Hardware Do I owe this guy a refund?

[PaperBro64]

yo guys, so I sold my wii u to a guy a few days ago, it was hacked with mocha, when he got home, he tried to download mario kart 8 and as it was downloading it got stuck at 19%, said estimated time 99 hours. he left it alone for 4 hours but it didnt change, then he decided to just flat out turn it off, held the power button for 10 secs (i didn't tell him anything about doing this, he did it at his own accord) and now the wii u cant turn on, it freezes midway through the wii u logo, but now he's asking for a refund and that it was apparently my fault for giving him a wii u with a faulty nand chip, for reference my wii u was the mario kart 8 bundle, which came out in may of 2014 (which I told him, but he didn't bother doing any research into the faulty nand chip that these early models are sometimes cursed with) so what do you think, do I owe him a refund for this?

 

[Itsuki235]

Yes, but only if they are willing to return the item. If you were in their shoes that is what you would want. Alternatively, you can offer to replace it.

 

[PaperBro64]

Yes, but only if they are willing to return the item. If you were in their shoes that is what you would want. Alternatively, you can offer to replace it.

But why tho? he's the one that decided that instead of asking around for help, he would just force stop the console as it was writing to nand, it seems none of this is my fault.

 

[Itsuki235]

If you were a retail store, or Amazon, or an eBay purchase, or anything else, the item is considered faulty if merely powering it off is enough to render it unusable. Power off electronics should not permanently damage them.

 

[PaperBro64]

If you were a retail store, or Amazon, or an eBay purchase, or anything else, the item is considered faulty if merely powering it off is enough to render it unusable. Power off electronics should not permanently damage them.

well, im not a retailer, I just sold my old personal wii u, and it wasn't just a regular power off, it was a forced power off while the system was writing to nand, it's kinda like holding the power button during a windows update, high chance of corrupting the system. He knew that my wii u was one of the old models, I told him, i think it's his fault for not learning about a product before writing online that he is looking for one, he said he was looking for a hacked one specifically, so I also assumed he knew that when your console is hacked, there's always a small chance of a brick.

 

[linkchidori]

well, im not a retailer, I just sold my old personal wii u, and it wasn't just a regular power off, it was a forced power off while the system was writing to nand, it's kinda like holding the power button during a windows update, high chance of corrupting the system. He knew that my wii u was one of the old models, I told him, i think it's his fault for not learning about a product before writing online that he is looking for one, he said he was looking for a hacked one specifically, so I also assumed he knew that when your console is hacked, there's always a small chance of a brick.

Turning the Wii U while downloading a game shouldnt be the cause of a brick in any way, ive done it before too and it never happened. If that was the case, it means the console was already faulty at purchase, afaik

Correct me if im wrong, but i dont recall early Wii U models being faulty at any time. And even if that was the case, you sold him a working Wii U, right?

 

[PaperBro64]

Turning the Wii U while downloading a game shouldnt be the cause of a brick in any way, ive done it before too and it never happened. If that was the case, it means the console was already faulty at purchase, afaik

When I asked some guys here before and also on the nintendo homebrew server, they said that turning the console off (especially by holding the power button down for 10 seconds) is pretty dangerous while it is writing to nand, add to that the fact that this console was one of the older ones which had those faulty nand chips. and the chances increase.

 

[BvanBart]

If you were a retail store, or Amazon, or an eBay purchase, or anything else, the item is considered faulty if merely powering it off is enough to render it unusable. Power off electronics should not permanently damage them.

You should tell that to Sony with PlayStation 3/4.

 

[PaperBro64]

Turning the Wii U while downloading a game shouldnt be the cause of a brick in any way, ive done it before too and it never happened. If that was the case, it means the console was already faulty at purchase, afaik

Correct me if im wrong, but i dont recall early Wii U models being faulty at any time. And even if that was the case, you sold him a working Wii U, right?

it's important to know that the wii u was frozen at that time, meaning some sort of dead memory cell repair was probably going on.

 

[Itsuki235]

You should tell that to Sony with PlayStation 3/4.

Tell that to your CC company and have them do a charge back for faulty goods. You will get your money back from Sony that way.

