Trump allegedly indicted in a Georgia 2020 subversion probe

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Jan 6, broken in voting machines and fake electors, just one of those falls under the 14 amendment, let alone all the other stuff he did.

Also, I'm pretty sure that He-Man guy is just trolling.
 
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See edit above. I’m pretty sure reaching the lowest black unemployment rate in history and slashing their taxes helped some people out of poverty. That’s just math. If not for the outbreak of the pandemic (which is an external circumstance that can’t be accounted for in regards to economic policy), this trend would’ve continued. We can agree to disagree on that if you want, I don’t particularly care since it rolls back to the TCJA which, as I’ve said, was discussed to death already.
It's easy to cherry pick a few indicators for a pyrrhic "win". However, Trumpism, and its rightwing populist relatives around the globe, are not helping marginalized groups overall. Nor does this highly acidic brand of resentment politics promote harmony and cohesion in society, as it uses Goebbels' playbook to dehumanize the "other", whilst promulgating lies and disinformation as truth, in naked Machiavellian style. Thus, I fail to see any credibility in anyone promoting such plainly, deliberately, divisive politics who suggests that "we all need to get along". Fine people on both sides, indeed....
 
do you have a source on the railroading?

I've literally read through a dozen of your comments doing so. It's literally in front of me.
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It's easy to cherry pick a few indicators for a pyrrhic "win". However, Trumpism, and its rightwing populist relatives around the globe, are not helping marginalized groups overall. Nor does this highly acidic brand of resentment politics promote harmony and cohesion in society, as it uses Goebbels' playbook to dehumanize the "other", whilst promulgating lies and disinformation as truth, in naked Machiavellian style. Thus, I fail to see any credibility in anyone promoting such plainly, deliberately, divisive politics who suggests that "we all need to get along". Fine people on both sides, indeed....

It's more about what exactly was done to help black unemployment or if it just happened by itself.

Also, three guesses on the preferred candidate of this guy

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/26/dollar-general-store-shooting-jacksonville-florida
 
It's easy to cherry pick a few indicators for a pyrrhic "win". However, Trumpism, and its rightwing populist relatives around the globe, are not helping marginalized groups overall. Nor does this highly acidic brand of resentment politics promote harmony and cohesion in society, as it uses Goebbels' playbook to dehumanize the "other", whilst promulgating lies and disinformation as truth, in naked Machiavellian style. Thus, I fail to see any credibility in anyone promoting such plainly, deliberately, divisive politics who suggests that "we all need to get along". Fine people on both sides, indeed....
Seems to me that you’re more concerned about language and fee-fees than you are about results, but knock yourself out. There were multiple programs launched under Trump that were specifically aimed at improving the well-being of minority/underprivileged communities and my “cherry-picked indicators”, the only ones that actually matter, show that he made a positive impact. In fact, 2020 exit polls indicate that support for Trump amongst minorities has *increased*, after his first term, so the electorate noticed. After all of the protests, all of the complaining, all of the accusations of racism and other assorted gibberish spouted by anchors on the idiot box, his share of the minority vote has *improved* compared to 2016. This directly contradicts what you’re saying.

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The only ethnicity where Trump has lost some ground is, ironically, white people, with whom he lost 1 point. You are welcome to disagree with any of this, but polemics only go so far. The numbers are what they are.
 
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Tons of questionable assumptions there, which need to be unpacked with the understanding that correleation does not necessarily imply causation and also that people do not necessarily vote in line with their enlightened self-interest (especially on the right). But yes, I'm all emotional here... verklempt, literally drowning in a massive tsunami of liberal tears. All that love for both sides really hit deep.
 
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Tons of questionable assumptions there, which need to be unpacked with the understanding that correleation does not necessarily imply causation and also that people do not necessarily vote in line with their enlightened self-interest (especially on the right). But yes, I'm all emotional here... verklempt, literally drowning in a massive tsunami of liberal tears. All that love for both sides really hit deep.
I didn’t say that you were emotional, I said that you’re more concerned about people’s words and feelings than you are about numbers. I’m the opposite - I am *only* concerned with what is measurable, I don’t care what people say, what they think or how they feel in the slightest, because that has no real bearing on policy or its end results.
 
