Hacking About removing B9S and the safety test

[KleinesSinchen]

Removing B9S is unnecessary, potentially dangerous for your console and has no benefits at all. This can’t be said often enough. Best explanation in “You don’t need to remove B9S”[…] by Lilith Valentine.

Yes, I know: “I want virginity back.” … the most frequent reasons for uninstalling B9S are:

A) “I want to sell the system!”
While I understand the idea behind that (a random buyer not knowing about hacks might do stupid things, complain about the hacks, demand a refund and whatnot) it is still not a wise decision. Find a (private) buyer who accepts or even wants a modded console and explain it to them. You are not gonna get rich by selling a used 2/3DS anyway and I don't think it is a nice move to sell a console without mentioning previous software modification.
See examples below. The buyer might actually get a console which is NOT fully working and might have a hard time reinstalling CFW in order to repair the damage.
(Yes, I do know, that the famous online auction site does not allow modded consoles and actually deletes such offers despite tolerating various commercial "piracy")

B) "I'm so afraid of being banned from online play!"
Opposed to the situation on the Switch, Nintendo either can't reliably detect CFW or does not care about it (anymore) or both. The pretty much only way to get banned is cheating online (since there are no new games anymore that could be illegally obtained and played before official release in case of a leak). If there is a way for Nintendo to detect CFW, removing it, will not remove that "flag". Long story short: CFW does not lead to a ban and removal of CFW would not prevent a ban.​

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An even worse situation is when you are the buyer of a modded console and have no clue what B9S, Luma, GodMode9… are. If you did not mod the system yourself but got it premodded you have virtually no idea what has been done to a 2/3DS. (In the sense: "You do not understand these things." and in the sense "You have no idea if the seller modified system components.")

If you just got a modded 2/3DS console and have no clue what to do next: “Delete everything for a fresh start!” is the absolute worst thing you can do.

The good news is: You will find all help you need here on the forum.

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Often opinions and statements like this one can be found (not an actual quote; just an example) :

“Hey, what is with that big red warning GodMode9 shows when running Un-install Hax? There is no reason for that ‘Your console may brick!!’ scaremongering! I just removed B9S and everything is fine!”

For a long period there was no method of indicating if removing B9S would lead to a fully bricked 2/3DS which can only be revived by reinstalling B9S with ntrboot. Thanks to the safety test on the guide this problem is no more. Now with the safety test everything is fine… or not? NO! It is not! The test is very good! An extremely helpful idea preventing full bricks¹. But it does not ensure removing B9S has no bad side effects.

Even if your console boots to the Home Menu when doing the safety test, there might be problems you will encounter after uninstalling the custom firmware. Problems that the short test (“Start Home Menu without signature patches”) does not show and even errors that can make reinstalling B9S through the "Miner"-methods impossible².

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Update April 16th 2021: The uninstallation guide on 3ds.hacks.guide now has a lot more checks. Please make sure you do all the tests to the letter if you want to uninstall CFW to prevent negative side effects. The problems below still apply when not doing all the tests (although overall situation has improved thanks to new exploits allowing reinstallation in case of non-working parts – like DS mode – most of the time).
The most important part was and still is checking if native firm boots to Home Menu. If not you'll brick with the uninstall script and will need ntrboot to recover your device
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A few examples for problems after uninstalling CFW:

1: Bricked DS(i) mode

I have no idea why this happens so often, but one thing is sure: It does happen. In the most cases this can be repaired by reinstalling the DSi CIAs (either by downloading them from somewhere or – like the guide now advises – by deleting the titles and doing a normal system update). Sometimes even CTRTransfer was needed for whatever reason.
If your DS(i) mode is bricked and you did not notice it before uninstalling B9S, this will not affect the safety test. After uninstalling B9S you neither can delete the damaged titles nor reinstall CIAs from somewhere. And the "Miner" way of reinstalling B9S is blocked.²
Tested by renaming the folder “title” on TWLN to “Sitle” → DS(i) mode fully broken, but safety test is successful.

2: Super-bricked DS(i) mode

If you happen to have your TWLN partition unusable, this does not affect the safety test as well. This can make normal System Updates impossible. If your device is not on the latest firmware – or Nintendo releases the next surprising “stability update”, you have successfully locked yourself out of any online functions – in addition to the borked DS(i) mode.

