Hacking Last Chance for Sourceflow. "100% Useless" - WiiFlow Dev

[drakorex]

I think Rican's got some good points. I'm curious though. How much time do we typically spend time in the source menu as it is, and how much time will we spend in sourceflow?

 

[spacepimp]

I think Rican's got some good points. I'm curious though. How much time do we typically spend time in the source menu as it is, and how much time will we spend in sourceflow?

You raise a good point, but how long do you spend looking at banners and the back of game covers anyhoo?
Of course speed of execution, 3d covers in a coverflow in a 3d space - this is the basic brief - the simpler the better.
But do you not feel a spine and back are necessary for the sourceflow covers - if only for the defaults?
I just think we should leave a bigger cover coverflow open to development - should anyone want to develop it. Of course this large-cover homebrew is a recent addition - I personally don't use it - but it's a nice option for those that want it.- I'm just riffing about the possibilities. It's my thing

Just adding to Rican's thoughts - the delete function could replace the cd button in the pop up icon menu - or maybe this is ideal for the cancel/abort button? What's the third icon - I can't recall - would it be necessary in a sourceflow context - perhaps this could be replaced by the delete button?!?
Obviously, a confirm yes/no dialog would be useful - and how about not actually deleting the relevent cover - but moving it instead to a recycle bin accessible via the settings menu?


MassiveRican - how are you going to generate the image for your idea for the sourceflow?

 

[MassiveRican]

^^ Sometimes I think your all over the place and I can't quite follow , I have to re-read some things to see what you mean lol. I don't quite understand the question you aimed at me? I let the devs do the generating haha. Whatever they can make happen is really what I follow, then just adding my thoughts on things that I believe are easily achievable that are handy to users. Most of the time they have a great grasp on exactly what is needed/wanted but again it has to be a slow process so things don't bug out in WiiFlow, as per what's been seen in some of the most recent revs, which are now slowly being fixed.

I don't really want things to get out of hand with the sourceflow before it even begins, I'd like to just have a base foundation on how it can work as an alternative/replacement to all the current features of the Source Menu and I think we've achieved that. When things start moving in that direction and as issues/questions come up, I'll comment some more on full cover, banner, spine, etc.

 

[spacepimp]

No worries, fella. As always, you're right. All I was doing was agreeing with you in my inimitable unnecessarily complex way -
My suggestion was only that the pop-up menu at the bottom of the coverflow might be different - more suitable for the sourceflow -so as discussed, instead of the mode button - a multi button - when this is activated, user's can de/select multiple sources. This also frees '+' for it's normal function.
I was thinking, as an addition, that when the multi button was activated - the pop-up menu change appropriately:-

The Multi button becomes a Launch button
The Optical Disk Button becomes a Cancel Button, and
The Home Button becomes a Delete button.

^This is because you raised the question of how we were going to delete titles - suggesting a multi button combo.
My feeling about multi button combos is that they are great for shortcuts for the experienced user - but basic user functions, like deleting titles, should not be anywhere near them.
I also added that an " are you absolutely sure?" option would be handy when deleting stuff, or better still, a recycle box for deleted sources - perhaps accessible from the settings menu.

Hi guys, well my idea was literally a clone of brewflow, where the icon.png was used as a smallbox, but a little more refined/tweaked to allow for say the size of current source menu icons in 3D, and u can have anywhere from 8-12 icons in a grid like coverflow, if I can I'll post a pic.....(and of course for u to keep throwin' ideas left and right 'Pimpin )

I just wondered how you were going to generate the pic you spoke of here? Specifically, I was wondering if you were going to put together a mock up of the sourceflow, using a modded emuflow with 3d covers based on the source_menu in a 4x3 coverflow - but now that I read that back It seems somewhat unlikely!

Thanks for your patience and input, as always.
mAcelump

 

[spacepimp]

Accidental double post now updated as completely different post

There are a bunch of problems with using 'A' single click to quick-launch sources - Favourites, title deleting, individual title settings, etc. would all have to work differently - because they are dependent on highlighting a cover with an 'A' single click, and then modifying it's status.
If we instead have it function like the other 'flows - all those issues are avoided and it's more in keeping with the rest of wiiflow.
You will still be able to use A+B to quick launch sources (although I'd prefer 'A' double-click or 'A' long-press, but that's another post... )

 

[MassiveRican]

Hmm, good point, I didn't think about that.. A small workaround would be to use the same button for multi-select as a way to choose favorites and for title deleting, since I don't see a use for individual title settings for a source cover. Basically the button would let you enter a type of config mode let's say for sourceflow covers where you can multi-select, add/remove favorite sources, and delete sourceflow covers. What do you think?

I'm thinking about keeping things as clutter free as possible while at the same time hopefully taking into consideration, ease of coding/minimal code changes.

