Video Game Difficulties: Too Hard or Too Easy?

[Hielkenator]

Donkey Kong country returns
Super Mario Galaxy 1 & 2
Monster Hunter
Xenoblade Chronicles

HARD ENOUGH FOR ME and still AAA FUN!

 

[Deleted User]

All these long paragraphs of useless repetitive posts. I thought this was meant to be a discussion?

Can we not just sum it up to be: Games are getting easier because that's what the general audience wants.

 

[Issac]

My main problem with Nintendos hand holding in the recent Mario games is that "if the option to get help appears (even if you don't take it) you will NOT be able to get the rainbow colored stars at the save file EVER". That makes me save and reset and fuck around instead of just focusing on playing. So what if I die 5 times in a row, I don't want any help ever!

 

[Sakitoshi]

Bioshock 1999 mode.
I died a lot less then I expected.
Also, the Scavenger hunt mode is that you should not buy from vending machines.
Even then, the Sirens where pretty easy to defeat ._.
Died only 3 times at the last battle after you murdered Comstock.

And I'm a noob when it comes to FPSses.

So yes, gaming has become to easy.

did you played without using the vending machines?? there is a trophy for doing so and god this game is hard without weapon upgrades.

I hate that game.
I hate it so much, coz of crap like that.
I sold it
#NoRegrets
I've never rage quit an RPG so furiously before

you know, you can turn the camera and explore a little more what you see ahead instead of rush and attack mindlessly like on that gif, he could perfectly had used magic or arrows to lure the enemy.

I've platinumed both Demon Souls & Dark Souls, those were the only difficult games this generation

you are forgetting Borderlands 2 on vault hunter mode or superior, try to play solo and you'll know what I mean.

EDIT: I didn't even touched the format or anything and the rich text editor added a color code to my text.... weird.

 

[BORTZ]

IMO, just ramping up enemy damage doesn't make a game harder, it makes it bullshit.

I would like to expand a little bit on this point. Games that tend to rely on numbers to build the difficulty curve do not benefit from "difficulty" increases.

Lets use Skyrim for an example. I live in the camp that finds Skyrim boring, repetitive, and dull. This camp is bigger than you expect btw. About a year ago, Bethesda decided that they were going to release a difficultly patch to make the game harder, thus more enjoyable. What Bethesda didnt account for, was that the game was still largely, boring. If the mechanics arent there to create immerse and enjoyable gameplay, a difficulty ramping does not do what the developer intends. Now a game like fire emblem awakening fares differently TO A POINT. The original gameplay and mechanics are enjoyable. If you want to experience the game again, but with a bit more of a challenge, by all means, punch up the damage. Lunatic+ is where this model breaks. Rolling for stats and abilities is no longer fun or how someone should be playing a game, its betting against the RNG system.

The reason we see so much of this "numbers" game is because well... its easy for the developer to do. It takes almost nothing for the game to change up how much damage that guy does now. To make real and challenging difficulty differences, you need to invest time and work into the development process. Different level design, adding enemies, changing enemy attack patterns, and so on. Because numbers don make a game any more fun if you didn't care for the original.

On the other side of things, yeah, I do agree that games are getting to easy. Story modes are hand holding walkthroughs, and are so short they could be bedtime stories.

"hey did you get the new Final Fantasy game?"
"Yeah all 10 hours of it"

So lets look into another interesting turn of events.
/Gets out Super Mario 64 and Super Mario Galaxy
Both of these games are fantasic, no? But lets look at how devs have changed in their ways from 1996 to 2007. The biggest thing that sticks out (gameplay/mechanics wise) is the two different approaches to difficulty.

-SM64 is HARD. Ok, you cannot tell me getting 100 coins on rainbow ride is "easy". You cannot tell me you got to the top of tictoc clock and stomped the thwamp with one try. Ok?
-SMG is... huh. Take a look at this. Its no longer what you would call "hard". It falls into what I can only categorize as... frustrating.

It would seen that games are getting away from what we used to feel was a "hard" game and lean on characteristics of games the are more frustrating and not fair. SM64 took massive skills to take on. SMG just takes heavy doses of luck to get past the cheap ass ice skating evil mario clone. The same seems to go for the dichotomy between SSB Melee and Brawl. Melee took skills, technique and practice. Brawl changes thing up and makes it anyones game, regardless of prior "training". With the addition of the Smash orb or whatever that unregulated and game breaking thing was called, slower reaction speeds, closer screen edges and various "cheap" characters with unfair mechanics, Brawl was no longer about the true king of the hill and more about how could out cheap everyone else.

In other aspects, yes i really do thing games are getting easier, shorter, and more hand holdy.

