I think some people want to be able to have it in case he doesn't decide to release it, or in case he releases the exploit but the Dashlaunch build doesn't surface.
Is he even aware of the leak drama? I don't think Ryan has a Discord account in the first place. Or if he does, he only uses it for private communication (at least as private as you can be when it comes with a Western social media service owned by billionares) instead of interacting with Discord server communities.
I don't even think he cares about this forum. The only social media he has publically posted to the internet are his Twitter/X account, his YouTube channel, and the Gmail address on his GitHub profile. That's literally it. Unless GitHub also counts as a social media.
Last edited by Nadaman,
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He's likely aware but hasn't spoken about it yet. Seems that Twitter is his form of communication afaik and he's nowhere on Discord (unless within a private circle).
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I somehow missed this despite following Grim's stuff. Wicked! It's also great how a 360 with a HDD with no mods applied (or corrupted) but with NAND mods applied should still boot, otherwise it would feel pretty rough. And it's good to see how HDD mods don't interfere with unmodded system compatibility.
About dismissing stealth servers though, WTF?! It feels like Xbox Live on 360 will soon be no longer, why waste the opportunity to use it while it's alive? (I get that Xbox seems eager to keep the 360 alive with emulation, but I wouldn't be surprised if Live doesn't make it...) And the cheating argument is pretty lame, as while having a modded system enables cheating, not everyone cheats; modding/jailbreaking is supposed to liberate the system to the furthest extent possible, not enforce its own restrictions directly or otherwise.
Even though hard modding is less straightforward in comparison (the goddamn clips!), RGH 3.0 made the process so much easier a few years back, I think it's still more than justified to use it. Microscope is preferred, though.
About dismissing stealth servers though, WTF?! It feels like Xbox Live on 360 will soon be no longer, why waste the opportunity to use it while it's alive? (I get that Xbox seems eager to keep the 360 alive with emulation, but I wouldn't be surprised if Live doesn't make it...) And the cheating argument is pretty lame, as while having a modded system enables cheating, not everyone cheats; modding/jailbreaking is supposed to liberate the system to the furthest extent possible, not enforce its own restrictions directly or otherwise.
Even though hard modding is less straightforward in comparison (the goddamn clips!), RGH 3.0 made the process so much easier a few years back, I think it's still more than justified to use it. Microscope is preferred, though.
Also Microsoft is way more aggressive when it comes to banning than anyone else really. They don't differentiate from Homebrew, cheating, or piracy. So Grim dismissing Stealth servers is just plain stupid and also in extremely bad faith. I'm glad someone chose to leak modified builds of his software with DashLaunch support. I only hope those builds don't become lost due to people being unwilling to share them outside of discord
.I've always felt that opinionated developers gatekeeping based on their own wrong ideas about ethics and morality was shitty and terrible. In the past though we've just had to accept it, sometimes even hold our tongues. Like it or not Homebrew was been driven by people with sacred knowledge (that they very often won't freely share) and skills and if they say no or just quit that's the end of that. Anyone else are just people with ideas and motivation with no ability to do anything.
I'm so glad that has changed with AI. That's part of what made me warm up to AI more. The fact that anyone can create anything. Even if elite developers hate it or try to stop it. I don't have respect for said elitist devs because they often have shitty morals which don't align with the good of the community.
Also Microsoft is way more aggressive when it comes to banning than anyone else really. They don't differentiate from Homebrew, cheating, or piracy. So Grim dismissing Stealth servers is just plain stupid and also in extremely bad faith. I'm glad someone chose to leak modified builds of his software with DashLaunch support. I only hope those builds don't become lost due to people being unwilling to share them outside of discord
I've always felt that opinionated developers gatekeeping based on their own wrong ideas about ethics and morality was shitty and terrible. In the past though we've just had to accept it, sometimes even hold our tongues. Like it or not Homebrew was been driven by people with sacred knowledge (that they very often won't freely share) and skills and if they say no or just quit that's the end of that. Anyone else are just people with ideas and motivation with no ability to do anything.
I'm so glad that has changed with AI. That's part of what made me warm up to AI more. The fact that anyone can create anything. Even if elite developers hate it or try to stop it. I don't have respect for said elitist devs because they often have shitty morals which don't align with the good of the community.
You realize that he literally explained why DashLaunch isn't compatible with his softmod in the video right? I mean, all this memory address conflict shenigans can literally be observed just by trying to have a stealth server and Aurora's Nova plugin active at the same time. Every single Xbox 360 developer I've spoken to agrees that not supporting DashLaunch or Aurora's Nova is a reasonable decision because of how many memory address conflicts could exist.