 

[spacepimp]

Hmm, good point, I didn't think about that.. A small workaround would be to use the same button for multi-select as a way to choose favorites and for title deleting, since I don't see a use for individual title settings for a source cover. Basically the button would let you enter a type of config mode let's say for sourceflow covers where you can multi-select, add/remove favorite sources, and delete sourceflow covers. What do you think?

I'm thinking about keeping things as clutter free as possible while at the same time hopefully taking into consideration, ease of coding/minimal code changes.

Cool, Agreed.

This is a departure from the principle of similarity with the rest of wiiflow, but perhaps some of the solutions we're coming to could be used in the homebrewflow also?

If we are looking at a two tier solution - with a minimalist homebrewflow and a wii game-type full cover option - perhaps some of the ideas are more applicable to one or the other approach.


Individual settings however - I disagree - i think there is some need, particularly with this minimalist approach. Perhaps when in 'Multi/Select' mode (although I like 'Config Mode' too! ) there could initially be a 'View Title' button - this could be replaced by The Launch button once more-than-one sources are selected.

 

[AbdallahTerro]

pimp check it out: take a deep breath first then drink some lemon ice tea before clicking that button:

Spoiler

 

[spacepimp]

The lemon tea helped. Thank you!

But......How?!?!?!

 

[MassiveRican]

That's what I meant when I said "if I can I'll post a pic."

Basically I was going to mess around with Brewflow and some icons to get the desired effect but I lacked the time and patience to execute my vision. Abz is much more handy at creating coverflow's and he did quite nicely. Personally I prefer less icons, I got used to the 12 icon setup the source menu provides.

I would even be ok with 16 icons per page, but I'm not too fond of having seeing so many icons at once. I feel it's easier to look through 12 than 50 to find the system you're looking for. Either way good job on this Abz it gives a clear visual presentation of what we're trying to achieve here.

 

[AbdallahTerro]

I have nothing to do with this screenie, no magic nor photoshop here, it's an avant-premiere

 

[spacepimp]

I have nothing to do with this screenie, no magic nor photoshop here, it's an avant-premiere

MassiveRican, looks like we need to discuss back covers and spines quite urgently
I think if 3D covers are an available option, we should go with that - it's part of why wiiflow is such a joy to use - but you should be able to use 3D covers alongside front covers imported from source_menus. EDIT:Because they same the same size!
I was thinking - as a rule of thumb/ or a 'brief', of having graphic design-based front covers, i.e. recognisable from 'a distance'; Text-only spines; and having a simple picture of the console and the controller on the back.
I quite like the chunky dimensions of the homebrew-style boxes, so I'd like the spines quite thick - this would also make them more legible.
These are just first impressions - I am completely open to suggestions.
What are your thoughts ?

p.s. spines on the top, right?

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Also, just to finally agree on the pop-up menu buttons in sourceflow:

For example, This is the current order of the buttons in the Pop-Up Menu in Wiiflow, reading left to right:

Help-Settings-SPACE-SPACE-Favourites-SPACE-Mode(next source)-DVD/Optical Drive-Home

With 'help' and 'settings' on the left, 'favourites' in the middle, and 'mode', 'dvd', and 'home' on the right.

Ignoring the spaces, here is the proposed layout for the sourceflow Pop-Up menu

help - settings - favourites - Multi/Select - Optical Drive- Home

Clicking on Multi changes the background colour or texture, puts highlights around the covers, or some other indicator that the 'mode' has changed

Pop-Up Menu buttons now read:

Help - Settings - Favourites - Info - Cancel - Delete

Selecting a source visually marks that source cover, but does not quick launch it - the cover could move slightly forward of the unselected covers, perhaps the grey of the sides of the box could change colour.

Selecting one item and then selecting 'Info' shows some properties, settings, and the (SM button-sized) 3D cover for that source - similar to the individual item view in the homebrewflow.

Selecting multiple items changes the pop-up once more, to:

help-settings-favourites-Launch(multiple sources)-Cancel-Delete

Of course - clicking on Cancel turns off the 'multi' mode, i.e. 'A' clicking on a cover quick-launches that source.

Clicking on 'delete' moves the selected sources to another folder or designates them to be 'ignored', rather than actually removing data. Perhaps this could be accessible from the settings menu.

I just think it's good practice that using delete brings up an 'Are you Sure?' prompt.

One note - given that the multi 'button' plays a relatively important role in using the sourceflow, perhaps that could be in the middle and favourite moved to 3rd from the right instead.
e.g.
Help - Settings - Multi/Select - Favourite - Sort - Home

p.s. I see what you mean about densely packed posts - it took me several attempts to fully understand your earlier post. I will try harder to be clearer - but please don't hesitate to ask wtf I mean.

Edit: How do you feel about this: Can we request that we have a Wii/GC DVD source in the source_menu/sourceflow instead of wasting an icon in the Pop-Up menu?

