Yet I compare it to the GBA and DS and see a fall so far from form it only furthers my thoughts on Nintendo going third party only.
dont know if you are being scarastic becuase the ds is probably the most sold portable console of all time ...
I care little for sales and more for games. Also I was holding the DS up as an example of a handheld done well; it had many great features, devs loved it, the homebrew scene was awesome, the console allowed for a lot and the result is something I enjoy to this day. The 3ds saw all that falter from where I sat, devs leave the system or have it play second fiddle, a bunch of pointless gimmicks, a bunch of questionable choices, and a system I don't even feel vaguely compelled to own as well as being happy to tell others to skip.
3ds is by no means a failure it has so manny great games.
DS- second highest selling console of all time only loosing for ps2
gb- 3rd highest selling console
gba-8 highest selling console
3ds 10 highest selling console.
the 3ds has sold preety damn well and it has a load of gems under his belt and devs didnt leavue the 3ds, the 3ds was launched at a time smartphones are a major thing and parents just let their kids play those awful free games on it and not buy a portable anymore thats why portable consoles dont sell that much anymore, even dispite that 3ds is the 10th best selling console of all time with over 65 million units sold, it has a huge catalog of games even tough manny people and devs just play the free smartphone games, if you want to look for a failled portable console you look at vita, its powerful and portable and it has failled very bad, if nintendo went 3rd party where would they release their portable games on? smartphones with in-app purchases?and micro transactions? is that what you really want? becuase they wouldnt release a portable pokemon game on a home console and vita is dead and sony has learned and they wont make any more portables anytime soon.
3ds is everything but a failure and what you said about great games is totaly false you have alot of amazing games to choose from.
if nintendo ever goes third party i hope they only sell games on smartphones full of micro transactions so guys like you start saying i would have prefered to have a portable console lol.
Last edited by pedro702,
Numbers just mean how fat some Japanese dude's bank account is. Once you get past a fairly small number (see something like the Nook and despite being a failure it still got devs doing things for it) you can probably sell enough to sustain yourself. To that end it is all about the games for me. I agree the vita probably counts as a failure, however it means little to this discussion and for similar reasons to my not having a 3ds I don't have a vita either, though watching the reviews of stuff for it these last few years it stands a better chance of me wanting to pick one up now it is dead and before the game prices shoot up when someone decides it is retro. Going further Sony seem to be doing gaming focused phones and tablets, something Nintendo could also be doing quite well if they wanted to.
I am not seeing the gems, though as I played the GBA and DS I am open to being fatigued by seeing the same game multiple times, though as I can still go back and do the GBA and DS (unlike final fantasy 6 and earlier style games which I am pretty much completely done with and have been for years).
So the 3ds was not even good enough to stave off phones that evolved past j2me. That is not selling me on the concept.
Why would a third party Nintendo be compelled to release things under inapp purchases and micro transactions models? Not that I find those inherently a bad thing; pay to win is a bad thing but micro transactions and inapp stuff does not mean that. Also what are all those amiibos? Is it somehow more palatable if you chuck an NFC tag in a 10 cent plastic statue?
Loads of devs left the 3ds as well. I used to do a feature where I looked back on GBA and DS games and part of that saw me click on lead devs, programmers... on mobygames and whatnot. So many of those that did well for the GBA and DS had moved to phones, and often did some of the top tier stuff there. Spin it another way too -- realistically you can pick a PS3 or a 360 and the game experience will be pretty much the same for that generation, I reckon you might be able to get almost there if you had a decent phone/tablet (to say nothing of the phone and table having their own exclusives and great little games) and skipped the 3ds.
"release a portable pokemon game on a home console"
That is their stupidity, also is something as weak in play as pokemon go can do all it did then imagine what a game like that with properly fleshed out mechanics would do. If they are going to continue with hardware designs as suspect as the 3ds family and switch
" if nintendo ever goes third party i hope they only sell games on smartphones full of micro transactions so guys like you start saying i would have prefered to have a portable console lol. "
a) what am I like? b) was being able to buy any DVD player (give or take region nonsense) and any DVD and play it such a bad thing? Why do we insist that being platform locked for games is a good thing and c) I would complain if they were pay to win type nonsense for, as previously mentioned, I like games.
