Hacking Question When will a free XCI Backup Loader be released?

[Deleted User]

You would see what he's getting at, your both far from being TX fanboys and would never say anything good about them, SX or XCI files.
But it's good to see posts from you again

Meanwhile I did give it an advantage, but okie, I enjoy you snipping my quote like that, please by all means continue to shape your argument.
I'll just quote the part you kindly removed that pretty much breaks your point.

If you fall under the really strict camp of "never taking switch out of the dock" and also owning SXOS. then yeah, the xci for the time, strictly for sxos's feature of xci loading from a hardrive. Is better.

 

[smf]

I'm not arguing with you; I'm pointing out irrelevancies.

You are saying things are irrelevant when they aren't and making irrelevant points yourself.

We're in effect arguing about what is irrelevant.

Sx os AFAIK doesn't do any checking afaik, and also of course has sign patches. Which means the xci loader is likely unsafe, if I had to guess. (since why at run time would you check the xci? Given the fact that xci's can be mashed with updates and dlc. It's not super far fetched of the "possibility" (likely exists somewhere) of someone maliciously injecting code into a xci)
while with a nsp, it's still possible but, afaik, most installers do check, and will not allowed unsigned nsps unless you change your configuration.

You can avoid malicious XCI by checking the signature on your PC before copying the downloaded files to your switch. https://gbatemp.net/threads/switch-game-checker.524145/

SX OS XCI loader could have the checks enabled, if TX chose to allow it. So it's not an argument against XCI. It's an argument against SX OS and this is not a SX OS thread & so it's irrelevant.

The whole argument of NSP is good because it's used by homebrew means everyone currently needs to disable checks & so any harmful software will just be distributed in homebrew.

 

[Lacius]

You are saying things are irrelevant when they aren't and making irrelevant points yourself.

We're in effect arguing about what is irrelevant.

NSP install times are comparable to XCI copy/paste times. If you're going to address anything else, it's irrelevant.

 

[Mokiki]

I would like to run .xci from an external harddrive. 2TB external hard drive. Is this so unreasonable? I keep seeing this argument about putting it on the SD card ,blah blah. I want to use an external harddrive to run my .xcis off of. Freeing up my sd card for longer games.

 

[Lacius]

I would like to run .xci from an external harddrive. 2TB external hard drive. Is this so unreasonable? I keep seeing this argument about putting it on the SD card ,blah blah. I want to use an external harddrive to run my .xcis off of. Freeing up my sd card for longer games.

Then make an XCI loader or buy SX OS.

 

[Mokiki]

Dont be a smart ass. You want a legit reason to have .xci loading and i gave you one. People say why, i just told you why. If you cant grasp the concept of a huge external harddrive with .xci games on it that is just plug and play, freeing up space on your sd card for the games you want to invest more time in, then idk. Yes sxos does it and it would be nice for people who want a free option. I cant code fyi , and i have sxos.

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Now i know why I always hear gba is toxic.

 

[Naminave]

The only way to make a .XCI safe is to make them yourself. End of discussion.

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Dont be a smart ass. You want a legit reason to have .xci loading and i gave you one. People say why, i just told you why. If you cant grasp the concept of a huge external harddrive with .xci games on it that is just plug and play, freeing up space on your sd card for the games you want to invest more time in, then idk. Yes sxos does it and it would be nice for people who want a free option. I cant code fyi , and i have sxos.

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Now i know why I always hear gba is toxic.

I will never pay for something that must be freeware.

 

[Cylent1]

.....Moral of the story is, Just as many people wan't a free XCI loader just as many people who don't!
The one's who don't wan't one, that is their perogative, but no need to feel morally superior and take it out on people just because you don't.

 

[smf]

NSP install times are comparable to XCI copy/paste times. If you're going to address anything else, it's irrelevant.

Says you, but you're completely wrong.

If you compare copying an xci onto a fast huge usb3 disk once, compared to installing and reinstalling an NSP because huge microsd don't exist then they aren't comparable at all.

Then make an XCI loader or buy SX OS.

Why do you feel the need to comment on this thread if that is the best you can come up with?
Does it make you happy?

 

[Deleted User]

Says you, but you're completely wrong.

If you compare copying an xci onto a fast huge usb3 disk once, compared to installing and reinstalling an NSP because huge microsd don't exist then they aren't comparable at all.