 

[AbdallahTerro]

This is a screenie of sourceflow using Brewflow from the masterpiece pack
Sources are sorted alphabeticaly now

 

[MassiveRican]

spacepimp What do you mean by optical? Do u mean a button to launch a disc in the drive or something? As for full covers, well, again I'm more inclined towards the brewflow view. Let me ponder a bit on the idea, but I have no input as of yet, for now your the forefront visionary on full cover sourceflow.

EDIT: You may want to take a look at some of the covers being made by this user and discussing if he'd be willing to make something inline with your vision, it's already very similar.

AbdallahTerro Nice work on the flow, and thanks for the visual previews, loving the brewflow sourceflow thus far

 

[mastershoes]

EDIT: You may want to take a look at some of the covers being made by this user and discussing if he'd be willing to make something inline with your vision, it's already very similar.

MR Take a close look at those covers.. there very... ummm bad. I hate to say stuff like that, but they're pretty ummm. terrible. O.o

 

[spacepimp]

spacepimp What do you mean by optical? Do u mean a button to launch a disc in the drive or something? As for full covers, well, again I'm more inclined towards the brewflow view. Let me ponder a bit on the idea, but I have no input as of yet, for now your the forefront visionary on full cover sourceflow.

EDIT: You may want to take a look at some of the covers being made by this user and discussing if he'd be willing to make something inline with your vision, it's already very similar.

AbdallahTerro Nice work on the flow, and thanks for the visual previews, loving the brewflow sourceflow thus far

Ah, I see where we've crossed wires. Let me clarify - when I say 3D covers in this context, I mean chunky little source_menu-sized covers - source_menu buttons with a spine and a back.

I'm asking if the homebrewflow-type sourceflow should have 3D covers - see above
- I was writing under the impression that we'd broadly agreed that we were discussing your approach - and dropped the full sized covers for later development - Obviously, I still need to work on being clearer

Optical - yes, I mean the optical DVD drive - it just seems logical to have the Wii/GC Disk as one of the options in a menu for selecting sources! Don't you think?

Also, IMHO, the place in the pop-up menu used by the optical drive icon could be better used launching another function, especially in the context of the sourceflow -
Perhaps the 'Sort' button, to change from sorting alphabetically to sorting by generation, CPU bit depth, format, age, manufacturer etc....A small, clean solution might be a one-word pop up above the icon, with arrows at either end so you can scroll thru' the sorting options.

p.s. Just second the appreciation for that lovely stuff, Abz!
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Just a note on the 'Sort' function - I am really happy to collate all the data for the consoles into one document. I just need help with how to format the data.

 

[AbdallahTerro]

Don't thank me, thank Fledge68

 

[MassiveRican]

We love FLEDGE68!! spacepimp my apologies for the mIsunderstanding. Gotta get more rest :facepalm:
I see what u mean for the full cover icons for brewflow. I think that's a great idea. We have a test dol now so it's only a matter of time before the rest of Sourceflow gets incorporated for favorites categories/sorting and what not. Although I'm good with the current alpha sorting method, I'd like to see multi-select and favorites next. Things should be real interesting.

mastershoes LMFAO!! Umm yea I just saw the thumbnail for a system cover and thought of spacepimp figuring that might be what he's looking for. Didn't really take an in-depth look, I will most definitely take your word for it and save myself the view lol.

 

[spacepimp]

Solution to custom title ordering in Sourceflow...

perhaps not ideal but editing the sort order should be as simple as numbering the names you give them in the title= line.
1. NES
2. SNES
3. N64
4. ETC.

Of course Simple but effective - Thanks - I think that's all fledge's questions covered
http://gbatemp.net/threads/wiiflow-an-open-source-gui-usb-loader.204106/page-686#post-4754718
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EDIT:
It would mean losing alphabetical ordering
But this won't:

Or add the use of the buttons [button_1] [button_2] already in the source_menu.ini as method of sorting.

And we'll still be able to customise the order with your app!

BOOM!

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Mr MassiveRican

I don't know if the Pop-Up Menu will have to be written from scratch, but if it does, will it just be simpler to have all the needed sourceflow buttons present and just grey them out when not in use?
i.e. just completely drop all the current pop-up buttons (except favourites) , and not mess about with this and that appearing and disappearing!!?
Maybe a themer might have a go with all that at some later point.

AbdallahTerro
I was wondering If I might have a go at resizing some of the elements of the button covers.
My thought is to make the lettering larger and generally more legible "at a distance" and play with the graphic design ideas. I noticed some of the covers have spines, I thought I might try and add a few?
I mentioned to MR the idea of having depictions of the actual console and the controller on the back of a 3D cover, and reserve the front cover for logos and graphics (in the 'lettering' sense of graphics! ) ie the bolder visual elements on the front and the more subtle detail on the back.

Anyhoo, would it be rude to ask for a copies of the source material for your buttons, or your project files?
TBH, I'm not sure when I'll be able to work on it, but I'd like to put in time here and there when I can.