I tried it by provoking a needed update for TWL titles while TWLN was super-bricked. The official updater got stuck at about 20%. I waited more than 10 minutes – no movement of progress bar – nothing.​

3. Modified non-essential NAND-titles

A 2/3DS may have modified (not signed!) titles which are not needed to boot, but will not work without signature patches. In this case the keyboard. There also can be some kind of leftovers like Flipnote Studio still injected into Download Play. To repair this you need “root privileges”.
By uninstalling CFW, you lock the door, throw away the key and after that you now notice that you did not tidy up the house. In this case Flipnote Studio can – hopefully – be used to reinstall B9S.​

4. Illegitimate titles making Data Management crash

The uninstall section of the guide advises the user to remove any non-signed software before running the uninstall script. If you do not do this "Data Management" can be rendered unusable after running "Un-install Hax". This can be easily tested by opening all Data Management options while doing the safety test.​

5. FBI injected into Health and Safety Information

Very minor problem – at least for me. Removing CFW while FBI is injected into H&S (done e.g. via GodMode9 script) will render the pretty useless (my opinion) text showing app unusable.​

6. System Settings crashing

Here is an example for System Settings crashing with the very helpful "An error has occurred" message after uninstalling CFW. Other things like creating Miis or searching the eShop failed as well. (My wild guess on this is something with shared extdata on CTRNAND, but this could be completely wrong). Very similar to this… Another case: CFW seems to be gone, System Settings crash and on screen keyboard does not work (probably custom keyboard installed).​

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If you are still dead set against keeping CFW on your device, at the very least do some more testing than simply booting Home Menu with NATIVE_FIRM (but do not test the official updater while running NATIVE_FIRM – in this case B9S is not protected and may be overwritten before you have tried out everything).

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If anybody has other ideas how to bring a 2/3DS into a state where removing CFW does not fully brick but has side effects, please explain it me so I can add it to the list.

Please don't ask me how to proceed with uninstallation. I chose not to assist in removing CFW anymore because of possible problems. All the explanation can be found on the guide: https://3ds.hacks.guide/uninstall-cfw

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¹ If you (or a previous owner) modified console unique data (such as SecureInfo_A, LocalFriendCodeSeed_B) or there are modifications on the Home Menu (different text or font or color – whatever), removing B9S (=only loading the official firmware without signature patches) will render the console useless.
This is what the test simulates without actually removing B9S.
² This is not fully true anymore. The path "Seedminer → Homebrew Launcher (Pichaxx) →DSiWare Dumper" of the guide now includes the optional step of using a "userland homebrew"-only version of TWLFix3DS. However this is not guaranteed to work. Bricked DS(i) mode can have other reasons too. In this case a defective camera module seems to be the reason for not working DS(i) mode.

* Example for successfully using TWLFix3DS without CFW: [I UNMODDED MY OLD 2DS AND NOW ITS MESSED UP.........(PLEASE HELP!)]
* EDIT: Example for "System Settings" → "Data Management" → "DSiWare" →"SD card" resulting in a useless crash when trying Seedminer (Bannerbomb3) or Seedminer (Pichaxx, DSiWare Dumper): [DSIWARE crashes when trying to install Luma]
The older Frogminer method injecting Jpn Flipnote Studio into DS Download Play worked in this case. CFW had been uninstalled by the previous owner before selling the system on Ebay. I've no idea why the newer Seedminer methods did not work.​

 

[botik]

In the risk group of the console with a changed region, movable.sed and LocalFriendCodeSeed_B.Before deleting CFW, all this data should be returned to the original otherwise get brick

 

[KleinesSinchen]

In the risk group of the console with a changed region, movable.sed and LocalFriendCodeSeed_B.Before deleting CFW, all this data should be returned to the original otherwise get brick

That's the kind of changes the safety test can detect (and what makes the test indispensable) – It will freeze and not boot into Home Menu.

Besides: Region changing and removing B9S is possible (but a really bad idea).

 

[KleinesSinchen]

I’ve seen a lot of threads with cries for help in the last few weeks which I file internally under

“The Let’s Delete Everything!! Problem”​

Now I felt the need to write about this once more – beyond occasional silent updates/additions to the original post. Hopefully some people will see this before deleting everything. This is written with more Nintendo consoles in mind (DSi, 2|3DS, Wii, Wii U) rather than only 2|3DS which is covered in detail above. To a lesser extend this is also true for R4 clone flashcarts (people have deleted their kernel software and now don't know where to find it). Because it would be repetitive to have another, similar thread, I thought it would be a good idea to leave these general additional comments (not only for 2|3DS) here. Hope this is okay.

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Factory Reset, getting rid of “hacks”, uninstall custom firmware, remove modifications, going back to stock, a fresh start, start over, start from scratch, formatting console, formatting SD. There are a lot of possible names for this topic that has caused quite some trouble (unnecessary work), data loss and even bricked consoles.

