Hacking New 3DS CPU & Ram.

[Reecey]

Hi all,

I was just wondering now the new 3DS is out and about do we know that the new power of the CPU and Ram (not sure if the ram was even upgraded anyway?)can be modded on the 3DS/XL with Gateway to play the new games like the Xenoblade Chronicles?. I think I read somewhere about it can be done but I cannot find it now and I'm not sure if I was just seeing things, it may of just been the drugs I was on so sorry if I have misread!

 

[linuxares]

I think it's a bigger chance to get world peace than the "New 3DS" will be shipped with firmware 4.1-4.5. So sorry, if no new exploit for kernel is found, we can just hope that Smealums exploit will work on it.

 

[Reecey]

I think it's a bigger chance to get world peace than the "New 3DS" will be shipped with firmware 4.1-4.5. So sorry, if no new exploit for kernel is found, we can just hope that Smealums exploit will work on it.

I'm not on about that I was asking if the old 3DS/XL can somehow upgrade the CPU now we know more about the new 3DS as its is out now, you don't need the new 3DS exploited to work that one, it could be done somehow through homebrew methods with Gateway to access the CPU to match the new 3DS CPU power to play the new games, I thought I read it somewhere we could?

 

[Arras]

I'm not on about that I was asking if the old 3DS/XL can somehow upgrade the CPU now we know more about the new 3DS as its is out now, you don't need the new 3DS exploited to work that one, it could be done somehow through homebrew methods with Gateway to access the CPU to match the new 3DS CPU power to play the new games, I thought I read it somewhere we could?

You can't magically create more RAM and processing power. Not going to happen.

 

[Reecey]

You can't magically create more RAM and processing power. Not going to happen.

I don't think the ram was even mentioned in the new 3DS, I think it was only the fact the CPU was over clocked, I mean you can overclock a CPU with a PC so why not use Gateway homebrew methods to overclock the CPU in the 3DS/XL to the same speeds as the new 3DS now we know more about it?

 

[TecXero]

Are you talking about overclocking? That would kill your 3DS and still wouldn't get you what you want. The N3DS has more RAM and more cores, there's nothing you could do to the 3DS to make it able to run software designed for the N3DS without N3DS components and a lot of soldering. Maybe the software can be modified, but it would be a very large undertaking and is just unreasonable. If you really want to play a N3DS exclusive game within the next five years, you'll need a N3DS.

 

[Arras]

I don't think the ram was even mentioned in the new 3DS, I think it was only the fact the CPU was over clocked, I mean you can overclock a CPU with a PC so why not use Gateway homebrew methods to overclock the CPU in the 3DS/XL to the same speeds as the new 3DS now we know more about it?

It's not overclocked, it has more processor cores, more RAM and more VRAM. No way that's going to happen.

 

[trumpet-205]

I don't think the ram was even mentioned in the new 3DS, I think it was only the fact the CPU was over clocked, I mean you can overclock a CPU with a PC so why not use Gateway homebrew methods to overclock the CPU in the 3DS/XL to the same speeds as the new 3DS now we know more about it?

Because you would overheat your 3DS instantly. Mind you that 3DS is designed to be passively cooled (no fan), so faster speed would easily push it over the boundary.

New 3DS runs at the same speed as 3DS, but has more cores.

 

[Venseer]

I don't think you can change the hardware of a console and expect it to work. Unless you change the entire mother board of a 3DS and still manages to make the Operational System to run those new pieces, you'd need Programmer & Hardware Modder Jesus Christ to do that.

 

[SSG Vegeta]

Bro just upgrade to the New Nintendo 3DSXL it'll be awesome

 

[Huntereb]

I would like to see an attempt at getting it to run on older devices, can't hurt to give it a shot, regardless of the outcome.

 

[MyJoyConRunsHot]

I don't think the ram was even mentioned in the new 3DS, I think it was only the fact the CPU was over clocked, I mean you can overclock a CPU with a PC so why not use Gateway homebrew methods to overclock the CPU in the 3DS/XL to the same speeds as the new 3DS now we know more about it?

The RAM was doubled.

Because you would overheat your 3DS instantly. Mind you that 3DS is designed to be passively cooled (no fan), so faster speed would easily push it over the boundary.

New 3DS runs at the same speed as 3DS, but has more cores.

As far as we know.

 

[granville]

Because you would overheat your 3DS instantly. Mind you that 3DS is designed to be passively cooled (no fan), so faster speed would easily push it over the boundary.

New 3DS runs at the same speed as 3DS, but has more cores.

While sources point towards the clock speed staying the same in the New 3DS, they probably could indeed have significantly overclocked the CPU had they so desired. The battery life would have suffered, but heat shouldn't be a concern as the 3DS' ARM11 is clocked much lower than other devices sharing the same CPU. Even other passively cooled mobile devices that contained the same CPU generally clocked theirs 400mhz or higher, such as the original iPhone and Zune HD (apparently containing ARM11 cores clocked within a range anywhere between 400-600mhz). And the Raspberry Pi (also passively cooled) has an ARM11 clocked at a base of 700mhz. The 3DS' ARM11 is only clocked at 268mhz.

 

[VashTS]

we need a downgrade for 3DS. If that ever becomes reality, we are all set.

