Hardware Why no antialiasing ?

[pachura]

3DS' screen is quite low resolution and it could really use some antialiasing. And despite AA is listed as one of Pica200's features, it seems that no game is using it at the moment.

2xFSAA (Full Screen Antialiasing) basically forces hardware to render 4 times as many pixels as normally. I understand it would drastically decrease framerate of most games. But what about Nintendo's Home Menu ? Game menus ? Character selection screens ? They are really simple, so why no one uses antialiasing there ? For instance, car model and track selection in Ridge Racer looks really ugly due to the "jaggies"...

 

[Porobu]

3DS' screen is quite low resolution and it could really use some antialiasing. And despite AA is listed as one of Pica200's features, it seems that no game is using it at the moment.

2xFSAA (Full Screen Antialiasing) basically forces hardware to render 4 times as many pixels as normally. I understand it would drastically decrease framerate of most games. But what about Nintendo's Home Menu ? Game menus ? Character selection screens ? They are really simple, so why no one uses antialiasing there ? For instance, car model and track selection in Ridge Racer looks really ugly due to the "jaggies"...

Some games use it when 3D is off and FSAA is Full Scene (not screen) Anti-Aliasing

 

[Ikki]

I believe it's because the 3D supposedly has it's own antialiasing-ish effect.

 

[pachura]

Some games use it when 3D is off
Which games exactly ?
They've announced that this will be the case for RE, but it's not out yet.

QUOTE(Ikki @ Jun 4 2011, 07:51 PM) I believe it's because the 3D supposedly has it's own antialiasing-ish effect.

This was what everyone was hoping for, but in reality the jaggies look even worse in 3D (at least for me).

 

[heartgold]

I believe it's because the 3D supposedly has it's own antialiasing-ish effect.

This was what everyone was hoping for, but in reality the jaggies look even worse in 3D (at least for me).

Seems good to me in 3D sorta

 

[Pippin666]

There is a part in SSF4 with AA + 3D. Right before a fight during the character introdution. Some cutscene in DoA also have AA + 3D.

Pip'

 

[Ergo]

Probably because implementing it isn't 'free', resource wise.

 

[RupeeClock]

To display three screens at once, two of them being the 3D display, requires greater computing power than Anti-aliasing would probably allow.
Some games already suffer a little frame loss during 3D mode.

 

[Ikki]

To display three screens at once, two of them being the 3D display, requires greater computing power than Anti-aliasing would probably allow.
Some games already suffer a little frame loss during 3D mode.

And it would be one anti-aliasing per screen, right?

That'd be kinda too much.

 

[pachura]

There is a part in SSF4 with AA + 3D. Right before a fight during the character introdution. Some cutscene in DoA also have AA + 3D.
I'm not sure about SSF4, because some objects during this pre-fight cutscene seem like antialiased, and some don't. Maybe it's just strong bloom effect which looks a bit like antialiasing.

Probably because implementing it isn't 'free', resource wise.
There should be plenty of resources left while they're just displaying track map or a single rotating car in Ridge Racer. Or in Home Menu.

QUOTE(RupeeClock @ Jun 4 2011, 09:25 PM)

To display three screens at once, two of them being the 3D display, requires greater computing power than Anti-aliasing would probably allow.
Some games already suffer a little frame loss during 3D mode.

It depends on what's on these screens. If there's just a single textured cube rotating, then it doesn't require that much power and AA could be used. But it's not.

 

[Wizerzak]

I can't understand why you'd want it anyway. Most Nintendo games go for a low-graphic look so adding AA won't make much of a difference...

 

[doyama]

Considering you're now only getting around 4 hours of gaming right now on a 3DS, would you want to have a non-toggleable AA feature that would suck so much battery life that you'd probably be in the 2.5 hour range?

 

[m3rox]

Considering you're now only getting around 4 hours of gaming right now on a 3DS, would you want to have a non-toggleable AA feature that would suck so much battery life that you'd probably be in the 2.5 hour range?

Less than that, AA can really eat up a system's resources. Realtime AA.... I don't even think this is possible yet as it would fall under what the pros in the CG industry call "realtime rendering" (different than what you're thinking of), which consists of AA, lighting, rendering, the whole shebang being done in real time. The closest the movie industry has is progressive rendering (where a single frame starts off as a mosaic and is progressively refined over a certain period of time). So the best you're going to get is what you see currently on the 3DS/Wii/PS3/360.

 

[Issac]

When 3D is on, you have your eyes focused at one particular "distance" in the scene, and the parts that are around the model for example will be at a different distance.. this makes up for the anti aliasing since it will be blurry for your eyes, and give a anti-aliased effect

 

[RupeeClock]

It depends on what's on these screens. If there's just a single textured cube rotating, then it doesn't require that much power and AA could be used. But it's not.

That's actually what Picross 3D on the DS is, and that seems to have legiitmate AA.

The bottom screen may not be utilising 3D or anything that needs AA, but that still leaves two wide screens.

I do say though 2D mode makes AA sound more feasible.

 

[m3rox]

It depends on what's on these screens. If there's just a single textured cube rotating, then it doesn't require that much power and AA could be used. But it's not.

That's actually what Picross 3D on the DS is, and that seems to have legiitmate AA.

The bottom screen may not be utilising 3D or anything that needs AA, but that still leaves two wide screens.

I do say though 2D mode makes AA sound more feasible.

No, no game has real AA.

 

[Ultralex]

If you turn off 3D in SSF IV it's Anti-Aliased.

 

[m3rox]

If you turn off 3D in SSF IV it's Anti-Aliased.

No it isn't.

 

[pachura]

Considering you're now only getting around 4 hours of gaming right now on a 3DS, would you want to have a non-toggleable AA feature that would suck so much battery life that you'd probably be in the 2.5 hour range?
I don't know what are you basing your calculations on. It sounds like people saying that turning off the 3D will double the battery life.
Besides, I was only talking about AA in menus, character selection screens, SSF4 figurine screen etc. Surely users doesn't spend so much time there to have their batteries be eaten up ? I'm just wondering if AA is technically impossible (e.g. Nintendo ordered a dumbed-down version of Pica200 with no AA support to cut down costs), or will we see it in future games... Yes, I know AA was mentioned in context of RE and Starfox, but after the recent MGS3D news I am staying skeptic until I see it...

Realtime AA.... I don't even think this is possible
WTF ? There's plenty of edge-smoothing techniques used currently. Even DS had antialiasing in some games (e.g. Flash Focus: Vision Training).

QUOTE(Issac @ Jun 4 2011, 10:54 PM)

When 3D is on, you have your eyes focused at one particular "distance" in the scene, and the parts that are around the model for example will be at a different distance.. this makes up for the anti aliasing since it will be blurry for your eyes, and give a anti-aliased effect

Myself, I don't see any difference as to the "jaggies" with 3D turned on.

 

[Deleted User]

3D antialiases in its own right. Your binocular disparity creates a light blur. This is the eye's "natural" anti-aliasing