 

[Gahars]

A thing to point out - if you want a serious challenge, AAA gaming is probably not the place to look. That's not to say that AAA is automatically awful or evil or whatever, but those games are pretty costly to make. They're designed to appeal to as many people as possible. Developers aren't going to include mechanics that could potentially scare away customers.

Difficulty isn't dead, it's just gone indie for the most part. Those developers are much more willing to cater to the niche.

 

[DinohScene]

did you played without using the vending machines?? there is a trophy for doing so and god this game is hard without weapon upgrades.

Please fix your font colours.
Hard to read on Darktheme.

No, Weapon upgrades don't count for that achievement.
It's purely the Dollar bills ones.

 

[Arras]

/Gets out Super Mario 64 and Super Mario Galaxy
Both of these games are fantasic, no? But lets look at how devs have changed in their ways from 1996 to 2007. The biggest thing that sticks out (gameplay/mechanics wise) is the two different approaches to difficulty.

-SM64 is HARD. Ok, you cannot tell me getting 100 coins on rainbow ride is "easy". You cannot tell me you got to the top of tictoc clock and stomped the thwamp with one try. Ok?
-SMG is... huh. Take a look at this. Its no longer what you would call "hard". It falls into what I can only categorize as... frustrating.

It would seen that games are getting away from what we used to feel was a "hard" game and lean on characteristics of games the are more frustrating and not fair. SM64 took massive skills to take on. SMG just takes heavy doses of luck to get past the cheap ass ice skating evil mario clone. The same seems to go for the dichotomy between SSB Melee and Brawl. Melee took skills, technique and practice. Brawl changes thing up and makes it anyones game, regardless of prior "training". With the addition of the Smash orb or whatever that unregulated and game breaking thing was called, slower reaction speeds, closer screen edges and various "cheap" characters with unfair mechanics, Brawl was no longer about the true king of the hill and more about how could out cheap everyone else.

In other aspects, yes i really do thing games are getting easier, shorter, and more hand holdy.

This also heavily depends on the player. The highest amount of stars I ever got in SM64 was 112 or something and the only ones I were missing were 100 coin stars because IMO those were just frustrating to get for several reasons. On the other hand I never had much problems with the Mario clone as long as you were fast (which required skill in quite a few levels). The only really frustrating levels I can remember in that game were the 100 purple-coin collectathons where they were scattered over the entire map. Getting most of them wasn't that bad but you were left wandering around trying to find the final ones for like 20 minutes occasionally.
I do agree that Brawl was much cheaper than Melee though but IIRC Sakurai has said he wants to fix that and make the next game a bit in between.

 

[N00ByBo0]

Games are lacking difficulty settings nowadays, which is mostly what Nintendo games should get. I don't know, but Super Mario Land 6 golden coins is one of the games that did this perfectly. You had an option to press start (or was it select?) in file select screen to enter 'easy mode'.

Honestly this is what every game should do. Put hard/normal on default and 'casual baby mode' by pressing start or whatever for the ones that need it.

.. Or even just what the old Megaman games did, which is even more simple difficulty setting screen.

TL;DR: don't force casual bullshit

Also, I didn't read this whole thread, but only OP.

 

[Sakitoshi]

No, Weapon upgrades don't count for that achievement.
It's purely the Dollar bills ones.

ohhh thank godness.
I think I'll start my 1999 run again some day, too many silver eagles wasted only to revive and missed opportunities to buy upgrades.
I liked the difficulty that my no upgrades run was giving, but on games with good stories I prefer having a more accessible difficulty, even with upgrades I think will be challenging.

 

[Metoroid0]

I played that game too!

This is why I like Dark Souls.

It's super cool game where you learn through trial and error

but seriously, there should be more save point than just bonfires

 

[linuxunil]

What changed:

Things that you get on the game:
back in the NES age, when you push start on Zelda, you start with nothing and anybody tells you what to do. If you die you start all over.
Today, you get a map, 999999 funds and a bazooka. You always have something pointing you the next exit and if you die it's no problem because you restart almost on the exact point you died.

Information:
Back on the NES theres no internet. If you dont know how to pass a stage, all you can do is cry. Later the gamer magazines started to show up, with some information that started to help. I will always remember the time that i bought a gamer magazine that comes with the complete metroid map.

Basic Gameplay:
Back there, the idea that you have to press UP to enter in a door was almost ALIEN.
Today, it's natural.

People that play:
Back there, if you play videogames you are a teen nerd that have a nes.
Today a 2 year child plays videogames.

Time to play:
Back there the nerd plays for a entire afternoon.
Today, people have less time. And the most sucess games are the ones that you can finish a stage in less than 1 hour

I can go on and on, but people will never read this.. so...