 

[stomp_442]

we need a downgrade for 3DS. If that ever becomes reality, we are all set.

I'd settle for a homebrew backup launcher that works on the current 3DS and N3DS firmware.

 

[trumpet-205]

While sources point towards the clock speed staying the same in the New 3DS, they probably could indeed have significantly overclocked the CPU had they so desired. The battery life would have suffered, but heat shouldn't be a concern as the 3DS' ARM11 is clocked much lower than other devices sharing the same CPU. Even other passively cooled mobile devices that contained the same CPU generally clocked theirs 400mhz or higher, such as the original iPhone and Zune HD (apparently containing ARM11 cores clocked within a range anywhere between 400-600mhz). And the Raspberry Pi (also passively cooled) has an ARM11 clocked at a base of 700mhz. The 3DS' ARM11 is only clocked at 268mhz.

You can't compare 3DS to other ARM11 based processor. They all are in SoC and different system has different SoC. 3DS uses SoC custom designed for Nintendo use. When everything is packed into a single package like SoC, you have to consider other components heat output too (GPU, I/O, etc).

Not to mention that comparing clock speed between processor core is not an accurate way to gauge TDP or performances.

 

[gudenau]

The new 3ds will ship with 8.x, first version that supports it.

But the CPU has 2x the cores, and more RAM.

 

[Deleted member 333767]

I think OP best chance is to wait about 10 years until Citra is at a stage where it can play retail games at decent speed AND the New 3DS has been reversed engineered enough that new 3DS emulation is achieved in Citra.

Even then, i think 10 years is wishful thinking. We haven't even acheived 100% perfect SNES emulation and how old is that thing?!?!?!

 

[Huntereb]

We haven't even acheived 100% perfect SNES emulation and how old is that thing?!?!?!

We have. It's just really badly optimized... It requires some hefty PC specs.

 

[the_randomizer]

We have. It's just really badly optimized... It requires some hefty PC specs.

Which is why I don't use it, cycle-accuracy only affects like, what, three games tops with some weird shadow effects.

 

[codezer0]

I think OP best chance is to wait about 10 years until Citra is at a stage where it can play retail games at decent speed AND the New 3DS has been reversed engineered enough that new 3DS emulation is achieved in Citra.

Even then, i think 10 years is wishful thinking. We haven't even acheived 100% perfect SNES emulation and how old is that thing?!?!?!

dude, even now with the likes of the Everdrive, most flash carts simply cannot support all of the add-on/upgrade chips that were available for SNES cartridges. Hell, even the current Everdrive N8 flat out fails to emulate half of the possible mappers used for NES games. I've yet to see a single flash cart for the SNES that could even support emulating/running games like Mario RPG, and that one is notoriously difficult to run on emulators for anything short of a full-speed PC. Difference is that your typical PC can usually HLE these add-on chips fast enough that it doesn't matter. But it damn sure matters when running on a handheld in homebrew.

 

[granville]

You can't compare 3DS to other ARM11 based processor. They all are in SoC and different system has different SoC. 3DS uses SoC custom designed for Nintendo use. When everything is packed into a single package like SoC, you have to consider other components heat output too (GPU, I/O, etc).

Not to mention that comparing clock speed between processor core is not an accurate way to gauge TDP or performances.

I didn't say Nintendo's ARM11 is identical to other SoC's, but New 3DS WAS a hardware revision with a physically altered CPU. I'm guessing no one knows the thermal limits for the original 3DS' SoC because as far as i'm aware no one has ever tried to overclock it, same for New 3DS. I doubt anyone can really say whether overclocking on 3DS is possible or not. I would be inclined to believe it probably could have been clocked higher to at least some extent without a risk of overheating. Someone like Smealum might know better though.

One thing I will mention is that the Pica200's clock speed may be synced to the CPU's frequency. My only reason for considering this though is that they're both clocked at 268mhz, perhaps the multiplier is the same and shared between the two components or something, 3DS hackers can correct me if i'm mistaken. Perhaps whatever clock speed you set the CPU to will also force the GPU to match that frequency. If true, it might further explain why Nintendo chose to increase the physical cores instead of overclocking the existing CPU. The official Pica200 specs state that its max supported frequency is 400mhz. Assuming the Pica200's clock speed is tied to the ARM11's, doubling that clock speed may be out of the Pica200's capability (the GPU reaching its thermal threshold and overheating the SoC). Might just be a baseless theory though.

The Nintendo DSi doubled the clock speed of the ARM9 over the original DS (67mhz to 133mhz), its SoC also had other elements contained to contend with the heat increase (the ARM7 for instance). ARM11 CPUs were designed to allow for up to 4 cores, so Nintendo it seems took that opportunity instead of bumping up the clock speed. I don't have the tech knowledge to say whether an ARM11 gets the best benefits from doubling the cores (especially as i'm not aware of any other devices that actually use a quad core ARM11) or keeping just two cores with double the clock speed. I'm sure a lot depends on how well the software is programmed for multiple cores. But either way, given what I know about CPU's in general i'm also pretty sure that adding another two physical processor cores to a CPU SoC has its own impact on heat production. Perhaps not an identical effect to overclocking, but an effect nonetheless. I wonder whether changes were made to the SoC to better handle the heat increase. They also added more memory to the SoC as well.