New Abortion Law Wave

Discussion in 'World News, Current Events & Politics' started by cots, May 20, 2019.

  1. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    Sounds like Socialist propaganda to me, but okay. /s

    Actually I completely agree with this, and much of the reason why I oppose a blanket ban on abortion is that it will only make such an environment harder to find in these states.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, May 25, 2019
  2. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    Some common ground. You were always the more reasonable one on the team. It's not really that socialist of an idea - conservatives have always advertised themselves as pro family values, it would be much easier to market that if they stopped tearing those families apart over the most fickle of reasons.
     
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  3. Zonark

    Zonark Zonark - Noun - A God

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    Here's my two cents, Not all abortions are bad. Personally though I feel as if you are carrying the baby for more that 1/3rd of the pregnancy you need to have it and give it up for adoption if you don't want it, If the baby was going to cause harm to the mother and it needs to be aborted to save a life I believe that should be justifiable. Also people are looking at abortion being good at mainly just rape cases which isn't true, not all abortions are do to rape and While there are some people who literally get a abortion every 2 months they are vastly outweighed by the people that don't. I believe that 1/3rd is good timeframe but anything longer I think that the child should be born. I mean I would assume if someone conceived a child via rape this person isn't going to be waiting longer that 1/3rd of the pregnancy to decide.
     
  4. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    1) So if a sperm meets and egg and they combine but skip implantation and land on a tampon in a week's time do I have to go help my friend through a miscarriage?
    2) Most usually add on "without special measures" at this point, similar to how we also handle end of life and serious injury. If it is a chemical dropper for food and an incubator to stand a reasonable chance of making it then that is one thing. If it is going to be an array of tubes, specialist medics, high end medicines and such then even if it is available then yeah.
    3) It is the woman's body, and lifestyle, that will have to suffer for the better part of a year, if not longer if they are also compelled to raise the result. That would be the foundation of that one. Generally the right to bodily autonomy is considered a fairly fundamental one.
    4) I would agree, indeed you will find several posts in this thread and the other, saying that having the equipment which functions does not render you magically more capable of understanding things.
    5) Didn't see that here but I would agree it is rather out of place here.
    6) It does speak to a measure of double standard though. If it is life and it is so special and magical to then turn around and allow them to live a miserable and hard fought existence does seem rather contrary to the notions underpinning the former.
    7) I would have probably come to the opposite conclusion. Something that can not feel, think, suffer, comprehend or otherwise be classified as sentient gets destroyed, and in doing so likely lifts a massive burden upon something that can feel, think, suffer, comprehend and otherwise be classified as sentient. Where is the big problem?
    8) I would refer back to 7). Similarly I would also say life beginning is related at best but contemplating the suffering of things is where it is really at.

    Back to 1) then what are these logical reasons for sperm meets egg (or virus self fertilises egg I guess)? The tech is such that you can probably scrape some cheek cells from someone and clone them. Do we care there? We can create strands of DNA from very much inert chemicals, assemble them into full sets of DNA and have the results very much count as alive, bacteria only right now (viruses before that) but no reason to suspect higher and higher orders of life can't be made.
     
  5. kumikochan

    kumikochan GBAtemp Psycho!

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    The law here says when there is brain activity and that is from 3 months onward. Abortion is not legal after 3 months and only in extreme cases. That is a general good rule
     
  6. I am very happy that you got to turn your life around.Many of the people here just regurgitate what they heard in their liberal school about abortion,they don't really have the life experience to talk about such a delicate subject.When you spend the majority of your life playing video games instead of living in the real cruel world,it is easy to see how people could be on board with the idea of abortion.My personal opinion is that most gamer's see themselves as victims and victims are more likely to identify with liberal politics.Abortion is wrong in 99% of cases as people make a personal choice to have sex and to ejaculate inside someone for the sake of pleasure.If you aren't ready to raise a kid,you really should not be having unprotected sex.
     
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  7. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    If you are not prepared to be hit by a car you should not cross the street (or possibly even walk along it).
    If you are not prepared to get hypothermia you should not climb a mountain.
    If you are not prepared to be allergic to something you should never try it.
    If you don't want to have a brick fall on you then probably should be a bricklayer or builder.
    This could continue for a while.

    In any case we have rather swish medicine these days that will attempt to correct for any problems in the event it all goes wrong, indeed not doing so if you are a medic and the patient is an otherwise healthy individually expressing a desire very much continue living will get you slapped really hard. Why is taking a few chemicals or firing up the womb vacuum any different here?
     
  8. Bonehead

    Bonehead Member

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    A lot of you should have been aborted. So many forever alone incels in this thread.
     
  9. chrisrlink

    chrisrlink Intel Pentium III Hamster inside

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    inside your crappy old PC
    so I'm guessing you don't approve of the death penalty either like most hypocritical Republicans? if you say you support it then you're as bad of a Hypocrite as the rest of them
     
  10. pustal

    pustal Koalafied member.

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    LOL, I rest my case.

    Science is not a religion and is the way to face the world. Science is based on investigation, proof, analysis, corroboration, deduction, etc. Unlike religion that is based on a blind belief endotrinated by others. Science is verifiable, religion is not. Science encourages you to question things and prove them wrong, religion does not. Religion is the opposite, it's dogmatic. Science is meant to find the truth about the way the universe works. And it's not "my science", I'm afraid you are bound to the laws of physics and made of chemistry just as much as I do, while the laws of you're religion are in the minds of those who believe in it.

    I feel sad having to state the obvious difference to someone. I also feel sad that someone whose religious belief is invalidated by factual evidence refuses to question it and consider the evidence.

    Planned parenthood, which includes contraception and abortion is an effective proven mean against poverty. By defunding it, you are actually giving a hit to the Economy on the long run and actually paying more. And we live as a society, I'm sorry, not an anarchy.