I am *only* concerned with what is measurable, I don’t care what people say, what they think or how they feel in the slightest, because that has no real bearing on policy or its end results
This is both false and wrong in the post-truth era, where feelings inform policies more than data.
 
This is both false and wrong in the post-truth era, where feelings inform policies more than data.
Feelings have been informing policy more than data for much, much longer than that. The government has been busying itself with a bunch of nonsense that doesn’t actually do anything besides looking/sounding good for decades upon decades. That’s kind of my point - none of that matters, only results do. :lol:
 
That’s kind of my point - none of that matters, only results do. :lol:
Which is precisely why voters gave Trump the boot: eight trillion dollars pissed away in one term plus a million dead Americans equals worse results than even Trump's harshest critics could've predicted in 2016. Everything he touches turns to shit.
 
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Which is precisely why voters gave Trump the boot: eight trillion dollars pissed away in one term plus a million dead Americans equals worse results than even Trump's harshest critics could've predicted in 2016. Everything he touches turns to shit.
…in large part on account of COVID relief spending, not to mention that the office of the Presidency has no power of the purse, only Congress does. The President can only reallocate what was already assigned to the Executive branch, and in limited capacity - there is little wiggle room. Remind me, who had the House majority as of 2018 (since most of this spending is post-2018, so it’s *very* relevant)? Who signed the 2020 omnibus package extremely reluctantly, calling it “a disgrace”? You seem to be interested in spending all of a sudden, so I just wanted to establish some facts. Next you’ll tell me Joe Biden actually decreased deficits when in all actuality he *increased* them compared to pre-COVID figures and the only relevant factor in the over/under is the expiry of the relief provisions, the actual big ticket item, with which he had absolutely nothing to do. Even liberal news sources torched him for spouting that nonsense, so I hope you’re not heading there because you know full-well that’s a bald-faced lie.
 
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…in large part on account of COVID relief spending
In large part on account of corporate welfare, his dumbass wall, militarizing and weaponizing the police, a foreign policy which gave handouts to dictators, etc. As I've said before, the American public have absolutely nothing to show for it. Trump left us poorer, more divided, and less secure. That's his entire legacy, cementing him firmly within the ten worst presidents of all time.
 
In large part on account of corporate welfare, his dumbass wall, militarizing and weaponizing the police, a foreign policy which gave things to dictators for free, etc. As I've said before, the American public have absolutely nothing to show for it. Trump left us poorer, more divided, and less secure. That's his entire legacy, cementing him firmly within the ten worst presidents of all time.
The figures don’t align with what you’re saying. Just the late 2020 COVID relief alone cost around 3 trillion dollars, and it wouldn’t have cost any less under a Democrat president - the bill was authored by Democrats. That one bill alone accounts for nearly half of your contested figure. If you think the money was spent frivolously, I hate to break this to you, but you’re barking up the wrong tree.
 
The figures don’t align with what you’re saying. Just the late 2020 COVID relief alone cost around 3 trillion dollars, and it wouldn’t have cost any less under a Democrat president - the bill was authored by Democrats. That one bill alone accounts for nearly half of your contested figure. If you think the money was spent frivolously, I hate to break this to you, but you’re barking up the wrong tree.
There should've been more scrutiny over the PPP loan program, certainly, though I have no doubt Republicans would've held the rest of the relief package hostage if it wasn't included. Was clearly designed to benefit white-collar criminals and scammers.
 
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There should've been more scrutiny over the PPP loan program, certainly, though I have no doubt Republicans would've held the rest of the relief package hostage if it wasn't included. Was clearly designed to benefit white-collar criminals and scammers.
It was designed to keep paying people wages despite a government and disease-induced downturn in business. Of course nobody in government understands that money is fungible, but that’s not the fault of the bill, it’s a characteristic of the currency. In the absence of PPP many businesses that survived the pandemic would’ve shut their doors. The UK has a similar program covering 80% of the employee’s wage IIRC (Job Retention Scheme, or more colloquially, COVID-related furlough), there are no Republicans there.
 
