Hacking Hacking DSi

[houseonfire]

*reserved for the day the DSi is cracked so i can say - "I told you so"*

Everything is crackable, simple as.

Simple as what.

 

[DeltaBurnt]

*reserved for the day the DSi is cracked so i can say - "I told you so"*

Everything is crackable, simple as.

Simple as what.

He forgot to add in 'that' xD

 

[mah sentry]

couldn't you just log everything after it is decrypted?

 

[houseonfire]

couldn't you just log everything after it is decrypted?

decrypt it

 

[mah sentry]

couldn't you just log everything after it is decrypted?

decrypt it

doesnt the hardware have to decrypt it somewhere?

 

[xxRAG3]

What do you mean? What is a DSi mode?

Normal DS ram is 4 mb

DSi mode is i think 16 mb.

Flash carts only allow the DSi to use 4 mb not its full capacity.
Also DSi has WEP Wifi which Normal DS Mode doesn't support.

In other words, if a DSi exclusive game came out and somehow you where able to play it using a flash cart on your DSi.
The game will run like if its on a normal DS, not the DSi.
I have read that Nintendo plans to release DSi exclusive games but they will also play on the normal DS, but the extra features that the DSi has will not show.
So the flash carts do exactly that, makes your DSi run in DS mode when running back ups.
Thats why also "DSiWare" doesn't run directly from a flash cart also the format of DSiWare has to do with nor running since its not a rom but bin file.

No way to change that?

 

[shortperson1026]

couldn't you just log everything after it is decrypted?

decrypt it

doesnt the hardware have to decrypt it somewhere?

Yes; there's a decryption and/or encryption key located in the firmware... which is also encrypted.

So discovering the firmware encryption key = success.

 

[Fabis94]

Oh so we just need to find that firmware key. And umm how do we do that?

 

[FAST6191]

I was kind of joking when I said next time hacking proper but OK.

@xxRAG3 that is the hypervisor concept I spoke of in the essay like post I made in this thread.

re: log everything after it is decrypted. It it is a well known, well documented and frequently used hacking technique and indeed I have been involved in more than a few tools for it (car stuff mainly). The terms you want here are bus sniffing, memory dumping and memory logging. The tools necessary are probably outside the domain of the garage hacker but I assure you that you can put together tools from off the shelf parts*.

However such signals/decryption is likely to be contained within chips leaving us without a nice bus to latch on to (see the recent stuff with the new d-nothing self contained drive controller chips on the wii)
http://www.vimeo.com/3081101 (there is another on google video and downloads should be around somewhere too).
Again that 360 talk is useful:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxjpmc8ZIxM&fmt=18

Also as I mentioned above there are likely two keys; one to encrypt and one to decrypt. Only the decryption key is necessary and Nintendo likely have the encryption key stashed somewhere we can not get it.

*you want some method to insert pins. This naturally means small movement, microscopes can other devices can be abused for such things (the fine focus on the trays is awesome)
You want signals analysis, traditionally this would have been hard but these days USB oscilloscopes, signals analysis and a raft of other tools are available.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Search.aspx?menuno=12545
http://www.virtualvillage.co.uk/items/item...?itemid=4795694
You want some method of picture taking, kids microscopes come with cameras and I have retrofitted a few to more high end equipment.
http://www.opticsplanet.net/konus-300x-kon...microscope.html
Remember it is not all about resolution either, stitching together photographs is easy enough.

And finally rework stations are in the realms of sensible prices:
http://www.cellcorner.com/xshp/unlock-phon...ng-station.html

For giggles CNC machines:
http://www.brusselsprout.org/CNC/

Plastics moulding equipment is available at most hobby shops (as in planes and trains sort of thing) and I can assure you the detail level has long exceeded consumer electronics.

I encourage you to watch the chip reverse engineering video above, most of what they are doing is with if not household equipment then certainly stuff available to the public (with the possible exception of HF acid, that stuff is restricted somewhat although there are alternatives). Everything else is standard metallography techniques.

Electronics:
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engin...ience/index.htm
http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_Repair.html
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/emcon.html#emcon
http://www.kpsec.freeuk.com/
For computing I suggest the rom hacking docs.

 

[Noitora]

*reserved for the day the DSi is cracked so i can say - "I told you so"*

Everything is crackable, simple as.

Simple as what.

He forgot to add in 'that' xD

He'll add it when the DSi is cracked.

 

[Mbmax]

I wonder if DSi games will be released with DSi firmware upgrade inside like it is on wii game (must do the update to be able to play).
If it's the case, it's probably not that hard to dump the game card and search for the firmware part.

Wait and see those DSi games.

 

[Livin in a box]

I wonder if DSi games will be released with DSi firmware upgrade inside like it is on wii game (must do the update to be able to play).
If it's the case, it's probably not that hard to dump the game card and search for the firmware part.

Wait and see those DSi games.

Yeah, I was thinking that. But surely then if a game uses the full memory then there wouldn't be any room for an update? But I want there to be an update on a cart now. ^^

 

[toejam316]

I wonder if DSi games will be released with DSi firmware upgrade inside like it is on wii game (must do the update to be able to play).
If it's the case, it's probably not that hard to dump the game card and search for the firmware part.

Wait and see those DSi games.

Yeah, I was thinking that. But surely then if a game uses the full memory then there wouldn't be any room for an update? But I want there to be an update on a cart now. ^^

No dice, Nintendo aren't that stupid. The updates bundled on the games generally have the same encryption as the downloadable updates. Odds are at best, we'll be able to rip the updates out of them to reduce the ROM size, and at worst, we won't know what the hell is going on and will have to just leave it there.

 

[Fabis94]

So how is the whole thing with encryption going? People are already working on it, right?

 

[wchill]

Yes, I'm posting in IRC every 10 minutes to recruit people for the job.

 

[literealm]

well, does no1 use google?
apperantly there is a new r4 for the dsi, so google "r4i" to buy the new r4

 

[FAST6191]

well, does no1 use google?
apperantly there is a new r4 for the dsi, so google "r4i" to buy the new r4

2 things
1) The DSi compatible cards already came up. This thread is on making flash carts and/or hacking the DSi to get access/use the extra hardware not use a DS flash cart able to bypass the extra security of the DSi as it presently exists.

2) Why oh why would we get the R4i when, in what I think is fair to say, every other DSi capable cart is better than it.

 

[BlackNeedle]

Well, I might just try to contribute something, even though it probably doesn't help a alot...

1. During an update, at some point the downloaded FW has to be decrypted. This should mean, there has to be an encryption algorithm somewhere on teh DSi, and in terms of logic it should be unencrypted, shouldn't it? So wouldn't it be easier to just try extracting that part?

2. Also those keys should be anywhere inside that little machine's memory, shouldn't they? So why not just try using any single one of those bits you find in there as a key? Should still be a lot of work, but surely less than just plain BruteForce?

Just some ideas, which probably result from my lack in knowledge of the DSi-System.
~Gr33tz, BlackNeedle.

 

[Orangegamer]

its just simple as pie

u know what they put in the cards that DO already work in the DSi
why don't u just put that certain file or something and just copy and paste it in to each and every one of ur flashcards

wouldn't that work?

 

[Fabis94]

its just simple as pie

u know what they put in the cards that DO already work in the DSi
why don't u just put that certain file or something and just copy and paste it in to each and every one of ur flashcards

wouldn't that work?

You have no idea how Cracking and Hacking works, don't you?