Net Neutrality: what it is, and why you should care

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UPDATE: It's been voted for repeal. The FCC took Net Neutrality to a vote, and it was 3-2, in favor of repeal. This doesn't mean overnight upheaval, but things will certainly change, for better or worse, in due time.
If you've been on the internet at all the past week, there's a high chance that you've heard of something called "Net Neutrality", and you've also likely heard that there might be huge changes to your usage of the internet entirely. This post serves as a quick information briefing on what Net Neutrality is, what could happen if it's repealed, and the current events going on regarding it, and just general visibility to let the community in general be informed.

What is this Net Neutrality thing?



The basic definition of network neutrality is simple: all internet traffic is considered and treated equally. It was established just a bit under three years ago, in February 2015. It prevented companies like Comcast Xfinity and AT&T U-verse from speeding up, or slowing down certain sites based upon content. If you remember, back in July 2017, mobile provider Verizon admitted to targeting Netflix traffic, and specifically throttling it, negatively affecting customers' use of Netflix. Going back to 2014, there were also issues with Comcast customers, and, that's right, Netflix users, as connections to Netflix were notoriously slow. Netflix then entered a legal deal with Comcast, in order to have Netflix connections be faster than they previously were. The 2014 incident was pre-net neutrality, and shows that before the law was enacted, certain sites like Netflix were indeed slowed, and had to specifically bargain with large telecommunication monopolies like Comcast to get fair speeds out to their customers.

In April 2017, the chairman of the Federal Communications Commission (FCC), Ajit Pai, revealed that he had plans to repeal net neutrality. It's worth noting that Pai was once the Associate General Counsel of Verizon Communications, an incredibly high up position with an ISP, who we've stated before as having throttled websites in the past.

Pai's statements on the matter included saying such things as "[the government] would be able to stop micromanaging the internet" and that the FCC and internet service providers would simply have to be "transparent about their practices so that consumers can buy a service plan that's best for them". Shortly after, Comcast began vocally supporting these statements, claiming that government regulation of the internet has been harming innovation and investments of Comcast. David Cohen, the company's Chief Diversity Officer, said that "customers would be clearly informed on our practices [...] Comcast maintains that it does and will not block, throttle, or discriminate against lawful content".

Within the movement for repealing net neutrality, also comes with power being given to the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC would then have the ability to legally charge internet service providers that were not made clear to customers.

You may notice, that within any of the claims made by Pai or Comcast, that equal traffic was never made the focus, instead putting emphasis on making sure these monopolies must be clear and transparent about what they do, but never laying down any solid rules about what they need to be transparent about or why. And, of course, if the FTC were to go after AT&T, Comcast, Verizon, Time Warner, or other assorted companies for not being transparent, these legal cases would find themselves taking years to make their way to court, allowing for them to have their way with their customers until a definitive legal ruling. Therein lies the first batch of unease and controversy with the repeal.

In short, net neutrality is a fairly new regulation, which allows for equal traffic between all sites while using the internet. The chairman of the FCC and former higher-up of Verizon wants to repeal it, however. This would allow less government interference with ISPs, but would also allow those ISPs to do what they wish, so long as they're "transparent".

Does repealing Net Neutrality have any benefits?


Spoiler alert: not really

From the inception of the internet, and up until 2015, Americans have gone without net neutrality. Ajit Pai claims that should we not have net neutrality anymore, more rural areas would be able to have more companies and providers, and it would allow for more competition and choice for the consumer. However, these smaller companies would also have to fight it out with established services, with years of experience and infrastructure refinements.

As a side note, I've spent thirty minutes researching a potential "pro" argument. I've not found many that seem reasonable. I've listed in the spoiler tag below arguments from other websites and blogs.

Green Garage Blog: While net neutrality allows for freedom of speech, the downside is that almost anything can be posted to the internet. This means that the cruelest or insensitive information imaginable can end up on the internet, and as a result, it can cause a lot of problems from people that otherwise wouldn’t be prone to being under the microscope of criticism. This means that people can post cruel, intimidating, or other harassing messages and often get away with it thanks to free speech legislation. So it can be a very toxic environment for a lot of people to put up with.

