Hacking Discussion I'm on 3.0.2: spare thoughts about updating to 5.1.0

[Nicola]

The situation is still confusing.
-If i update with choidujorenx (without burning any fuses) and play online, is there any chance of getting banned?
-For a future, hypothetical, EmuNAND, does your current official FW version even matter if you can run Fusee Gelee?
-Can Fusee Gelee overwrite the FW to boot into CFW without needing a jig at every boot?
-Assuming a CFW that loads backup games is not possible (it is, but assuming it is not), could Fusee Gelee do everything a warm boot exploit do from within the Switch OS? For example on PS3 you could mount (and run) backup games from OFW, but you needed a way of triggering it, my question is: does Fusee Gelee have the same amount of "access" to the Switch OS than a warm boot exploit would have? I would think a warm boot exploit from the Switch OS is more likely to be able to modify the Switch OS in real time than Fusee Gelee, that is run before the OS.
-Given the history of game console hacking, i don't think there will ever be much point in downgrading if you can run Fusee Gelee, especially because newer games will require new FW version. This is especially true if there will be EmuNAND like on the 3DS, which allows you to play original games online, while still being able to boot into CFW and play backups offline.
-Just like you can update without burning fuses now, i guess in the future, if needed, old edited FW version will be releases with a change in the number of burned fuses they require to run.

 

[Draxzelex]

Really, making a new thread because someone did respond in a half hour seems a bit uncalled for but I already responded to this so I'll just copy and paste my response from there.

• Yes as with any and all hacks however your chances of getting banned due to this are monumentally lessened if you don't pirate any games
• If you wish to use an exploit that is not Fusee Gelee (such as Jamais/Deja Vu), then yes. Otherwise, you can use EmuNAND to keep all of your hacking separate from your online activities
• AutoRCM removes the need for a jig. An internal trinket or external dongle/modchip can remove the need for sending a payload
• Theoretically warmboothax and coldboothax can have access to the same level of privileges but due to the nature of how they are executed, coldboot is objectively superior. The differences between coldboothax and warmboothax come down to the level of execution. In the case of the Switch, for coldboot we need to enter RCM via shorting pin 10 then send a payload via USB connection. For warmboot, it would involve opening a webpage.
• Well thanks to Fusee Gelee, we can downgrade because the fuses prevent us from downgrading in the first place but Fusee Gelee happens before the fuse check
• This is impossible without physically modifying the console

 

[Nicola]

Yeah you are right i'm sorry, though i thought it might actually be interesting for people since that it's still hard to find a single place with all the info you need and you need to browse 500 pages to gather all the data.

 

[Nicola]

Really, making a new thread because someone did respond in a half hour seems a bit uncalled for but I already responded to this so I'll just copy and paste my response from there.

Downgrading would be possible with Fusee Gelee, but if you did, you won't be able to boot your switch (because of the fuses check) unless you run a CFW by starting with Fusee Gelee every time, which defeats the purpose of downgrading.

 

[Draxzelex]

Downgrading would be possible with Fusee Gelee, but if you did, you won't be able to boot your switch (because of the fuses check) unless you run a CFW by starting with Fusee Gelee every time, which defeats the purpose of downgrading.

You're assuming that you updated by burning fuses. In fact, thanks to Fusee Gelee, we can not only update without burning fuses but downgrade without having to use RCM afterwards. Downgrading is only meaningless if you have more burnt fuses than the firmware you are downgrading to.

 

[Nicola]

Yes but i won't upgrade without burning fuses as the only point in upgrading would be to play online, and as of now we don't know if Nintendo can ban you for not having the correct amount of fuses burnt.

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I'm not sure about everything, but not updating seems pointless if you haven't hacked your switch yet.

Update (up to 5.1):
-Can play online now
-Will always need a dongle/USB payload (likely)
-Burnt fuses (but you will have to burn them anyway if you ever plan to use EmuNAND)
-Cannot downgrade in the future

Do not update:
-Cannot play online now
-Can't play online safely even with EmuNAND unless we prove Nintendo can't ban you for not having the correct number of fuses burnt
-Coldboot software exploit (without USB/dongle) (unlikely)
-Can't ever play newer backups even with EmuNAND as the CFW would be based on a lower version than the one required by the game (unless we rebuid game executables to run on lower FW or we install a CFW with a lower version number than it actually is, but both those things are ugly and unlikely).

The alternative would be to update without burning fuses, that would bring the best of both worlds, but it's not ban safe.

 

[Draxzelex]

Alright but take this into consideration: Firmware 6.0 is real and on its way very soon. Once its released, you will no longer be able to play on 5.1 online as 6.0 will be the latest firmware. On top of that, if you immediately update to 6.0, not all hacks are guaranteed to work on them and who knows how long it will take developers to update their work for it to function on that firmware.

 

[Nicola]

Can other exploits (any) actually overwrite the boot someway so that it boots directly into CFW without needing a USB payload?

 

[Draxzelex]

Can other exploits (any) actually overwrite the boot someway so that it boots directly into CFW without needing a USB payload?

Theoretically yes since we had a coldboot exploit that we installed into the 3DS but only because of a major flaw it signing software. There is a very low likelihood we'll achieve such an exploit with the Switch but its also only been a year a half since the Switch came out. That 3DS exploit took over 6 years for it to be discovered.