<!--quoteo(post=1387601:date=Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM:name=Prophet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Prophet @ Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1387601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As far as the "better schools" issue goes, I respectfully disagree with you. An argument could be made for and against vouchers. I do believe you are right that it would in theory work for a time, but I believe it wouldn't be a fix that would last. What is to stop us from running into this exact same problem? The structuring of private schools right now is strong, but we would easily over exert the system if vouchers caught on and what might that lead to? If private schools fill, how will we determine a precedence for admittance? What will the voucher system consist of, pay-what-you-can and the government pays the rest? Or would it be here's a voucher for X amount, you need to pay the difference. I'm far from an authority on this, so I might very well be missing a key part to this debate. My biggest fear however is this; there are parents who could careless if their children get a good education. You can set up a system where a family need only pay 5 dollars a month for their child to switch from the lowest public school to the greatest private one and you know what? There will be those parents who would still not take advantage. I like the concept of overhauling our current school system, because we can ensure that the children of a drunkard and the child of a responsible parent, can both get a better education.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The problem with the school system is the system itself, it is by design geared towards passing standardize test then it is of actaully learn. Coupled with the fact that being a teacher as a career is one of the least "college monetary" professions out there gives no incentive to our competitive market to persue. Just in Houston, teachers make $30,000 or less a year, while other professions with the same ammount of "university/ college time", actually pay significantly more. It truly is a sad day when the people responsible for teaching us, actually become jaded just because the way the system is setup. The way to fix the school system is actually through the teachers themselves. Because within all of the circumstances of a poor school a great teacher can change the way students; think, believe, and live. While new supplies / schools / programs help, it is ultimatly the teachers responsibility for the learning of students within their care. Teachers have also been reduced to teach ciriculum that has explicitly to do with the "Standardize Test System", where there is no promotion of freedom of thought, but is reduced to what could be on a test. The goverment doesnt help matters, because they only give schools "funding" dependant only upon these test scores. So, if your school doesnt have the "important, school related studies", you loose funding and essentially the schools themselves become worse off.
<!--quoteo(post=1387601:date=Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM:name=Prophet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Prophet @ Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1387601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Now on to your second point. I in no way meant to insinuate that anyone on this forum is agreeable that lynching blacks is some how logically sound, I was only expressing that there was a point in this countries history that saw this act as acceptable. Perhaps I illustrated the point too graphically, but you must remember I have had to explain it now 4 or 5 times. The tell tale sign that my meaning was not in anyway to be perceived in the manner you have perceived it, was the quotation marks. I was simplifying my point, which is this: in a country where people of color were killed for said color; in a country where the lynching of these colored people was at a time "fine logic"; I have no patience, nor should any black person to hear "don't vote based on race." Where as you would like to act as if the enslavement of my forefathers was some ancient practice that I have drudged up, I will not allow it. We are not that many years removed from chains and rope and the ramifications of slavery still exist. If you believe differently, then please explain to me why blacks are disproportionately amongst the disadvantaged.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think your logic is a little askewed, you say that this "country's history" thought it acceptable to lynch the black race? I beg to disagree, unfortunaltly sir that is a generalization and should not be taken as fact. The actaul vast majority of people thought it was wrong, and if you do a little more research, the Jim Crowe laws were enforced in Southern States. Being as a mostly State doctrine, it was hard to overturn because of the 10th admendment of the US Consitution, which states, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." The States took the initiative to endores these laws, therefore the people were subject to them, however it is important to note that these laws were repealed, because of the people that believe that these laws were wrong came together to tear them down. I would also like to note that there was a substatial ammount of white persons that staked thier reputation, jobs, families, and lives to join and help the NAACP, through the trouble times. Most of what you put here is propaganda fed to you by would be teachers in your suburbs suggesting still that the white man is doing everything in there power to keep you down. I have experienced this first hand. While, I was in middle school, I was forced to go to a "disproporionately amongst the disadvantaged" all black school. It was amazing how many lessons were soon to be pulled out as achieveing black power, or the version of history that warrents that white people in general will or have always oppressed the blacks. I was failed in my 8th grade english class because I wrote a paper on "Opression of the Irish Immigrants". My teacher refused to grade it, changing the assignments directions to say "Write a paper on Black Oppresion." Because she didnt like to be proved wrong, that blacks were the only ones to feel oppression in the US. When I confronted the priciple on the matter, he kept to what the English teacher's decision and decided to fail me for the semester based on that. How does this go towards "reaching equality?"