I am not seeing the gems, though as I played the GBA and DS I am open to being fatigued by seeing the same game multiple times, though as I can still go back and do the GBA and DS (unlike final fantasy 6 and earlier style games which I am pretty much completely done with and have been for years).
So the 3ds was not even good enough to stave off phones that evolved past j2me. That is not selling me on the concept.
Why would a third party Nintendo be compelled to release things under inapp purchases and micro transactions models? Not that I find those inherently a bad thing; pay to win is a bad thing but micro transactions and inapp stuff does not mean that. Also what are all those amiibos? Is it somehow more palatable if you chuck an NFC tag in a 10 cent plastic statue?
Loads of devs left the 3ds as well. I used to do a feature where I looked back on GBA and DS games and part of that saw me click on lead devs, programmers... on mobygames and whatnot. So many of those that did well for the GBA and DS had moved to phones, and often did some of the top tier stuff there. Spin it another way too -- realistically you can pick a PS3 or a 360 and the game experience will be pretty much the same for that generation, I reckon you might be able to get almost there if you had a decent phone/tablet (to say nothing of the phone and table having their own exclusives and great little games) and skipped the 3ds.
"release a portable pokemon game on a home console"
That is their stupidity, also is something as weak in play as pokemon go can do all it did then imagine what a game like that with properly fleshed out mechanics would do. If they are going to continue with hardware designs as suspect as the 3ds family and switch
" if nintendo ever goes third party i hope they only sell games on smartphones full of micro transactions so guys like you start saying i would have prefered to have a portable console lol. "
a) what am I like? b) was being able to buy any DVD player (give or take region nonsense) and any DVD and play it such a bad thing? Why do we insist that being platform locked for games is a good thing and c) I would complain if they were pay to win type nonsense for, as previously mentioned, I like games.
OK I literally have no idea what you are talking about. It doesn't seem like you're replying to someone on my ignore list.
if they released a game that would play on all portable consoles you would still only get a choice of the vita or 3ds(well switch kinda now too) smartphones do not have buttons and those ugly and bad as hell tumors you attach to a phone to make it look its ready for any game that needs more than 3 buttons just dont work.
making companys not have dedicated devices to launch their games specialy portable games would be a major hinderence, becuase they could never make the game too complex becuase of button limitations since the game would also had to be playable on smartphones and such so they could sell more, so in a very short times any game would be very simplistic controlable due to the touch screen only tidbit most devices have.
having a dedicated device means if you have a game and a console for that game you put it in and works, while stuff like pc, just becuase you have a pc doesnt mean the game will run due to not having the requirments or being very an old game and not running on your recent os and you need to emulate an old Os and so on.
a 3ds game will always run like it should in all 3ds consoles and such.
Last edited by pedro702,
You can make games that do not need buttons, the DS demonstrated that quite handily. Going a bit further if devs are supposed to be learning how to make games for VR, internet and such then they can surely learn to
PC controllers were a joke for many years, and then Microsoft stuck USB on the 360 one (previously many seeking something good had used various flavours of adapter for console controllers) and all of a sudden we had the de facto PC controller almost until this day (and where not that it is the PS4 one). Despite Nintendo not making great controllers since about the SNES I can still see them being able to capture a good chunk of the market there -- "this is our controller design, for the next 5 years all our titles will be made to play on it, not to mention all the retro games we will be sticking in an emulator wrapper (though they would call it virtual console or something), here is the API for any developer which wants to use it, use it with our blessing and we might even include you in our little shop" seems like a good business plan to me.
If old phones and such have enough that they can run their OS overhead and an emulator to run a "real game" then they surely have enough to do such a thing on whatever passes for bare metal. Equally having a fixed target means devs have to play down to your device (the 3ds was outclassed by phones almost from day one, and outclassed by fairly run of the mill phones from about year 1.5, today not even Chinese junk mills turn out things as weak as a 3ds) and then skip it; programming is now easy enough that you don't gain much from having to go down to hardware. Backwards compatibility is largely a solved problem as well, if you even care (I like such things but the world seems to have spoken and it got to join splitscreen, splitscreen co-op, space sims, point and click adventures and seemingly game lobbies in things we all liked but unfortunately for me seem to have largely become a thing of the past).