Why reinstall?
second off, you also have usb installations as a thing.
you don't need to go put it on a microsd card if that's the issue.
And if it isn't the issue, and speed is. Those "fast huge usb3 disks" which I would assume your talking a hard drive, and not a ssd. (even then ssd's are expensive, and aren't as bulky in storage. Case point, if your talking huge, I am assuming a hard drive)
A hard drive would only be marginally faster, since they are already pretty slow.
However, that's beyond the point, as his response was to someone saying
"why install nps. when I can drag and drop and be on my way"
Which arguably, most people are going to be using a hardrive, and usb installs on switch, on either internal storage or microsd, has comparable (slightly less,but doesn't matter much at all) speed in writes vs a hard drive. And we don't have to wait for the .nsp to be copy over to a sd card. (again usb installs)

 

[Lacius]

Says you, but you're completely wrong.

If you compare copying an xci onto a fast huge usb3 disk once, compared to installing and reinstalling an NSP because huge microsd don't exist then they aren't comparable at all.



Why do you feel the need to comment on this thread if that is the best you can come up with?
Does it make you happy?

If you want to talk about the cost of storage space, that's fine. I already said that if one is willing to sacrifice some (or all) portability, HDD space is cheaper than SD space. However, if we are talking about NSP install time vs. XCI transfer time (which is the only thing I was talking about), they're comparable.

As for what makes me happy, coming to this site and acknowledging a person's two options does make me happy, yes, particularly when people like the person I was talking to probably aren't going to buy an SX OS, demonstrating my point that XCI loading isn't worth the price.

 

[smf]

However, if we are talking about NSP install time vs. XCI transfer time (which is the only thing I was talking about), they're comparable.

And it's an irrelevant metric, because with NSP you're likely going to need to do it multiple times. It's like you're focusing on specific things that sound like they prove your point but are irrelevant when taken in context of the real world.

As for what makes me happy, coming to this site and acknowledging a person's two options does make me happy, yes, particularly when people like the person I was talking to probably aren't going to buy an SX OS, demonstrating my point that XCI loading isn't worth the price.

I think you've missed the point. The only conclusion you can come to is that people who want a free alternative, want a free alternative. Anything else is just your own cognitive bias. It will include people who have already paid for SX OS, those who don't want to ever pay money to TX, those who don't want to ever pay any money to anyone for hacking no matter how small the cost and how great the product is.

It's a rather disingenuous standpoint because if everyone who wanted a free alternative paid for xci loading because to persuade you that it was "worth the price" then you'd change your argument to "well you've bought it now, so why do you need a free alternative".

 

[Lacius]

And it's an irrelevant metric, because with NSP you're likely going to need to do it multiple times. It's like you're focusing on specific things that sound like they prove your point but are irrelevant when taken in context of the real world.

I've never installed the same NSP more than once. If you want to argue that it's something people do, that's fine, but that's an argument about the cost of SD space vs. the cost of HDD space, not an argument about NSP install time. NSP install time is comparable to XCI pasting time.

I think you've missed the point. The only conclusion you can come to is that people who want a free alternative, want a free alternative. Anything else is just your own cognitive bias. It will include people who have already paid for SX OS, those who don't want to ever pay money to TX, those who don't want to ever pay any money to anyone for hacking no matter how small the cost and how great the product is.

It's a rather disingenuous standpoint because if everyone who wanted a free alternative paid for xci loading because to persuade you that it was "worth the price" then you'd change your argument to "well you've bought it now, so why do you need a free alternative".

My original argument was that most people generally could not care less about XCI loading. It not being worth the price merely demonstrates that.

 

[smf]

I've never installed the same NSP more than once. If you want to argue that it's something people do, that's fine, but that's an argument about the cost of SD space vs. the cost of HDD space, not an argument about NSP install time. NSP install time is comparable to XCI pasting time.

It is something they have to do. If you spend the same amount of money on HDD and microsd then you spend less time copying.

My original argument was that most people generally could not care less about XCI loading. It not being worth the price merely demonstrates that.

I guess the first question to ask is if you believe what you're saying, because if you do then can you make that argument without circular reasoning and logical fallacy?

 

[Lacius]

It is something they have to do. If you spend the same amount of money on HDD and microsd then you spend less time copying.



I guess the first question to ask is if you believe what you're saying, because if you do then can you make that argument without circular reasoning and logical fallacy?

If you'd like to continue this conversation, please send me a PM.

 

[Legend Of Kay]

There is nothing faster then just downloading an xci directly onto your sd card or HDD and then just connecting that to your switch. No transfers. No install. Download direct to the card/hd and then go. Super easy.

 

[smf]

If you'd like to continue this conversation, please send me a PM.