<!--quoteo(post=1387601:date=Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM:name=Prophet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Prophet @ Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1387601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->To the point of "whites were slaves too, you don't see us whining". I'm going to first say to you, that this is a truly ignorant argument and I hope you open your mind to what I'm about to tell you, because people trot out this misconceived counter far too often. Now, it can be argued extensively that slavery in America was far different from the forms of slavery that preceded it; this is a point that can be made and I will make it in a moment. But first I must shake loose this idea that somehow because a people who were once slaves, have come out of it and regained their social footing; this is proof that all former slaves should be able to recover just as quickly or without assistance. Even if we pretend that the circumstances of white enslavement in the Barbary Coast, is identical to black enslavement in America; even if I allow this huge pretense, your point still falls apart. How can anyone set a precedence for post-enslavement recovery?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really do hate to burst your bubble here too, but the US is not the first to exploit a group of people to endure slavery. While, how morally wrong that slavery is, the Arabs almost exclusively enslaved "Christians", and the Egyptians exclusivly enslaved "Jews" (and blacks once the jews fled). This is however not a novel concept. To try to seperate your race out as novel idea to slavery, is just used to boost your ego, and narcissitic image of your race. Slavery is slavery. Arabs were known for cutting of arms of slaves, fingers, gouging eyes out, beheading. So, please save me the sob story that your race has had it the worse. I'm actaully sick to my stomach over people who believe it.
<!--quoteo(post=1387601:date=Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM:name=Prophet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Prophet @ Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1387601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Furthermore, now that we are free of the pretense let me state it clearly: American slavery was unique. It was in many ways a slavery of a different kind, a kind that many consider to a brand new form of slavery. Now I'm sure you are wondering if perhaps, I am saying all of this because I am black and in turn this only more relevant to me, because it happen to my people. Let me assure you, that is not the case. There are volumes upon volumes written on this basis, classes are taught around our country following this logic. Do you believe that all the proofs and historical re-examination is conjured up to appease blacks? Do you feel these books and courses are all based around a lie or are you willfully ignorant; able to refer to the little known fact of white slavery, while all the time blinding yourself to the blaring signs that point to the uniqueness of American slavery? I'm not going to go into too many points of what sets American slavery a part, because if you cared to know these details, they are easily researched. Suffice to say this; It is widely regarded that race had never played such a intrinsic role in the enslavement of a people, until American slavery. Slaves in America did not just happen to be black, slaves in America were slaves because they were black. Even while black slaves worked in the Caribbean and in French and Spanish colonies, these blacks were treated significantly different then their American counter-parts. In America the idea that slaves are a lower class of people, eventually transforms into blacks are a lower class of people and hence it is morally fine to have them serve as slaves. The greatest proof of this comes in two forms. The “one drop rule” and the American era of Jim Crow. If one drop of n**** blood was enough to make a man a slave, than what does that say about the American regard for the n**** people? Moreover, when the black people are released from slavery, the years to follow prove no easier because the rampant hatred of the n**** has taken grasp. Some of the worst things to befall blacks, occur after slavery has ended.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In fact as stated in my pervious post, why is all the lessons of pervious "slavery" ignored. Because it incoviences the propaganda that black slavery was the worst. Your logic is extreamly flawed because there are many books, and classes taught the way that slavery was not very diffrent, from the pervious examples. Stop trying to be so self rightegous, to say you have had it the worse. The subject is moot and of no matter. I doesnt matter how it happen, it only matters where we go from here!
<!--quoteo(post=1387601:date=Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM:name=Prophet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Prophet @ Sep 8 2008, 07:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1387601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Lastly, you are right I have never actually been a slave. Just as the vast majority of Jews have never seen a concentration camp. Just as the modern Native American, did not watch as their forefathers were cut down. Just as most American men and women were not in the twin towers when they fell, but all have promised to “never forget.” And it is just like all those I have named, that I too carry with me not only the blood of my slain brethren but so too do I choose to bear their scars. And until the ramifications of slavery are set right, until true equality is reached and it becomes more than the convenient facade you erect, until that day I will show my scars as proof and I will do so without apology.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
One thing you forget, is that most white americans have never owned a slave, Even within the south only a third of the population owned slaves, and that was just limited to the south. Almost all northern states did not endorse or have slavery. So you are still cutting down a race that in large part had nothing to do with it. Ok, While I do respect you upholding your heirtage, it is however counter productive to achieveing equality with your pride. Just like the pride of the white people needs to go away, so does the black population. Let me be the first to say, "I AM WHITE, I AM SORRY ON THE BEHALF OF MY RACE, NOW LETS MOVE FORWARD TO CREATE A TRUE AMERICA, ONE WITHOUT BARRIERS OF DISCRIMINATION, AND THE IGNORANCE OF BIGOTRY." Dr. King believed in this! I believe your a follower of his work, yes? I can tell you this, Dr. King never would have supported Affirmative Action, nor other programs to "equate by disequate" race. He wanted us to ignore the color of our skins. Because to be so prideful in your own race, makes you in theory a racist! To vote for someone because they are black is racist. You want true equality? Then we all need to stop thinking that one race owes another, and just move on. Again, if your an advent follower of Dr. King, he only preached against socially biased laws, and never sought to "punish" the whole white race because of the black enslavement. I believe Dr. King to be a great man, but it sounds more like your siding with Malcolm X, where he believe and eye for an eye. Which, he believe that the white man should pay, and so by transfering power to the black man, instead of trying to just work together as brothers. I dispise Malcolm X, but I believe that Dr. King had it right. He is still a man that we can all look up to, and hopefully move forward from this narcissistic society.