Vittana: Reduced income from internet uses limits infrastructure improvements.
There are certain businesses and high-use individuals who consume large amounts of bandwidth every month. If net neutrality was removed, these high-level consumers would be asked to pay more for what they consume. This added income could then be used to upgrade the infrastructure of each internet service provider, making it possible for advanced fiber networks to be installed in many communities.

AEI: But in many instances, fast lanes, zero-rating, and the like benefit customers. In separate research, both former FCC Chief Economist Michael Katz (with Ben Hermalin) and I (with Janice Hauge) showed that fast lanes benefit small content providers in their attempts to compete with established industry leaders. AEI scholar Roslyn Layton has shown that elderly and low-income consumers benefit from zero-rating services.

Basically, the only benefit would be if America's current economy wasn't dominated by monopolistic ISPs. Below is an interview with Ajit Pai, showing his perspective.


Scrapping these rules, Pai told Reason's Nick Gillespie, won't harm consumers or the public interest because there was no reason for them in the first place. The rationales were mere "phantoms that were conjured up by people who wanted the FCC for political reasons to overregulate the internet," Pai told Gillespie. "We were not living in a digital dystopia in the years leading up to 2015."

If left in place, however, the Title II rules could harm the commercial internet, which Pai described as "one of the most incredible free market innovations in history."

"Companies like Google and Facebook and Netflix became household names precisely because we didn't have the government micromanaging how the internet would operate," said Pai, who noted that the Clinton-era decision not to regulate the Internet like a phone utility or a broadcast network was one of the most important factors in the rise of our new economy.

Pai also pushed back against claims that he's a right-wing radical who's "fucking things up."

"[I ascribe to] the very radical, right-wing position that the Clinton administration basically got it right when it came to digital infrastructure."


What happens if/when this gets repealed, and what does this mean for you?



The worst part of this, is that there's no definitive answer of what WILL happen, only what CAN happen. What has people concerned, though, is the potential things that larger ISPs can do with this new power, should net neutrality be repealed. Internet service providers could slow access to specific sites, and speed up others, in theory, others specifically being sites who pay ISPs for faster access, and those partnered or in contracts with ISPs. Websites like Google, Amazon, Reddit, Etsy, Netflix, and many more have all broadcast their support of net neutrality, stating that without these rules in place thanks to net neutrality, internet providers would become gatekeepers to the internet, restricting what customers can see. Without definitive government restrictions, these companies could be free to split access to the internet into packages, like cable TV, indeed making true on the intention of lowering the cost of internet access, but also making it more difficult and expensive to see all of the internet, as you can right now.

Likely, what will happen, though everything is up in the air, is that certain ISPs will utilize what's called "fast lanes" and "zero rating". Fast lanes are sort of like what we talked about at the start, with Netflix and Comcast. Currently, these fast lanes and zero rating are used with mobile phone data. AT&T customers can watch DirecTV (owned by AT&T) via their mobile data, without it counting towards their monthly cap. These rules could be applied to home internet as well; if you're a Comcast user, and you want to watch Hulu (owned by NBC-Universal-Comcast), maybe your connection to Hulu will be lightning fast, thanks to these theoretical fast lanes, and they won't go towards your Comcast monthly 1 Terabyte home cap. But what if you want to watch Netflix? Either Netflix will have much lower picture quality, or take a longer time to connect to. And if Netflix pays a fee, or gets into a contract once again with Comcast, then that potentially means that Netflix's increased costs move down to the consumer, who also now has to pay more for a service as well.

What can we do?



The only thing left to do is let your voice be heard. Social media has exploded without people decrying the impending repeal of net neutrality, and the negatives that it would entail, to the point of where the majority of Reddit has been plastered with net neutrality posts.

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The FCC will take the repeal to a vote on December 14, 2017. It is highly predicted that the repeal will pass, and net neutrality will come to an end. Millions have taken to the site "battleforthenet" and "callmycongress" to contact their local representatives and congressmen in order to show that American citizens don't want net neutrality destroyed.