Are we *really* at the crime statistics stage of the conversation? Okay, you prompted this.
You were the one that bought up crime statistics. Because that is how you avoid any kind of responsibility.

I didn't bother reading the rest of your wall of text, because your premise was wrong.

and also that people do not necessarily vote in line with their enlightened self-interest
Right, often marginalized people will vote for the politicians who marginalize them because they believe they are special and can somehow overcome being marginalized.

People can be racist against their own race.

This is both false and wrong in the post-truth era, where feelings inform policies more than data.
Yeah, Trump would never have been elected if voting was based in reality.

That there are some people stupid enough to support him coming back into power is a failure of critical thinking.
 
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I didn’t say that you were emotional, I said that you’re more concerned about people’s words and feelings than you are about numbers. I’m the opposite - I am *only* concerned with what is measurable, I don’t care what people say, what they think or how they feel in the slightest, because that has no real bearing on policy or its end results.
Awesome! Then look at the data regarding climate change and consider how Trump and other rightwing governments around the world are exacerbating the problem.

In practice, there only seems to be an interest in cherry picking data that suits rightwing apologetics. This hyper-partisan methodology makes for an extremely bad teacher. A good teacher does their best to keep their biases far away from what they're teaching. Apologetics is bias personified. That's why people don't have any respect. They correctly recognize a rightwing apologist when they see one. I've spent decades "debating" apologists, mostly religious, creationists, etc... and the pattern of engagement is the same, and equally fruitless here.
 
Why don't Anti-Trump woke people in here say I'm woke/with origin/gay and against Trump (Maybe wanting to burn him on a woodshed) because I was told by medias he was racist so I'm sure he is racist!! This is the true topic of this post in a video game community that should be neutral.
These people strictly don't care the greater good of US community (this is the real point), they only care about themselves and their own skin and sexual interest, they think it's an advancement if they can have what they want but it's brings only a society decline, you just have to see the last two decades going down. They would vote for a slug if it could help them achieve their goal....Pretty sure that's the case. They would like to change Mario in a women because it's hype, but that's already been called Great Giana Sisters. Why don't you ask weeping for a new black hero in a platform games instead of wanting to change Ariel or Mario's skin color and blue pants for a Change??? As a gamer, I want Mario and other characters to STAY GLOBALLY HOW THEY ARE.
 
Awesome! Then look at the data regarding climate change and consider how Trump and other rightwing governments around the world are exacerbating the problem.

In practice, there only seems to be an interest in cherry picking data that suits rightwing apologetics. This hyper-partisan methodology makes for an extremely bad teacher. A good teacher does their best to keep their biases far away from what they're teaching. Apologetics is bias personified. That's why people don't have any respect. They correctly recognize a rightwing apologist when they see one. I've spent decades "debating" apologists, mostly religious, creationists, etc... and the pattern of engagement is the same, and equally fruitless here.
The climate is definitely changing, but the solution to the problem is technological, it doesn’t lie in cutting industry at the hamstrings or replacing your plastic straws with paper ones. There are various costs to consider, and green energy solutions have a huge environmental impact as well. In order for a green grid to work, it must be capable of supplying energy even in adverse weather conditions - neither windmills nor solar panels have that capacity, and both are inherently inefficient. Energy storage is another big factor, because the grid doesn’t go to sleep, it can’t be reliable for 12 hours a day, it must necessarily function 24/7. If eco-advocates cared about the environment as much as they claim, they’d be clamouring for more nuclear power plants, more investments in natural gas and so on - they don’t. The cost/benefit analysis doesn’t check out, nobody is going to support green initiatives at the cost of their well-being or, to a large extent, their pocket book. Biden’s war on oil and pipelines doesn’t help, it exacerbates the problem which manifests as overall uncertainty in the energy market and refusal to further invest into a business that could require severe downsizing in the foreseeable future at the flick of a pencil pusher’s pen. You’re oversimplifying a nuanced and complex issue, there are many ways to skin this cat.
 

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