 3x to 6x and can be set via software.

Are you saying that if the software set the register that controls the speed that the specific software would work at 6 speed ?

 

[MeowMix]

+ 3x speed is not a limitation, but a default for the Wii drive. The speed is variable from 3x to 6x and can be set via software.

Are you saying that if the software set the register that controls the speed that the specific software would work at 6 speed ?

Well Im not teq, but thats exactly what hes saying. Lets test this out.. who knows c++? Do some registering to 6x code (lol im such a newb) and implent into snes9x DVD version, then if it works we'll put it into wiigaters source mwuaahahahah then after that get a iron and iron the bugs.

 

[FGOD]

if it would be that simple it would already been done...

 

[CMac1988]

So what were now getting at, is that it is more than likely possible to get the software to run the drive read speed at 6x, but that bushing, and his group may have kept a lid on it to try and prevent piracy?

Incase you haven't noticed im new to the Wii scene, but i can see theres alot of people against the loaders/launchers, and also alot for them. This is understandable as piracy is a key component to making and breaking a console. Just look how many games developers have jumped ship from the PSP, and how the dreamcast fell despite its popularity (All incourse due to homebrew, that eventually led to piracy, Oooh and font listen to that Peter Moore saying crap like he 'personally pulled the plug on it').

This place is for discussing the latest hacks, software, chips etc. not a place to flame on each other. Let the dev's worry about what they thinks best, and try and keep the bashing to a minimum. Means i dont have to read through pages of crap to come across something positive, and productive.

Cheers.

 

[MeowMix]

if it would be that simple it would already been done...

Im just saying we may as well try it out, if not then its a DVDX Problem. All we can do then is make a new DVDX but we need to find the exploit, so decompilation?