You can learn more at the links below. Hopefully this is helpful in describing what net neutrality is, and why it shouldn't be taken away.

:arrow:Techcrunch: These are the arguments against net neutrality and why they're wrong

:arrow: Extra Credits: What a closed internet means

:arrow:Phillip DeFranco: The Internet is under attack

:arrow:Save the internet: What you need to know


:arrow:Ars Technica: RIP net neutrality
 
Hey, way resort to using insult bullshit, dude, but aren't they repealing NN today anyways? And insult me one more time, and you're fucking blocked, so shut it.
It's playful banter, I do it with everyone in the thread. If you're offended by 'nincompoop' chances are you're gonna be pretty offended by everything else in this thread.

Seriously though where did you hear NN is being removed? You can't remove an idea. You can only remove regulations that follow it's philosophy. They're adding *more* regulations after, as I posted 3 links demonstrating, the rules are currently being abused, and the proposal is to combat that.

How you cling to the notion that the internet is going to be come deregulated as a whole is beyond me, probably the dipshit media, but you shouldn't believe everything the media tells you, regardless of it's political stance.
 
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It's playful banter, I do it with everyone in the thread. If you're offended by 'nincompoop' chances are you're gonna be pretty offended by everything else in this thread.

Seriously though where did you hear NN is being removed? You can't remove an idea. You can only remove regulations that follow it's philosophy. They're adding *more* regulations after, as I posted 3 links demonstrating, the rules are currently being abused, and the proposal is to combat that.

How you cling to the notion that the internet is going to be come deregulated as a whole is beyond me, probably the dipshit media, but you shouldn't believe everything the media tells you, regardless of it's political stance.

You honestly trust ISPs to play fair to the millions of people that use the internet? You honestly trust them not to royally screw it over for us? Comcast/Xfinity, Verizon? I wouldn't trust myself to throw a football further than I can trust two monopolizing ISPs. Thanks to Comcast, we never got Google Fiber because they blocked them from entering my hometown, how is that fair? And you expect them to be fair and balanced?
 
Last edited by the_randomizer,
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Hey, way resort to using insults, dude, but aren't they repealing NN today anyways? And insult me one more time, and you're fucking blocked, so shut it.

Resorting to insults only implicates an inability to have a proper debate
nice edit, you've seen firsthand I can carry a proper debate, the same cannot be said for some of my opponents.
 
Perfectly understandable, and thank you so much for doing so. All I want out of this is for people to educate themselves before forming an opinion, and to stop pretending the FCC's plan is to kill net neutrality when net neutrality was killing itself.
Thats goes back on the original point I made which was wording and ways around it with loopholes when I said this.
It's not the idea of title 2 thats the problem, which its intent was to stop ISP's from Blackmailing and Throttling smaller companies. Its the wording and ISP's finding ways around that. Which is exactly what I've been talking about this whole time.

And you replied with this post in Bold text.
No, I don't think you quite understand.

The people who put your precious Title II Order in place literally said themselves that an ISP is allowed to not adhere to the regulations of their own will, because it would not classify them as the catch all broadband service they proposed.

Let me repeat that for you.

If an ISP wants to disobey the rules, they can. The only reason they haven't is because no one would subscribe to them.
So I wasn't off with what I said. And were only trying to improve the wording of NN.
 
You honestly trust ISPs to play fair to the millions of people that use the internet? You honestly trust them not to royally screw it over for us? Comcast/Xfinity, Verizon? I wouldn't trust myself to throw a football.
>I don't trust ISPs at all!
>but I sure do trust the government who has power over us all!
my friend I think we have a lot more problems here than just your false perception of the proposal.
 
>I don't trust ISPs at all!
>but I sure do trust the government who has power over us all!
my friend I think we have a lot more problems here than just your false perception of the proposal.

Yes, it's called the fearmongering brought upon by ubiquitous liberal media outlets.
 