Is part of your argument secret? In which case why would you share it with me anyway?

Other people might benefit when I explain how you're making simple mistakes in your reasoning.

 

[Lacius]

Is part of your argument secret? In which case why would you share it with me anyway?

Other people might benefit when I explain how you're making simple mistakes in your reasoning.

I want to move it to PM because I don't think the public benefits from a conversation that's going in circles. Asking to move to PM also helps me distinguish between the people who want to have a sincere conversation and the people who have other motives.

I believe my points speak for themselves at this point, and I'm not sure if the public conversation can continue without me just repeating myself, which is a red flag to me that the conversation has reached a natural end. Below is a quick summary of my points from this thread, in case you want to respond to them over PM or have the final word here. Regardless, my public conversation with you is over.

1. People largely don't care about XCI loading since we have NSP backups, which is the primary reason why free XCI loading is unlikely. In other words, the benefit is just not even close to worth the work.
2. XCI files have no significant benefit over NSP files. They are not safer with regard to bricking; in fact, using current XCI loaders, they're less safe than NSP files. They're not faster to install.
3. The only benefit of XCI files that comes close is the ability to load them off a USB device, which is a cheaper form of storage than SD, but that requires sacrificing some or all portability. People generally don't care about the HDD loading, whether it's because of the lack of portability or because it's just not an enticing feature, and this is evidenced in part by the fact that XCI loading by SX OS just isn't worth the price for most people. This isn't circular reasoning, since a willingness or unwillingness to pay a price for something is a great indicator of how much one cares about something. On the other hand, when there wasn't a free CFW that supported NSP backup loading yet, many many of the same people who aren't willing to pay for XCI loading alone were willing to pay the price for backup loading in general.

There is nothing faster then just downloading an xci directly onto your sd card or HDD and then just connecting that to your switch. No transfers. No install. Download direct to the card/hd and then go. Super easy.

Copy/pasting an XCI to an HDD is about the same amount of time as installing an NSP over a USB connection. XCI files have no benefit here.

 

[Lumince]

I agree that a free XCI loader would be nice and all, but I don't even use my dock. I use my switch in portable mode 24/7 and have no use for a dock. Id probably use my dock more if AMS had one.
Ive never had to reinstall an nsp more than once since I have a 512gb sd card and don't hoard games. If I dislike the game I uninstall it and go from there.
The transfer speed argument is kinda dumb... If I have the nsp downloaded and I use nut to install it, it takes about the same time to install it through tinfoil than to plug my hdd in, move a "super xci" over, plug it back into my switch, and mount the game. I've used sxos so I have experience with xcis. Also it doesn't matter because people that use the "super xci's" normally don't want to install updates and dlc to the system and would have to delete their current xci, repack the new update into the xci, and recopy it back over. Both sides have their advantages and disadvantages. No point in arguing on which piracy method is better since they are both in different ways....

If I had the knowledge to make one Id want to try but I don't and no one really wants to for obvious reasons. Ive seen posts that everything is there for people to make their own and I'm sure someone out there has made one, but I highly doubt that it would go public because of the copyright files that are used to run said xci's.

 

[Lacius]

I agree that a free XCI loader would be nice and all, but I don't even use my dock. I use my switch in portable mode 24/7 and have no use for a dock. Id probably use my dock more if AMS had one.
Ive never had to reinstall an nsp more than once since I have a 512gb sd card and don't hoard games. If I dislike the game I uninstall it and go from there.
The transfer speed argument is kinda dumb... If I have the nsp downloaded and I use nut to install it, it takes about the same time to install it through tinfoil than to plug my hdd in, move a "super xci" over, plug it back into my switch, and mount the game. I've used sxos so I have experience with xcis. Also it doesn't matter because people that use the "super xci's" normally don't want to install updates and dlc to the system and would have to delete their current xci, repack the new update into the xci, and recopy it back over. Both sides have their advantages and disadvantages. No point in arguing on which piracy method is better since they are both in different ways....

If I had the knowledge to make one Id want to try but I don't and no one really wants to for obvious reasons. Ive seen posts that everything is there for people to make their own and I'm sure someone out there has made one, but I highly doubt that it would go public because of the copyright files that are used to run said xci's.

Yeah, the usage of a "super" XCI always seemed strange to me. On the one hand, it preserves SD space, but on the other hand, how important is SD space if you're using XCI files for the base games anyway? It's also incredibly inefficient to redownload or repackage the same base game with each new update and/or DLC.

When a new update or DLC comes out, I only have to download that new thing.