Would you rather have your end user experience be an RNG dice roll as to if it crashes or not just to have DashLaunch enabled? When basically every other base DashLaunch feature (such as ping patch, region spoof, liveblock, etc.) is already integrated in his kernel patcher? It's not hard for stealth developers to make alternative methods of booting their stealth service anyway; the ideas of doing so have already been tossed around for the past few months. Even FreeMyXe recently got its own plugin support that isn't reliant on DashLaunch, which proves that all this DashLaunch drama is utterly useless.
Everyone getting their undies in a wad (so to speak) over a 15-20 second segment in a YouTube video about a developer's opinion on how his software should operate, software he (a single individual) worked hard on for the past year and a half to deliver a flawless end user experience, AND is releasing to the public for free, is extremely silly and entitled. I've also literally never seen anyone parroting this opinion who's also familar with Xbox 360 software development in the first place. Or heck, ANY previous software development experience. You're not exactly helping his case on stealth server communities when you also act salty about it not supporting DashLaunch. I wouldn't even be suprised if he just sent a softmod update to these people that just bricks their console CPU's fuseline 0 at this point; I'd probably do the same.
(That last sentence was a joke, just to be clear)
BTW, we now have confirmation that Ryan knows about the leak shananigans:
Personally, I just wanna see the all the bingo chart answers
Post automatically merged:
In all honesty, I didn't find your take (along with some of the others in this thread) to be much different than most of the other people I've encountered (like in the Discord example I sent) who seem to have some sort of extreme vandetta against Grimdoomer. So that's why I shared that Discord exchange.
Last edited by Nadaman,
Leaking unfinished stuff ruined the completion of sonic megamix.
Last edited by Vetus_Mundi,
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So because I think pretentious moral grandstanding is stupid, I have an "extreme vendetta"?
This is a thread where we talk about PeerPressure. I am here to talk about PeerPressure, and I justified my opinion. I didn't make it personal.
Nice strawman.
The post is complaining about the anti-"cheating" stance I mentioned above, all he did was say he is glad there is a version with DashLaunch plugin support now because of this. You don't need to talk down to him like a child for wanting DashLaunch compatibility. Most of these board members are not software engineers.
We have a right to express an opinion in the appropriate venues to do so. It is not "entitled", nobody is demanding anything from him, we are being critical. We do not like PeerPressure and we will not use it, simple, Grim is not entitled to us as users. You're the one getting argumentative for literally no fucking reason here, and
I have programming experience. It takes two seconds to find this out. Look at my previous posts and my bio links. What you won't find mentioned is my husband did reverse engineering as a hobby. I have, and know people who have, the capacity to discuss this at length.
Go be a white knight somewhere else.
Last edited by bonkmaykr,
NGL, I actually strongly agree with you here. This is part why I'm one of the major ConsoleMods contributors; having valuable information/discourse about technical stuff being locked away in what are effectively gated communites that are impossible to index on the World Wide Web™ is simply not good for information preservation. Stuff on Discord can often come and go for various resons. Old school IRC chat rooms had/still have the same problem.
A lot of my recent edits have been to make a lot of info that was originally only known in Discord communites more publically visible, such as ExShadowBoot, ASM1061 SATA cards being able to flash Xbox 360 DVD drives, or 1 GB RAM upgrade being possible on the Barracuda (Winchester) motherboard (which is also a pretty spicy topic for a new forum post here)
All of that stuff was even discovered/implemented by the same guy too.
Of course, Discord servers also have their downsides, such as propigating drama like Peer Pressure's leaked beta build situation. Or even worse, like it being used for mass grooming. But that's an entirely different can of worms anyway.
I'll admit that including you and the others as an example of people who genuinely despite Grimdoomer just for his stealth server opinions was uncalled for, and I genuinely apologize for doing so. You don't want to become the very thing you seek to destroy afterall.
I'm just befuddled that a large amount of users seem to think not including this one feature makes the entire project as a whole a worthless waste of everyone's time and everyone should either cope with Bad Update/ABadAvatar or shell out the dough for building/buying an RGH console, which realistically doesn't have many benefits that most care about anymore (either because RGH exclusive features were made possible on a Bad Update setup with workarounds, or have obvious theoretical methods that can easily be develped, but just happen to not have an actual end user implementation at the moment). Except booting stealth servers with existing end user knowledge
The kernel patcher that Grim developed to complement the HDD softmod (which is the bit that doesn't have DashLaunch integration) is the only reason why plugins aren't supported. It also has an entirely different & new codebase compared to the Freeboot patches that everyone is already used to with RGH/JTAG/FreeMyXe/XeUnshackle, and for good reason. But there's absolutely nothing stopping any halfway competent developer from just porting FreeMyXe or XeUnshackle to boot from the exploit either. Heck, the original Bad Update release was effectively just a PoC Nyan Cat launcher. Kernel patcher apps that could complement Bad Update had to be developed & released by others.