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I don’t know where this very common idea comes from¹ but one thing is sure: Simply deleting everything does not make any sense! Please, don’t that. This is not gonna help and can in the worst case softbrick your console.

Depending on what is installed on your console a simple deletion might be possible or a catastrophic idea.

• Please do some reading; search the web for the software modification you have on the console.
• If you are a total beginner and unsure what is the current status of a device: Sign up here on GBAtemp, open a new thread and describe your situation as good as possible (or post into the NOOB-PARADISE thread for your console). Chances are that you will get competent help.

“But why is factory reset/delete everything bad? It should simply restore the defaults!”

Because factory reset does not do what one would think at first. It does not restore the device to the state it had when it came out of the box. Consoles don’t have a secondary (ROM-)chip for total restoration. Wishful thinking! As good as this would be – imagine a small dip switch to enable the secondary/emergency OS for reflashing the main (NAND-)chip – if you think about this, it immediately shows a problem (beyond the additional costs): Total restoration would essentially mean a possibility to downgrade firmware – which is something console manufacturers do not want.
All a factory reset on an unmodified console does is throwing away the user profile(s), installed software(games) and saves while keeping the current firmware/OS version intact. As there is no (intended) way to reinstall the OS like on a computer, the OS obviously might not delete itself.

And if you start thinking about this now you will see the problem: If the OS has been modified, it is not guaranteed to behave as expected when starting the factory reset procedure:

• The console might brick (e.g. CBHC, Cold Boot Haxchi on Wii U)
• You might lock yourself out of future homebrew/CFW usage (HackMii Installer not accepting cIOS, Wii semi-bricks, Seedminer not working, crashing apps on 2|3DS)
  
• The modification(s) “hacks” might simply survive the factory reset when your goal was to “get back to stock” (e.g. B9S, boot9strap on the 3DS)

Custom firmware (“hacks”) allows the user to do things not intended by the manufacturer – including damaging the OS. Now think about the following situation:

You did something wrong (or something went wrong) and your console behaves erratically or strange. The installed games and homebrew applications will in the most cases not be the culprit (the presence of apps/games is not the cause of error). Deleting them with a factory reset will not make the OS “turn back to normal” but will make repairing the damage harder or even impossible.

Uninstalling CFW because the console doesn’t work correctly is like leaving a house with internal damage, locking the door and throwing away the key… and hoping everything inside will magically repair itself.




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¹ I really would like to know this! Why do so many people thing simply deleting everything on a console NAND and/or the console/flashcart (micro-)SD is a good idea? Is this some kind of religious sacrifice? “I sacrifice my data to the Gods of Gaming Consoles and pray for a miracle to occur in order to get things done in my favor!”

 

[zhol259]

How to Un-install the b9s thx

 

[lone_wolf323]

How to Un-install the b9s thx

there is a guide you use on 3ds.hacks.guide . The question is for you, why are you wanting to uninstall cfw?

 

[zhol259]

there is a guide you use on 3ds.hacks.guide . The question is for you, why are you wanting to uninstall cfw?

thx I want to Return to the original . collect.

 

[lone_wolf323]

thx I want to Return to the original . collect.

still makes no sense. Going back to stock does not gain you anything or benefit you in any which way.

 

[Dan-the-Rebirth]

So I have been out of the loop for a few years(got a switch) and I had the luck to find the SD cards I used for my 3ds again. But if I lose the b9s SD card my 3ds is trash right because of the otp files. Is that still the case?

 

[lone_wolf323]

So I have been out of the loop for a few years(got a switch) and I had the luck to find the SD cards I used for my 3ds again. But if I lose the b9s SD card my 3ds is trash right because of the otp files. Is that still the case?

your 3ds is fine. you just run the restoring b9s and it will work as you want.

 

[Kwyjor]

But if I lose the b9s SD card my 3ds is trash right because of the otp files. Is that still the case?

OTP hasn't been necessary for years, b9s is not installed to the SD card, people lose SD cards all the time, ntrboot is almost always an option as a last resort, and none of this is relevant to the topic of this thread. See http://3ds.guide/restoring-cfw .

 

[KleinesSinchen]

Huh? Missed the question above. As @Kwyjor said: It has nothing to do with this thread.

Please don't reply here for questions. General question go into the 3DS NOOB PARADISE thread.

This topic is just for collecting information about potential problem when removing custom firmware/B9S from a 2|3DS. I don't expect any new variants on this, but who knows? The guide now has a lot of checks to do before uninstallation. Following this to the letter should not lead to any problems -- nobody can guarantee this though. As long as you stay away from YouTube/video guides which might be missing important checks your console should be fine.

I still stand by my opinion: Uninstalling B9S is a bad idea and useless.