The last game that push me to the limit was Advance Wars 2 on my GBA (i miss this game).

 

[DinohScene]

ohhh thank godness.
I think I'll start my 1999 run again some day, too many silver eagles wasted only to revive and missed opportunities to buy upgrades.
I liked the difficulty that my no upgrades run was giving, but on games with good stories I prefer having a more accessible difficulty, even with upgrades I think will be challenging.

Good strategy is to upgrade your sniper (if you're a bit good with snipering) and Carbine.
Always keep your Carbine even if it's empty.
When Elizabeth says she gots ammo for you, switch to your Carbine before accepting.

As for Vigors, I spammed Murder of crows an awful lot.
And made a lot of use of Posession.
So it's worth upgrading those as well.

Also, if you just passed a checkpoint and die, just reload your save and try again.
If you're fighting against the Siren, make sure you set her minions a blaze/electrocute them.
So that they burn up instead of die normally (Sirens can't reanimate vanished minions ;])

Also, it could happen (dunno if it's patched or not) that enemies are fighting each other.
Like normal Founder/Vox Populi soldiers are fighting Handymans/Firemen/Patriots, let them attack each other and stand back a little while.
Not only will this damage the heavy hitter, it also eliminates most other enemies.

As for Gear power ups.
If you have the Extra! Extra! Extra! power up (Collectors edition), switch that on before you pick up a recorder.
Sheltered life is a must (grants brief invulnerability when you gain health)
Other then that.. Bullet boon for larger magazines is a must (more shots before reloading)
Scavenger vest is a must if you killed a group and can safely loot them
Vampire Embrace is a must if you use Melee.
Urgent care is a must..

Humm, try to find every infusion bottle.
I'd say upgrade your health and shield a lot.
Salts are relatively easy to come by.



Doing that will make 1999 mode significantly easier ;]

 

[Vipera]

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[Rob Blou]

Ikaruga is amazing ... the best shoot em up ever imho. It's simple, there's only 5 levels but I never finished the game because it's so darn hard :S

 

[Sakitoshi]

Ikaruga is amazing ... the best shoot em up ever imho. It's simple, there's only 5 levels but I never finished the game because it's so darn hard :S

bullet hell cannot be compared with other games, they require waaaay to much practice and skill to complete without struggling and end up using all of your bombs.
basically, bullet hell games meant to be extremely difficult.

the Touhou series is one of my favorites of that genre and with over 14 games I only completed Imperishable Night on normal 1cc, easy don't count. at least I can be proud of defeating Suika on lunatic on Immaterial and Missing Power, but that is a fighting game.

 

[pasc]

Glad I'm not the only one noticing this.

Hard in it's definition shouldn't mean:
"Have to repeat by poor design choice".

I wonder if devs get this.

Ikaruga is amazing ... the best shoot em up ever imho. It's simple, there's only 5 levels but I never finished the game because it's so darn hard :S

Have you ever tried Takatis ?

 

[Thomas83Lin]

​

What is it with video games as of late? It feels like gaming is becoming too easy. Could it be that we as gamers are getting older and becoming more skilled, therefore knowing what to look for in games to progress?​

I like to say this is the case.lol but "most" of the games today just don't feel nearly as challenging. I know this because I don't throw the controller nearly as often.lol

Spoiler

My actual tv, but this was a accident. thanks to Target Toss Pro and not wearing the strap. Damn you Wiiware

 

[PityOnU]

Perhaps games have become easier because the technology has improved to the point where the interfaces are genuinely ergonomic and easy to use? :derp:

Mario 64 and Ocarina are difficult games to beat... but only because the graphics and camera controls are so horrible.

Software developers are now able to explain to a player what they are supposed to do. They probably would have done it before as well, but they were so limited in terms of processing power and storage space that they simply couldn't. Cue the NES and SNES games.

Games shouldn't be hard to play. They should be hard to master.

 

[TripleSMoon]

Perhaps games have become easier because the technology has improved to the point where the interfaces are genuinely ergonomic and easy to use? :derp:

Mario 64 and Ocarina are difficult games to beat... but only because the graphics and camera controls are so horrible.

Software developers are now able to explain to a player what they are supposed to do. They probably would have done it before as well, but they were so limited in terms of processing power and storage space that they simply couldn't. Cue the NES and SNES games.

Games shouldn't be hard to play. They should be hard to master.

Um, why would dated graphics make a game hard to beat?

Also I disagree with telling players exactly what to do (id est, tutorials and text boxes constantly shoved in your face). I don't think they should be left completely in the dark like some older games do, but learning and teaching the player should be intuitive and part of the experience, not immersion and pace breaking. And many old games did the former quite well. It all depends on the kind of game, too