It's not like I even fully agree with the statement that Grimdoomer made in the latest announcement video if I take what he said at face value. While I do think the majority of the stealth servers are sketchy and hosted by weirdos, I know for a fact servers like Proto are developed by competent folk who don't bother to do sketchy stuff with their stealth server client. One of the Proto developers is even the creator of the Halo 3/Reach Sunrise client. I've heard similar positive sentiment about ReLive & xblGhost as well, though I don't have any personal experience with those servers or their communities.
I just don't think this discourse about what he said in a 20 second clip warrants such outrage I've personally witnessed. That's all. But that's the internet for you.
Last edited by Nadaman,
Has anyone thought about trying to find an exploit to run BadUpdate via the usb update ($SystemUpdate) on system start to trigger the exploit?
Last edited by Vetus_Mundi,
I haven't tried the leaked build so I can't speak on that aspect but I think that pivoting towards the memory address reasoning when we were all talking about his stance that Stealth server users are all cheaters trying to steal a paid service. So what you're doing is deflecting with a Red herring. Nice. The pinnacle of all good faith discussion.
I mean we don't need to prove ourselves to him. It's clear he's made up his mind. People are right to be upset when he slandered a huge chunk of the community on his public platform.
Ultimately it doesn't matter what choices he makes with his own software. We have AI and motivated people in the community. People will copy his work and do what he refuses.
I hope he does. He'll hose whatever respect he still has with the others who are cheering him on. That's graduating from respected Homebrew dev to malware author. It's likely people wouldn't trust him again after that. I know I won't trust you, I'd have to be stupid to trust you after admitting something like that publicly...
Post automatically merged:
Them. I go by they/them. It's okay. I don't expect people to understand. I hold nothing against you for that. I don't exactly say it publicly anywhere. GBAtemp doesn't have pronoun badges. It does sting though.
I find it telling that they are claiming people are being entitled for being upset and wanting someone else to fork it or remake it with AI. That's extremely entitled. You don't get to decide what the Homebrew scene does with a concept, and you certainly can't make people use specific software from a specific dev. I've found a lot of entitled Homebrew devs in the scene spit and cry because people work on stuff they dislike.
Last edited by Dragon91Nippon,
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he's sortta not wrong though it's like companies calling ALL softmod users Pirates (even if the majority are some are not)
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Also Microsoft is way more aggressive when it comes to banning than anyone else really. They don't differentiate from Homebrew, cheating, or piracy. So Grim dismissing Stealth servers is just plain stupid and also in extremely bad faith. I'm glad someone chose to leak modified builds of his software with DashLaunch support. I only hope those builds don't become lost due to people being unwilling to share them outside of discord
I've always felt that opinionated developers gatekeeping based on their own wrong ideas about ethics and morality was shitty and terrible. In the past though we've just had to accept it, sometimes even hold our tongues. Like it or not Homebrew was been driven by people with sacred knowledge (that they very often won't freely share) and skills and if they say no or just quit that's the end of that. Anyone else are just people with ideas and motivation with no ability to do anything.
I'm so glad that has changed with AI. That's part of what made me warm up to AI more. The fact that anyone can create anything. Even if elite developers hate it or try to stop it. I don't have respect for said elitist devs because they often have shitty morals which don't align with the good of the community.
I really shouldn't be engaging in conversation like this, but it's hard to accept that people like you are the new normal for mod scenes and are the reason why developers such as Grim, TheFl0w, and others want nothing to do with modern "scenes". I'll apologize in advance to the moderators for my tone, but I can't believe what I'm reading.
Microsoft is aggressive when it comes to banning because they can detect modified consoles. What do you think the hypervisor and kernel patches to unlock "homebrew" do? Spoiler: they are the same patches as those required to enable piracy and cheating. Are you actually so dumb to think that they would care to differentiate between a console "running homebrew" or not, or that they can even do so? Of course they aggressively ban! Nintendo aggressively bans! Everyone who can reliably detect modified consoles aggresively ban.
The Xbox scene is almost unique with how idiots like you have overwhelmed the scene and MUST use stealth servers to enjoy a """homebrew""" experience.
The only person who actually cared to create anything extensible for the platform was [cOz] and friends creating dashlaunch and other tools. What did people do with it? Stealth servers!