Yes, it's called the fearmongering brought upon by ubiquitous liberal media outlets.
No, it has nothing to do with liberals. Just retards. You've bought into the fearmongering yourself and yet are strangely critical of it. Truly, the inner workings of your mind are an enigma.

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Thats goes back on the original point I made which was wording and ways around it with loopholes when I said this.
It's not the idea of title 2 thats the problem, which its intent was to stop ISP's from Blackmailing and Throttling smaller companies. Its the wording and ISP's finding ways around that. Which is exactly what I've been talking about this whole time.

And you replied with this post in Bold text.

So I wasn't off with what I said. And were only trying to improve the wording of NN.
And what I was getting at is that I don't think even that was the idea. I'm not sure what the idea was, but I don't think any solid, sane proposal could legitimately give ISPs the authority to disregard every single one of the rules in good faith, at least not one that's trying to prevent such behavior. Giving them a clause that allows them to do so is disastrous -- even if it isn't immediate -- and it isn't ISPs finding a way around it, but more "hey guys, here's the keys to my backdoor, please break into my house!"
 
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No, it has nothing to do with liberals. Just retards. You've bought into the fearmongering yourself and yet are strangely critical of it. Truly, the inner workings of your mind are an enigma.

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And what I was getting at is that I don't think even that was the idea. I'm not sure what the idea was, but I don't think any solid, sane proposal could legitimately give ISPs the authority to disregard every single one of the rules in good faith, at least not one that's trying to prevent such behavior. Giving them a clause that allows them to do so is disastrous -- even if it isn't immediate -- and it isn't ISPs finding a way around it, but more "hey guys, here's the keys to my backdoor, please break into my house!"


PM sent your way, more details there.
 
How do I have to be a retard or brainwashed by the evil liberal news to trust that repealing net neutrality is a bad thing, especially since the leader of the movement made a video explaining how it was ok because you can still use fidget spinners and do the Harlem shake afterwards. That's this argument in favor of it. On the other hand it is clear that this makes it far more feasible for people to be screwed over by isps, and there's no argument against that.
 
No, it has nothing to do with liberals. Just retards. You've bought into the fearmongering yourself and yet are strangely critical of it. Truly, the inner workings of your mind are an enigma.

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And what I was getting at is that I don't think even that was the idea. I'm not sure what the idea was, but I don't think any solid, sane proposal could legitimately give ISPs the authority to disregard every single one of the rules in good faith, at least not one that's trying to prevent such behavior. Giving them a clause that allows them to do so is disastrous -- even if it isn't immediate -- and it isn't ISPs finding a way around it, but more "hey guys, here's the keys to my backdoor, please break into my house!"
I wonder why Title 2 was even proposed in the first place, if its basically the same as title 1 and they can do what they want.
Is it to give people the illusion that they have protection?
 
I wonder why Title 2 was even proposed in the first place, if its basically the same as title 1 and they can do what they want.
Is it to give people the illusion that they have protection?
I'm not a government conspiracy theorist -- in fact i'm super critical of them -- but out of all the shit I've seen, I'm gonna say that. Has there been any outrage or protest from ISPs when Title II's order was proposed? Because if not, I think we have a money trail to look at.

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How do I have to be a retard or brainwashed by the evil liberal news to trust that repealing net neutrality is a bad thing, especially since the leader of the movement made a video explaining how it was ok because you can still use fidget spinners and do the Harlem shake afterwards. That's this argument in favor of it. On the other hand it is clear that this makes it far more feasible for people to be screwed over by isps, and there's no argument against that.
Actually me bucko, there's a huge argument against that: You're totally wrong. Like 100% wrong.

I'm gonna wear my fucking wrists out I swear.

Okay. Net Neutrality is not being repealed. The title II rules allow ISPs to ignore the rules and strip their classification as broadband services so that they can throttle, block, and do whatever they want as much as they want. Do you seriously think we need to keep these rules? Read this and tell me you want these fucking rules tied to your internet. I dare you.

https://readplaintext.com/why-the-fcc-s-net-neutrality-rules-could-unravel-cc26c6b96418

Now tell me you don't want a proposal that says throttling isn't allowed, that you're not allowed to discriminate content online, and especially those offering competing services are not allowed to fuck with other people's content if it competes with them.

upload_2017-12-14_11-16-21.png


Because I fully support the FCC's new proposal. I dislike that ISPs won't have to disclose their packet loss rates but it's whatever, I can find that shit online.
 
