BREXIT [Poll] vote!

[mocalacace]

The fear mongering comes from those with the most to lose.

 

[TotalInsanity4]

The fear mongering comes from those with the most to lose.

I'd argue that it most definitely comes from those with the least to lose, unless I'm misunderstanding you

 

[mocalacace]

I'd argue that it most definitely comes from those with the least to lose, unless I'm misunderstanding you

I was talking about the elite, MSM, and leftists.

 

[AkGBA]

There is trolling, bullying and hate speech. How the hell would they tell the difference between the three? They can't. It'd be based on guesses.

Safe space is an illusion.

Man... You got weird sources.
Anyway, hate speech is "all conduct publicly inciting to violence or hatred directed against a group of persons or a member of such a group defined by reference to race, color, religion, descent or national or ethnic origin".

Can't you tell the difference with trolling ?

 

[Engert]

The definition of hate speech two posts above is correct but what's annoying is when people want a stop to immigration and than the whole nation is labeled racist. Are you fucking kidding me people?

 

[AkGBA]

The definition of hate speech two posts above is correct but what's annoying is when people want a stop to immigration and than the whole nation is labeled racist. Are you fucking kidding me people?

Well, there's a link. See the rise of racist incidents starting the day after the brexit vote.

 

[Saiyan Lusitano]

Well, there's a link. See the rise of racist incidents starting the day after the brexit vote.

You can thank the EU for the screw up that Europe's in today.

 

[Engert]

Well, there's a link. See the rise of racist incidents starting the day after the brexit vote.

That tends to happen when you have an open-door, uncontrollable, unrestricted immigration policy. People get fed up because their jobs are disappearing due to the global economy. That's why they voted Brexit. Because of NAFTA, people in the mid-west United States lost tens of thousands of jobs.Instead of talking like an idealist think of it this way.
Your neighbor has no house (because of fire, flooding or whatever). You being a good neighbor invite him and his family in your house until his house is repaired.
This seems like the right thing to do, i agree. But think of this on a larger scale now. All your neighbours have no houses because of a flood and your house survive. Would you take them all in? Would this put a strain on your living space, not to mention food? Also think of something else. Some of your neighbors not only that they don't appreciate your hospitality but they are rude to you in your house and some of them even get violent.
This is how countries work, so please don't speak like an idealist but be more practical. Think of your house/country first then start being generous to your neighbors/countries.

 

[TotalInsanity4]

I was talking about the elite, MSM, and leftists.

Dang right they got the most to lose, they're typically the ones that have to live with whatever decisions are made for the longest amount of time

 

[Gingerbread Crumb]

Dang right they got the most to lose, they're typically the ones that have to live with whatever decisions are made for the longest amount of time

Most of them should have got off their asses and voted if they didn't like the decision. Hopefully the ones that didn't vote or care are the ones that aren't complaining about the outcome. Oh wait.

 

[TotalInsanity4]

Most of them should have got off their asses and voted if they didn't like the decision. Hopefully the ones that didn't vote or care are the ones that aren't complaining about the outcome. Oh wait.

If we're being honest most of the ones that didn't vote probably didn't even know what the referendum was. (The UK Google search statistics definitely back this up in the DAYS before the vote, and even immediately following)

 

[Blaze163]

There are good points on both sides, but it seems to me a lot of the points in favour of leaving are motivated by tabloid-fed fear and racism. Delusional thoughts that it'd get all immigrants to leave and Britain would be just for the British again. I'm sure there are some economic reasons to leave too, but to me it's better the devil you know.

Still too early to tell of course, but I'm already seeing knuckle-dragging wankers yelling at any non-white in the street telling them it's 'time to go' and chanting 'England Til I Die'. Ironically while wearing England football shirts made in Taiwan, drinking cheap Swedish lager, wearing trainers from China and watching their precious football on a Japanese TV. Because apparently switching their brains on runs the batteries down or something.

 

[Gingerbread Crumb]

There are good points on both sides, but it seems to me a lot of the points in favour of leaving are motivated by tabloid-fed fear and racism. Delusional thoughts that it'd get all immigrants to leave and Britain would be just for the British again. I'm sure there are some economic reasons to leave too, but to me it's better the devil you know.

Still too early to tell of course, but I'm already seeing knuckle-dragging wankers yelling at any non-white in the street telling them it's 'time to go' and chanting 'England Til I Die'. Ironically while wearing England football shirts made in Taiwan, drinking cheap Swedish lager, wearing trainers from China and watching their precious football on a Japanese TV. Because apparently switching their brains on runs the batteries down or something.

If these claims are true this is an example of idiots. Like any other group there will always be idiots. It doesn't necessarily mean that, that group or that idea is racist. Unless that idea or group is actually racist.

 

[Engert]

Which is why I mentioned earlier that the party who lead the Brexit campaign are completely confused and don't know what to do now that they won. Instead of moving swiftly with a plan, they're actually lying now to the people who voted for them on fundamental promises like the immigration.
I think with globalization, things would have to get a lot worse before anyone can come up with a better system that works for its citizens.

 

[Armadillo]

That tends to happen when you have an open-door, uncontrollable, unrestricted immigration policy. People get fed up because their jobs are disappearing due to the global economy. That's why they voted Brexit.