Yeah bro you REALLY need a stealth server for your custom dashboards and mod menus and all that stuff.
Some independent trainers exist but nobody cared. They just want a stealth server to provide them with the all-in-one package because they need their hands held. They aren't patient enough to read some guides on how to run a tool, or change a config file to load the trainer, or patch the binary.
These things SHOULDN'T be necessary today. There has been more than enough time for a true homebrew scene for the Xbox 360 to flourish. But unfortunately to the masses, homebrew = stealth servers. Nobody has cared to actually adopt and use a non-proprietary SDK, or make the system use actual homebrew.
Nah, we'll just continue using stuff that's technically illegal to redistribute and poisons homebrew software from the proprietary SDK like Xbox Neighborhood, its janky ass old version of MSVC, XBDM from dev kits, etc.
17 years after the release of the JTAG hack and libxenon (which to my knowledge, nobody in the """homebrew""" space uses)/dashlaunch are basically the only true hombrew foundational software that exist while Aurora/FSD/Xexmenu and emulators are the only "homebrew apps".
That is so wrong and disgusting that people like you really do not deserve the work Ryan's put into this. 2 years ago people didn't even believe a softmod for the Xbox was possible. At this point you can run BadAvatar with near instant exploit times to and do whatever you want. But being angry and entitled about a free softmod that has occupied almost 2 years of his work because... oh no, you can't run a stealth server because the design of dashlaunch is subpar for what Ryan wants out of his vision of a framework for his softmod.
To your point, AI has lowered the barriers substantially and still all I've seen people create are custom piracy stores and port decompilation projects of games from other platforms. Lol. Incredible """homebrew""". You aren't happy with these things? Go use AI to build your own softmod framework. You won't though, it's just easier to bitch and moan on the internet about how you aren't smart enough to do it and are instead shackled to your consoomer """homebrew""".
Beyond the architectual issues with dashlaunch and stealing of Xbox LIVE, think critically about the value stealth servers provide and why people like myself think it's disgusting that THAT is what the """homebrew""" scene has steered towards. It's a disgrace.
Never said I thought they would personally care about the difference and I find it weird that other Platforms like PS3 don't have the same level of aggression when it comes to Homebrew outside of cheating. Same with Nintendo. Which by the way. If you don't pirate games (including use of forwarders) or cheat online you don't get banned.
People want to play games online and have full online functionality. That is reasonable. Maybe these won't be needed when MS shuts down 360 Xbox live and custom servers are created. It is now though.
I'm sure you have many reasons why playing online while using Homebrew is evil or wrong like Grim does and frankly I don't care about your opinion. It's not like you can do anything to stop people from using them to play online.
Funny since you spent the first paragraph explaining how Microsoft bans people for mods that they can detect yet are now dismissing the need for Stealth servers on modded systems?
No they shouldn't, maybe they will become fully obsolete when MS kills live on the 360 and the community has to step in
Intelectual property is a toxic ideology and the fact that you're acting morally superior about it is reprehensible. No respect for that.
If he didn't want to release it he shouldn't have and he'd be spitting and crying that some LLM kiddie implemented it with AI later on because he didn't have the ability to deny people that.
And for the record Ryan can do whatever the fuck he wants but people can also fork and change it whether he likes it or not. You're learning the part about Homebrew that control freaks really hate.
So... you're upset people are doing things you hate with Homebrew. In other news the sky is blue.
Are you a troll or using an alt to avoid being banned? You just joined today to reply to this thread. It's more than a little suspicious.
I don't know what you're trying to do. It seems like you're pretending to be Ryan's alt by claiming people are stealing Xbox live. Something he said in the video. I'm not falling for it. I've seen people create accounts pretending to be others before. Maybe you're not even trying to do that but it seriously seems sus that someone would join today and reply to this thread with a response like this. Makes me think you've been active here before.
I have thought a lot about why people like you find people playing online on Homebrewed systems or porting games disgusting. I used to be surrounded by people like you. Their main reasons are either just being brainwashed (which isn't an excuse but some people are more understanding towards them), or sharing the same corporate interests as the elites who push this pro-corporate moral worldview. Which is why many are so inflammatory towards people who pirate games. I would say you, Grim, theflow, and others in the west are a lite version of that. Drawing the line at piracy but not what they view as "Homebrew", which is really unlicensed code you aren't sanctioned to run by the company. A lot of people in Japan are more extreme and consider Homebrew and piracy to be one in the same. I don't have respect for either of these camps though. It's a pro-corporate moral worldview.
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