    Also science doesn't change, by the way. It's knowledge that increases. And you're right, most religions are immutable, don't change, don't evolve, and are stuck on the beliefs of the world set on one point in the past. Don't you give me the ''in the name of God" crap - Church and State are meant to be separated for a reason, Church and Science not.

    Finally, again, a fetus without brain activity is nothing more that and appendix or yes, even a plant. We take out appendixes when they harm us and we cut down plants when we need it, even if to make a salad.
     
    Last edited by pustal, May 25, 2019
  11. Rolf12

    Rolf12 Advanced Member

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    Oof. That is hard.

    Who wrote so emotionally "gimme back my money" some posts up? Its not your money, and you don't get to choose what the government does with it. You may have an opinion and choose which clown does the miming from the big white mansion.
     
  12. Walking to get somewhere is completely different from doing something where the intended function is to reproduce.Please do not act disingenuous.Every moment of happiness you have had in your life is because your mom CHOSE not to abort you,imagine if she had.Would that be fair to you?I really don't think so.

    — Posts automatically merged - Please don't double post! —

    Science is also bound by political motivation.You never see any scientific studies done on race and the different characteristics among each race,why is this?Because to do so would be politically incorrect and goes directly against the narrative that we are all "created equal". Repeating what you heard in school does not make you an intelligent individual.
     
  13. cots
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    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    When exactly, does the brain activity in an Oak Tree start taking place? I mean, we should protect these trees at all cost. Just wondering?

    — Posts automatically merged - Please don't double post! —

    Science is not a religion in definition, I am aware of this. People are simply replacing religion or using science as a basis of their actions instead of religion. People now have faith in science. So in practical application people are worshiping science or using science as the explanation for "why we exist" (which is what the majority of people used to use Religion for). Just like religion science is flawed. I'm not bound to any laws that have been created by man and who knows what sort of laws people will find "next" that will replace the current ones (including replacing science, physics and chemistry). These will all be outdated concepts some day. Who knows, they may also be also proven totally inaccurate or wrong. What won't change is if you have an abortion and use your faith in science to justify it - this is something you did, commit murder, that won't change and you can't take it back.
     
    Last edited by cots, May 25, 2019
  14. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    Intended by what or whom, and why is that anything I should respect if there even is such a thing? Even if that can be answered then sex has many more factors to it for humans than simple reproduction. Reproduction is a variously pleasant or unpleasant side effect of such actions for some people.
    I fail to see how it is disingenuous to make such comparisons. Quite OK with the medic saying use a rubber next time when they are doing it, just the same as I would for them to say look both ways, know your limits/train better, be more aware of ingredients and use a hard hat.

    I similarly fail to see what my ending up existing has to do with anything. To the best of my knowledge (and greatest of hopes) I am not a parent. Am I supposed to feel bad about my hypothetical children that never came to pass because contraception or simply choosing not to have sex during the relevant points in the month (or indeed with an infertile woman)? We can go the other way as well. If my mum had not aborted her pregnancy at 18 she would never have gone to school, got a decent job, worked up through the ranks and ultimately given my siblings and I a pretty comfortable and fun upbringing. Instead I might either have never had my siblings (can't afford such luxuries) or have struggled on a minimum wage, time restricted job -- something I saw many of my friends at school have happen to them. We can return to science as well -- I have never cloned myself, never assembled DNA to make a life form, nor had a surrogate incubate a spawn despite the chemicals and means to do so being all around me and have been so for many years. Do we have to count that as a lack of life being made that is somehow a tragedy?



    I see plenty -- universities seem ready to talk my ear off about the races of those enrolled, their incoming scores and their ultimate results. Certainly political correctness has kneecapped plenty of things in recent times and that is a crying shame, one I hope turns in on itself if not tomorrow then in the near future (more likely), an event I shall be watching with popcorn at hand.
    If we are continuing with magical spark of life stuff then the history of a guy called Berzelius is probably worth looking at here -- at the time science was mainly done by time served experts making pronouncements on things (as opposed to the more data driven approaches favoured today), and one of the pervasive beliefs at the time was simple organic chemistry was actually endowed with a spark of life/needed to be produced by living organisms, something said same was considered a notable proponent of. Indeed reading some of the opinions of the day... do a very simple find and replace on them and we have the same things I am seeing from some in this thread. There were a few technical counters to it then (some ammonia based stuff) but they mostly went unnoticed. Then others came along and completely blew it out of the water.
     
  15. cots
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    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    So I earn money and part of it's taken from me by other people and then used to pay for abortions. How is that not my money? Why don't I get in a say in the matter?

    If not, I want to know where you live and were you work so the next time you get paid I want you to give me half of your paycheck so I can use the money for whatever purpose I see fit. I mean, if it's not your money, what would you care?
     
  16. Glyptofane

    Glyptofane Death Dealer

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    Replacing the man in a white robe with the man in a white lab coat and neither appears to be any less corruptible when it comes to pushing an agenda for bribery, blackmail, kickbacks, and payoffs.
     
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  17. kumikochan

    kumikochan GBAtemp Psycho!

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    Am i talking about trees ? No i wasn't
     
  18. cots
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    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    Both science and religion have flaws and both justify murdering in some capacity. I'm just calling it like I see it. I don't care if science is the "popular" or "newest" way explain things with. Murder is murder and murdering humans is wrong. I don't care if you're justifying it with prisoner executions, wars, to stop the spread of disease, etc ... Murder is wrong. Loss of life is inevitable and shouldn't be used as an excuse to commit murder.
     
  19. Lacius

    Lacius GBAtemp Legend

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    Science doesn't make moral judgments.
     
  20. kumikochan

    kumikochan GBAtemp Psycho!

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    sociology is considered a science tho
     
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