PC controllers were a joke for many years, and then Microsoft stuck USB on the 360 one (previously many seeking something good had used various flavours of adapter for console controllers) and all of a sudden we had the de facto PC controller almost until this day (and where not that it is the PS4 one). Despite Nintendo not making great controllers since about the SNES I can still see them being able to capture a good chunk of the market there -- "this is our controller design, for the next 5 years all our titles will be made to play on it, not to mention all the retro games we will be sticking in an emulator wrapper (though they would call it virtual console or something), here is the API for any developer which wants to use it, use it with our blessing and we might even include you in our little shop" seems like a good business plan to me.
If old phones and such have enough that they can run their OS overhead and an emulator to run a "real game" then they surely have enough to do such a thing on whatever passes for bare metal. Equally having a fixed target means devs have to play down to your device (the 3ds was outclassed by phones almost from day one, and outclassed by fairly run of the mill phones from about year 1.5, today not even Chinese junk mills turn out things as weak as a 3ds) and then skip it; programming is now easy enough that you don't gain much from having to go down to hardware. Backwards compatibility is largely a solved problem as well, if you even care (I like such things but the world seems to have spoken and it got to join splitscreen, splitscreen co-op, space sims, point and click adventures and seemingly game lobbies in things we all liked but unfortunately for me seem to have largely become a thing of the past).
smartphones with like 3 years cant even install newer apps since android doesnt not update those models further(talking about samsung phones not some crap made in china) so you have to buy a new phone same for apple and so on so its the shame shitty situation companys will always do to make you buy games.
also ds/gba simplicity made manny games work very wonky. same for any console without dual analogs(even psp games), any 3d game where you have to look and move at the same time , if you restric moving or looking one at a time the game becomes wonky i can remenber most fps games or open 3d games and even zelda games on the ds, those awful touch only movement made manny people just striaght out hate the games, if theose games were made with actual controlls there would have been much more people liking and buying them.
Also the gc still had a kickass controller but i agree, n64,wii,wiiu controllers sucked the switch one when its in portable mode its preety generic and functional and since its how i use it, i dont complain about it at all.
Also restricting games to a controller is also restrcking them companys would all make their own special controller and say our games need this new controller becuase it has a touch screen thing like ps4 one, or nintendo made their controller and said this game needs this controller becuase of hd rumble, and such, companys would just make yet another way to lock games to sell their hardware.
backwards compatibility is not an easy solved problem at all, when consoles who use outright diferent architeture they are very hard to emulate unless your device is powerfull as hell, you cant just run a ps3,xbox360,wiiu emulator on a smartphone or even on a regular pc, you need a monster pc, sure running stuff until the ps1,n64 days is easy on everything right about now but everything after that is extremely hard and needs a crapload of work, there is a reason why sony hasnt made a ps3 emulator and just streams the games, it would take alot of money to even creat a ps3 emulator that would run smooth and play all games on ps4 considering the ps3 architeture and cell gpu being totaly diferent things from ps4 or even pcs.
I agree the phone market could use a kick in the arse about some of that, though many models manage it. Equally Nintendo could make a flagship model (I am sure even Samsung would cream their jeans for a chance to do that) and show us how it is done. Going further do we get to consider mid life upgrades like the GBC, GBA SP, DS lite* (I would say DSi but hahaha) and n3ds?
*it was the general opinion of many around here that anybody which did not upgrade to the DS lite was either a masochist, blind or a fool. Similar story for the GBA SP give or take the afterburner and that everybody around here also seemed to enjoy a bit of emulation.
I also agree certain gameplay types don't work with certain control schemes and screen sizes, especially if you want people to play cross platform (I always like those times where keyboard and mouse is pitted against console controllers for shooting games).
I am souring more and more on the GC controllers as the years go on. The sticks and lack of a left bumper just seem like serious oversights to me.