 

[linkchidori]

it's important to know that the wii u was frozen at that time, meaning some sort of dead memory cell repair was probably going on.

Could be, that or the console died in that moment, by bad luck.

 

[PaperBro64]

Turning the Wii U while downloading a game shouldnt be the cause of a brick in any way, ive done it before too and it never happened. If that was the case, it means the console was already faulty at purchase, afaik

Correct me if im wrong, but i dont recall early Wii U models being faulty at any time. And even if that was the case, you sold him a working Wii U, right?

yes, he tested it himself, i didn't rush him in any way and he could have tested anything he wanted, he powered it on, went into a game, powered it off, saw that it was working completely and left.

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Could be, that or the console died in that moment, by bad luck.

which I had no control over, right?
yeah the early systems are pretty famous for faulty nand chips, in fact, nintendo repairs them for free I think.

 

[BvanBart]

Tell that to your CC company and have them do a charge back for faulty goods. You will get your money back from Sony that way.

Nope! Had to recover it myself or send it to them with a fine of 140 euro. (I ofcourse did recover it myself)

but in this case, I think they should meet half way. Now the buyer is left with a broken/ bricked Wii U and if he would return it the Wii U seller will have a broken system.

 

[linkchidori]

yes, he tested it himself, i didn't rush him in any way and he could have tested anything he wanted, he powered it on, went into a game, powered it off, saw that it was working completely and left.

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which I had no control over, right?
yeah the early systems are pretty famous for faulty nand chips, in fact, nintendo repairs them for free I think.

Well, to be fair....the guy didnt have any fault either, the console was probably already dead at that point. Anyways, what is exactly the ratio of faulty consoles?, tbh i dont think its really a reason not give a refund, because there was no way to really know if the Nand was faulty in any way, more than a suposition.

Another thing. When you sold it, did you specify the guy you wouldnt accept refunds?

 

[PaperBro64]

Well, to be fair....the guy didnt have any fault either, the console was probably already dead at that point. Anyways, what is exactly the ratio of faulty consoles?, tbh i dont think its really a reason not give a refund, because there was no way to really know if the Nand was faulty in any way, more than a suposition.

Another thing. When you sold it, did you specify the guy you wouldnt accept refunds?

Well, I'd been using it and it worked perfectly and I let him test out whatever he wanted, and i'm pretty sure there's a lot of those faulty consoles, I didn't tell him anything about any sort of guarantee or a refund.

 

[linkchidori]

Well, I'd been using it and it worked perfectly and I let him test out whatever he wanted, and i'm pretty sure there's a lot of those faulty consoles, I didn't tell him anything about any sort of guarantee or a refund.

Well, if you didnt, he has the right to ask for a refund, as there wasn´t any word about it. Btw, May 2014 Mario Kart 8 bundle is not really an early model, remember that the Wii U was launched on November 2012, and by then 1 and a half years had passed since the consoles release.

 

[PaperBro64]

Well, if you didnt, he has the right to ask for a refund, as there wasn´t any word about it. Btw, May 2014 Mario Kart 8 bundle is not really an early model, remember that the Wii U was launched on November 2012, and by then 1 and a half years had passed since the consoles release.

yeah but the reporting about the faulty nand chips started late 2014, so most people estimate it didn't end until at least then.

 

[linkchidori]

yeah but the reporting about the faulty nand chips started late 2014, so most people estimate it didn't end until at least then.

Could i see the source for the faulty nand chips?, im trying to search but i dont find it in Google, maybe im not searching very well hahahahaha

 

[godreborn]

I once sold a 360 with a flashed drive to someone on ebay. he claimed the system didn't work, so he returned it, but not without leaving a lego game in the disc drive. no idea if he knew what he was doing. I offered to return the disc to him, but he never responded. maybe he was embarrassed by the whole incident. I still have the game.

 

[PaperBro64]

Could i see the source for the faulty nand chips?, im trying to search but i dont find it in Google, maybe im not searching very well hahahahaha

i've been told that numerous times on the nintendo homebrew discord serv, it isn't a coincidence so many early systems have dead nands, if you're joined you can ask someone discord.gg/C29hYvh