Gaming For Picross players

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

While waiting for the next Picross game to come out, I decided to try that similar game on the Switch called Pictooi. I came across this puzzle. So what would be your next move? And the first page of their tutorial says NO GUESSING.

They need to fire the quality control guy on the spot. Glad I didn't pay for the game, at least.

impeeza · Aug 12, 2022

I guess you technically can solve without guessing if you are VERY lucky :rofl2:

or you travel from future and give you a hint

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

impeeza said:
I guess you technically can solve without guessing if you are VERY lucky or you travel from future and give you a hint

Oh, it can easily be solved, since the game doesn't give you time penalties for guessing wrong, but it's just funny how they blatantly lie to us in the tutorial. This game is a poor man version of Picross.

nWo · Aug 12, 2022

Up to down, 4ht row (4, 3) there is the clue. There is no problem on this!!!

impeeza · Aug 12, 2022

Look the one just show:

how in the hell can you solve this?!!!!!!!

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

nWo said:
Up to down, 4ht row (4, 3) there is the clue. There is no problem on this!!!

I humbly have some experience solving nonograms, but I don't see this line being solvable without guessing. Please elaborate.

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

impeeza said:
View attachment 322270

Look the one just show:

how in the hell can you solve this?!!!!!!!

This is OK. You put Xs everywhere. But you're right, this is fucked up.

nWo · Aug 12, 2022

Dust2dust said:
I humbly have some experience solving nonograms, but I don't see this line being solvable without guessing. Please elaborate.

Usually on hard / big picross levels, you don't guess by random click. I count from side to side, the rows with bigger numbers / combinations. In this case, many columns have small digits, so you look for the bigger ones, count from side to side, and see if any square collides from either side. That's what happened here. No guessing / random clicking, just looking for the bigger numbers.

There is, indeed, no guessing in that.

nWo · Aug 12, 2022

Same with 5th row (up to down), the numbers collide without remedy, There are some hints.

By the way, I didn't know this game exists. Will try it. Love picross. But I can't find it on my favourite page.

impeeza · Aug 12, 2022

Dust2dust said:
This is OK. You put Xs everywhere. But you're right, this is fucked up.

Didn't work, was the first thing I try:

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

nWo said:
Same with 5th row (up to down), the numbers collide without remedy, There are some hints.

By the way, I didn't know this game exists. Will try it. Love picross. But I can't find it on my favourite page.

If you can solve that without guessing, I have to admit your science is higher than mine! The game is not bad, except for some guessing (maybe not to you, though), but the main problem with it, is the loading time. They are extremely long. Be prepared.

kidcharlemagne · Aug 12, 2022

nWo said:
Usually on hard / big picross levels, you don't guess by random click. I count from side to side, the rows with bigger numbers / combinations. In this case, many columns have small digits, so you look for the bigger ones, count from side to side, and see if any square collides from either side. That's what happened here. No guessing / random clicking, just looking for the bigger numbers.

There is, indeed, no guessing in that.

Here is a grid showing all possibilities for (4,3) on a row with 15 cells. There are no cells that must inevitably be filled, are there?
|EDIT| Same for (2,3,4)

Joe88 · Aug 12, 2022

You beat all 10 picross switch games?

Dust2dust · Aug 12, 2022

Joe88 said:
You beat all 10 picross switch games?

All Switch games, including the Mega Picross puzzles, and also all 3DS games. I'm starved for more. It's an addiction.

zxr750j · Aug 12, 2022

I did think the kemono friends one was a bit... "Japanese"

hippy dave · Aug 12, 2022

zxr750j said:
I did think the kemono friends one was a bit... "Japanese"

Ah yes, Picross For Furries... it's the one I'm playing right now actually (because I've also finished all the other Picross games), and the art is too way out there for my taste. I just wanna do puzzles.

This game in OP looks pretty shonky, I guess it doesn't have a "mark" option like the official Picross games so you can test combinations out without setting them for real?

Another shonky example - before I found this furry game, I also tried another third party one called "nonogram minimal" - it was actually fine most of the way through, but toward the end, the puzzles were ambiguous. They had the actual design in the middle, and wavy line patterns around the edges/corners. In the ambiguous puzzles there was more than one solution which would fit the number patterns for the wavy line parts, but of course the game was only expecting one of those solutions so you'd have to use trial and error until you got the right one. First up there were only a couple of combinations to try, but as the final puzzles had more and more ambiguous number patterns the number of possible solutions went up exponentially and I stopped playing the damn game

FAST6191 · Aug 12, 2022

Dust2dust said:
All Switch games, including the Mega Picross puzzles, and also all 3DS games. I'm starved for more. It's an addiction.

There are some homebrew versions on the DS that are pretty good, and can include custom puzzles.
https://gbatemp.net/threads/looking-for-games-like-picross.342351/ https://gbatemp.net/threads/nds-picross-20121107-from-meraman.341961/

As far as the puzzle in the opening post that does appear to not work for the standard stretch the options to the extremes, get the overlaps and iterate from there (better people will close down options quicker but you could just do basic iteration) loop that many find so enjoyable.
That would require some kind of combinatorial probabilities and staking which is possibly maths beyond that which most will be able to do in their head (never mind have an intuitive model for), and possibly still count as/be guessing albeit educated guessing.

LeMageFro · Aug 12, 2022

I don't have time to go further but you can at least add all these red and purple crosses without guessing :

Start with the bottom left red cross and check what would happen if there were a black spot there, you'll see that you quickly get to a contradiction. Then work your way up with the same logic, and then do the same on the second column. The two purple crosses are quite harder and will require you to visualise several steps before getting to the contradiction, but if I didn't make a mistake they should be guaranteed too.
I assume by continuing this "ad absurdum" kind of reasoning you will end up unlocking the puzzle without requiring a guess.

hippy dave · Aug 12, 2022

LeMageFro said:
I don't have time to go further but you can at least add all these red and purple crosses without guessing :
View attachment 322287

Start with the bottom left red cross and check what would happen if there were a black spot there, you'll see that you quickly get to a contradiction. Then work your way up with the same logic, and then do the same on the second column. The two purple crosses are quite harder and will require you to visualise several steps before getting to the contradiction, but if I didn't make a mistake they should be guaranteed too.
I assume by continuing this "ad absurdum" kind of reasoning you will end up unlocking the puzzle without requiring a guess.

Good job, but this is what the circular "marks" are for in the name-brand games, so you can figure these steps out without holding it all in your head. Fair enough for people who enjoy the extra challenge of doing it mentally, but my memory isn't up to the task. I can logic all day but I can't remember shit

LeMageFro · Aug 12, 2022

hippy dave said:
Good job, but this is what the circular "marks" are for in the name-brand games, so you can figure these steps out without holding it all in your head. Fair enough for people who enjoy the extra challenge of doing it mentally, but my memory isn't up to the task. I can logic all day but I can't remember shit

Ho good to know, I've never played this version of the game and did this under paint ^^ .

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