I would also hate to see https://xkcd.com/927/ happen for phone controllers, however we had it for the PC of all things with the 360 controller and that makes me hopeful. Though I suppose that would require Nintendo to embrace some kind of open source philosophy (you know how Android rose up and conquered the market) and as cool as that would be I can't see Nintendo doing that as they seem to be another Japanese company that did not see the sands shifting beneath their feet.
Nintendo get them, maybe google, samsung, a few game devs and such around a table and make a big coalition and we could have something nice. It is why I bring up the DVD model a lot. We also have directX and opengl in games. Companies can also compete on size and shape, button types (mine features real clunking microswitches or something), features like macros and turbo... you know like all phones which run android but might have better cameras or something.
I meant backwards compatibility on phones. There it is largely a solved problem if the devs have the will.
*it was the general opinion of many around here that anybody which did not upgrade to the DS lite was either a masochist, blind or a fool. Similar story for the GBA SP give or take the afterburner and that everybody around here also seemed to enjoy a bit of emulation.
I also agree certain gameplay types don't work with certain control schemes and screen sizes, especially if you want people to play cross platform (I always like those times where keyboard and mouse is pitted against console controllers for shooting games).
I am souring more and more on the GC controllers as the years go on. The sticks and lack of a left bumper just seem like serious oversights to me.
I would also hate to see https://xkcd.com/927/ happen for phone controllers, however we had it for the PC of all things with the 360 controller and that makes me hopeful. Though I suppose that would require Nintendo to embrace some kind of open source philosophy (you know how Android rose up and conquered the market) and as cool as that would be I can't see Nintendo doing that as they seem to be another Japanese company that did not see the sands shifting beneath their feet.
Nintendo get them, maybe google, samsung, a few game devs and such around a table and make a big coalition and we could have something nice. It is why I bring up the DVD model a lot. We also have directX and opengl in games. Companies can also compete on size and shape, button types (mine features real clunking microswitches or something), features like macros and turbo... you know like all phones which run android but might have better cameras or something.
I meant backwards compatibility on phones. There it is largely a solved problem if the devs have the will.
well you dont need midlife console upgrades to play the game but you might need a new phones becuase android might not release the latest os on your model and you cant install it even if your phone is more than capable of running the game or app, the other day my 4 yo samsumg phone i wanted to install a banking app to my phone and i couldnt becuase it needs the latest android os and the os isnt available on my model and it isnt upgradable unless i jailbreak it.
just becuase android is is open source the phones arent, and when samsung or any other brand wants you to buy a new one they just stop updating you OS and then more and more apps start to stop working becuase they require the latest os so it doesnt matter if you create an open os when the devices that use them arent open and are still controlled by a company, in the end its the same deal as consoles.
Up to this day i still dont know why dvds and blurays are region locked still, heck even consoles dropped the region locking but i guess movie studios dont want to.
I've seen you have to back up your version of the word "failure" before... Perhaps you should put an asterisk by it every time you use it and an explanation of your definition of it in your signature because quite frankly it's beyond bizarre. You can't really blame other people for not understanding that you mean "it doesn't have many games I like" when you call s system a failure. I honestly don't think *anybody* else uses the term in that way.
I might expand in the future. That said when actually discussing sales I have often had "it is about the quality of the games" thrown at me, commonly when talking to Americans about the N64's failure, though at the same time the games there are a bit thin on the ground as well.
Indeed one can talk about the quality of the games when trying to make an assessment of whether a console is any *good* or not, but it doesn't make sense when you're talking about a console being a failure or success. If that were the case I'd be claiming that the Saturn and 32X were successful consoles while the PS1 was a total failure. And the world would think I'm nuts
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Well looking at the hardware the Switch is shit but good enough. The 3DS is very outdated and needs to die.
That is... If you use a powered accessory. The Switch already uses motion controls for Splatoon 2. Multiplying the screen by 2 wouldn't be much of a drag.
I would argue otherwise.
You can have a failure of an education despite passing all your exams.
Going further if we are talking numbers then what counts as a success? A relative drop in market share is the sort of thing business leaders get fired for. Equally while you might only be as good as your last product you do get compared against what came before... though I suppose if you are comparing against a wii u the switch looks rosy.
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