But Brexit will do nothing for what they have a problem with.

A huge amount of the immigration to the UK is from non-eu countries, which is done via a point system. Something the EU has no say in & could have been tightened up at any point.

EU immigration.

Leave campaign said we can leave and still have access to the EU single market, and get a deal like Norway. Norway's deal has..free movement of people.

Access to the single market=free movement of people. Comes as a package deal, EU has been very clear on this in the past.

So it's either:

Join the single market & free movement of people.
Stay out of it, fully control borders.

Staying out is not likely to happen, one of the points of the leave campaign was we can stay in it, while leaving the EU.

So in the end, it's likely nothing will be done at all about EU immigration and we also lose any say we have in the EU. Doesn't seem like a very good thing to vote for, if that was your main reason.

 

[Saiyan Lusitano]

Delusional thoughts that it'd get all immigrants to leave

That's not going to happen and it's not the issue.

 

[WeedZ]

That tends to happen when you have an open-door, uncontrollable, unrestricted immigration policy. People get fed up because their jobs are disappearing due to the global economy.

Of course an American would bring up job loss to immigration. I haven't really been following European politics, but I can tell you that immigration has little to do with job loss, and I doubt it has much to do with leaving the EU. Take our immigration policies here in the US for example. There's alot of propaganda that Mexicans are coming here illegally and taking jobs. Which is why we need a wall. But the reality is businesses are outsourcing the majority of unskilled labor to China. Mexicans will work for a few dollars less, since they aren't required to pay taxes on a work visa, but chinese will work for pennies. Honestly, it says more about your lack of skill then it does immigration policy if you're concerned that the company you work for are willing to commit fraud to replace you with an illegally hired immigrant.

 

[Xiphiidae]

~snip~

I'm pretty sure you just made an argument for combating and reducing [illegal] immigration, and/or open borders. Unless, of course, you're fine with large companies exploiting workers? You do realise that not all people have a wealth of education and/or experience, the jobs that don't require either still need to be done, and that the people doing these jobs deserve to be given a fair wage, right?

Dang right they got the most to lose, they're typically the ones that have to live with whatever decisions are made for the longest amount of time

Not all (or arguably even most, depending on where you live) young people are leftists, and not all older people are centre-right/right-wing. How much of a bubble do you have to live in in order to believe this?

 

[DjoeN]

Now that it's the 4th of july!

Britain had better waited till today to vote!
Then they could celebrate the same day, the same independendce day as the Americans (wouldn't that be ironic )
- 4th of july, the day the American independence declaration was adopted!
- 4th of july, the day the English broke free from the EU

Anyway, Happy 4th of July to all Americans

 

[Engert]

But Brexit will do nothing for what they have a problem with.

A huge amount of the immigration to the UK is from non-eu countries, which is done via a point system. Something the EU has no say in & could have been tightened up at any point.

EU immigration.

Leave campaign said we can leave and still have access to the EU single market, and get a deal like Norway. Norway's deal has..free movement of people.

Access to the single market=free movement of people. Comes as a package deal, EU has been very clear on this in the past.

So it's either:

Join the single market & free movement of people.
Stay out of it, fully control borders.

Staying out is not likely to happen, one of the points of the leave campaign was we can stay in it, while leaving the EU.

So in the end, it's likely nothing will be done at all about EU immigration and we also lose any say we have in the EU. Doesn't seem like a very good thing to vote for, if that was your main reason.

Exactly, and that's because the labor party is in total meltdown and with no plan whatsoever ,but if it was me leading the labor party the first thing I'd do is invoke the article to leave the Eu and the second thing would be to stop all immigration immediately and start negotiating trade deals which would work for UK. There plenty of countries who would want to trade with England. USA is one of them. And if countries don't want to trade with England? Even better, I'd make things in England and create jobs, and thing like tvs or shirts which are made in China (like one poster said above in this thread) those things would proudly say "Made in UK".

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Of course an American would bring up job loss to immigration. I haven't really been following European politics, but I can tell you that immigration has little to do with job loss, and I doubt it has much to do with leaving the EU. Take our immigration policies here in the US for example. There's alot of propaganda that Mexicans are coming here illegally and taking jobs. Which is why we need a wall. But the reality is businesses are outsourcing the majority of unskilled labor to China. Mexicans will work for a few dollars less, since they aren't required to pay taxes on a work visa, but chinese will work for pennies. Honestly, it says more about your lack of skill then it does immigration policy if you're concerned that the company you work for are willing to commit fraud to replace you with an illegally hired immigrant.

The situation in USA is different to Europe. First you can't really stop immigration to preserve the American way of life because America is made of immigrants. The only thing you can do is to have controlled immigration which would improve a lot the life of all immigrants here.
But what's similar is globalization. Instead of slapping the fucking Chinese with huge tariffs, our government has no penalties whatsoever for American companies exporting their manufacturing jobs to China and because the rich want to get reacher with nafta deals, whole towns in Ohio have disappeared and they're now ghost towns.
Imagine, whole families and way of life gone because of asshole politicians in Capitol Hill.

Here's the take of a British guy in Ohio : http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-35653619