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I'm not a government conspiracy theorist -- in fact i'm super critical of them -- but out of all the shit I've seen, I'm gonna say that. Has there been any outrage or protest from ISPs when Title II's order was proposed? Because if not, I think we have a money trail to look at.
Im super critical of conspiracy theories too but....

Not all government conspiracy's are wrong though. Its been proven that the government used JFK's assassination and the so called magic bullet to distract people, so that they are more focused on solving the mystery of JFK then actually paying attention to whats going on in their government. There were documents on this.

This does sound like a conspiracy with why Title 2 even came into existence in the first place.
 
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>but I sure do trust the government who has power over us all!
...
.-.
fuck the government
they have no power over me aslong as I have my own free will!
they may have power over simple minded people like you but aslong as governments exist people will disobey
I will never trust any government or allow them to control me with laws
 
Im super critical of conspiracy theories too but....

Not all government conspiracy's are wrong though. Its been proven that the government used JFK's assassination and the so called magic bullet to distract people, so that they are more focused on solving the mystery of JFK then actually paying attention to whats going on in their government. There were documents on this.

This does sound like a conspiracy with why Title 2 even came into existence in the first place.
Oh don't get me wrong, there are a lot of conspiracies that went on, and the government's pretty good at causing (and subsequently quelling, though not as good) dissent and confusion. Maybe Title II was part of that. That said I'm not going to assume the most inane shit about the new proposal since it's clear that A) the previous people in power have fucking LOATHED Trump since the day he started his campaign and even moreso now that he's won and is in the office so they're probably the ones pushing this agenda so hard, and B) there's no real evidence or even a motive. ISPs wouldn't line the pockets of Ajit Pai to give them more regulations and prevent them from sucking the money out of customers. I have no idea where this meme comes from but it doesn't align with the proposal.

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Ok so say you're right. Then why is this brain dead idiot making videos on fidget spinners and dank memes and claiming you should support him... for memes? You trust someone like that to manage how isps function?
Oh yeah because Obama was so much fucking better making wisecracks left and right, posting memes with Joe Biden, and even partaking in the "thanks obama" meme, right?

Seriously dude this is the weakest argument anyone can pull. Don't call anyone braindead if you haven't read the proposal.

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...
.-.
fuck the government
they have no power over me aslong as I have my own free will!
they may have power over simple minded people like you but aslong as governments exist people will disobey
I will never trust any government or allow them to control me with laws
You have free will -- just as all humans do -- but you do not have freedom from consequence. The point of the government is to keep rules fair for the people, to protect them in war through the military, and keep them organized. The problem is many governments -- such as the CIA, as people see from the vault 7 leaks -- will get too fucking uppity and do stuff they clearly ain't supposed to do.

Government is a necessity. Tyrants are not. Sic simper tyrannosaurs, ave nex alea, and so on.
 
Let's see:
Out of touch minority resorts to memes to catch the attention of teens across the country as a stupid PR move?

Yeah. I did.
Literally you just pulled a "but obama!!!". This isn't about Obama, I never said anything about him and he's irrelivent to this issue you're literally diverting the fact Ajit is a shit head by saying "But this other guy is bad too"
 
Literally you just pulled a "but obama!!!". This isn't about Obama, I never said anything about him and he's irrelivent to this issue you're literally diverting the fact Ajit is a shit head by saying "But this other guy is bad too"
No, I'm not pulling a "but obama"
I'm pulling a "these guys did the same things, it was harmless then and it's harmless now and it's hardly a reason to hate anyone for it." Quit being ridiculous. You're searching for the most neurotic reasons to shit on Ajit Pai. Either Obama was a braindead idiot for doing it, or Ajit Pai wasn't, but there's no way to have both here.
 
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