Hacking The confusion needs to be cleared on FPGA updates and clones

[spinner09]

On Gateway's website, it says that the new 2.0 firmware update requires an FPGA update to be able to work, due to the multirom patch.
Also, there have been rumors that clones (r4i/3dslink/etc) can't update their FPGA because they have cut jtag pins (or something).

So, can any techno person put these rumors to bed and clear up the confusion; Does GW's 2.0 FW really require an update, or are they only doing it to freeze out clones? Are the clones unable to update their FPGA? If so, isn't there any hardware hack/trick to update it? (I remember reading a while back about an old r4 card that could be updated by cutting or soldering a certain pin). Can't you get multirom working without an FPGA update?

 

[Xzi]

I don't think there's any guarantee that 2.0 will require an FPGA update. But if it does, yeah, the clones are done. Which isn't such a bad thing for them, considering they can and most likely will start selling new hardware under new aliases. Means more money for them, and clone customers are none the wiser.

 

[Huntereb]

Can anyone confirm that the clone hardware cannot be updated?

 

[Xzi]

Can anyone confirm that the clone hardware cannot be updated?

It's been confirmed several times. JTAG is required to update the FPGA, and the JTAG pins are not connected on the clone hardware.

 

[Huntereb]

It's been confirmed several times. JTAG is required to update the FPGA, and the JTAG pins are not connected on the clone hardware.

Do we have proof from someone who's actually done research into this?

 

[Xzi]

Do we have proof from someone who's actually done research into this?

Let me find the thread.

 

[Huntereb]

Let me find the thread.

Thanks.

 

[sudeki300]

it would be in gateways best interest to remove the brick code and include the FPGA update for multi-rom in the next release. then they deal with the clones without upsetting their customer base. two birds with one stone....................sudeki300

 

[Xzi]

Here it is: http://gbatemp.net/threads/gw-multirom-demo.360958/page-22#post-4896409

From the Proasic3 datasheet: "Note that the FlashROM can only be programmed from the JTAG interface and cannot be programmed from the internal logic array"
This means you MUST use the jtag pins to be able to reprogram it.
Some pins needed for that are the pins 22-24 which are the first three from left on the lower side of the FPGA. You can see that on the gateway those are connected,
on the clones they are not.
So, the clones fpgas are really not reconfigurable (though they "wasted" a better fpga on it).​

 

[Yessy]

http://gbatemp.net/threads/gw-multirom-demo.360958/page-19#post-4896292
for the full conversation

 

[Huntereb]

Do we have proof from a trusted source?

 

[Xzi]

Do we have proof from a trusted source?

That's from the datasheet. You can verify it with your own eyes just by looking at pictures of the clones' hardware and the Gateway's hardware.

But again, there's no guarantee that Gateway is going to use an FPGA update for 2.0. They have yet to do anything with it. I'd prefer they did, as an easier means of blocking cloning (at least temporarily) so that they are free to remove the bricking code, but only time will tell.

 

[Huntereb]

That's from the datasheet. You can verify it with your own eyes just by looking at pictures of the clones' hardware and the Gateway's hardware.

But is it proven?

Don't take this as an "Against Gateway" talk, I just want to know 100% that this is the truth, and not just another rumor (Just as the original poster is asking). I'm all for the clone's doing their own work, and I have a Gateway to use if the clones end up being crap (I'll only use the newest firmware when the bricking code is gone though, so I might still have to wait).

 

[Arras]

it would be in gateways best interest to remove the brick code and include the FPGA update for multi-rom in the next release. then they deal with the clones without upsetting their customer base. two birds with one stone....................sudeki300

Until new clones come along. Which will probably be very soon.

 

[kyogre123]

But again, there's no guarantee that Gateway is going to use an FPGA update for 2.0. They have yet to do anything with it. I'd prefer they did, as an easier means of blocking cloning (at least temporarily) so that they are free to remove the bricking code, but only time will tell.

The first guarantee is that they mentioned it on their own site. The second one is that the cart lacks of a file system and the algorithm to process the saving method of the card2 games.

But is it proven?

Don't take this as an "Against Gateway" talk, I just want to know 100% that this is the truth, and not just another rumor (Just as the original poster is asking). I'm all for the clone's doing their own work, and I have a Gateway to use if the clones end up being crap (I'll only use the newest firmware when the bricking code is gone though, so I might still have to wait).

If the datasheet says so, then it is proven. There are not workarounds if the specifications have this constraint.

Nonetheless, I must say that I haven't seen proof that the gamecard pins of the GW's flashcard are connected to the JTAG pins.

 

[Xzi]

But is it proven?

Don't take this as an "Against Gateway" talk, I just want to know 100% that this is the truth, and not just another rumor (Just as the original poster is asking). I'm all for the clone's doing their own work, and I have a Gateway to use if the clones end up being crap (I'll only use the newest firmware when the bricking code is gone though, so I might still have to wait).

It's proven that the FPGA can't be reprogrammed without the JTAG interface, and it's proven that the JTAG pins are not connected on the clones, so that's the best we're going to get. People just have to put two and two together for themselves.

 

[ELok]

What? The cloner doesn't have access to the JTAG? :S

I'm sure there's a reason behind it, connecting the JTAG is the basic of the basic...

 

[sudeki300]

Until new clones come along. Which will probably be very soon.

i know that the clone companies will eventually make a new card, but at least if the FPGA update can be used by gateway it throws a spanner in the works for now. in the meantime team gateway can find a proper way of protecting their product, one that will force the clones to write their own firmware and make the current versions of clone cards redundant.................................sudeki300

 

[Xzi]

What? The cloner doesn't have access to the JTAG? :S

I'm sure there's a reason behind it, connecting the JTAG is the basic of the basic...

The reason is that it probably saved them a few cents on manufacturing each unit.

 

[Technicmaster0]

But is it proven?

Don't take this as an "Against Gateway" talk, I just want to know 100% that this is the truth, and not just another rumor (Just as the original poster is asking). I'm all for the clone's doing their own work, and I have a Gateway to use if the clones end up being crap (I'll only use the newest firmware when the bricking code is gone though, so I might still have to wait).

No one "official" confirmed that. Everyone says that they can't be updated but there are also persons saying the opposite.