Hacking Devolution - Public Release

[crono141]

Hehe, yeah...if the Wii U information is right, the Wii architecture is completely different and Wii mode is not done with IOS.

Not sure what information you're referring to, the WiiU is not much different from the Wii at all (same CPU family) and still uses IOS.

Ok, i should have said speculations from some game news sites and game forums on the web..no one has actually seen the Wii U OS, non of that info is released to the public yet.

The ONLY place I've seen it mentioned before today (and I HAVEN'T actually been looking a lot either) described the (admittedly unconfirmed) architecture and it sounded a lot like the Wii's IOS's. It said something about the operating system running on a separate processor and old versions of it being stored for compatibility.
Again, though, they did say it was unconfirmed information.

Shoot, if we can get Wii homebrew working on Wii U right out the box I think my head would asplode.

 

[WiiUBricker]

"People" have seen it, trust me on this.

Yes, we already know that "people" have seen it since the Wii U announcement at last year's E3.

 

[Maxternal]

"People" have seen it, trust me on this.

Yes, we already know that "people" have seen it since the Wii U announcement at last year's E3.

even before then, I think he was talking about game developer people.

 

[McHaggis]

"People" have seen it, trust me on this.

Yes, we already know that "people" have seen it since the Wii U announcement at last year's E3.

I think by "people", he means hackers (or himself) have had a look at how it works or some developer has leaked information confirming IOS's migration to the new system.

I'd be interested to see if the Wii U can prevent current Wii hacks. 3DS can't stop DS mode hacks, Wii couldn't stop GC mode hacks, Vita can't stop PSP mode hacks, etc. It's difficult to eliminate hacks completely without breaking compatibility. Getting Devolution up and running on the Wii U would be a marvellous kick in the teeth to Nintendo, who could have probably included GameCube compatibility without much effort on their part.

 

[OriginalHamster]

Killer7 was one of the two games (the other being Resident Evil 4) that I used while implementing the disc swapping, so I know it works.

Do you have the NTSCU or PAL Killer7 version?

 

[OriginalHamster]

Not sure what information you're referring to, the WiiU is not much different from the Wii at all (same CPU family) and still uses IOS.

Do you mean that Wii emulation still uses IOS, or the Wii U system itself still use an IOS based OS?
It's pretty interesting indeed.

 

[JoostinOnline]

Just from the videos you can tell that it won't use the same IOS setup. Each IOS is firmware on the Wii, and only one piece of software can run at one time, which is why you can't access the System Menu and such without closing a channel. The opposite is true for the Wii U based on the videos.

Most likely they will have a single IOS for Wii games so it will enter a "Wii mode", just as the Wii does with GC games (BC and MIOS).

At least this is my understanding. I imagine tueidj could provide more information on the subject if I misunderstood how the Wii works.

 

[SifJar]

Just from the videos you can tell that it won't use the same IOS setup. Each IOS is firmware on the Wii, and only one piece of software can run at one time, which is why you can't access the System Menu and such without closing a channel. The opposite is true for the Wii U based on the videos.

Most likely they will have a single IOS for Wii games so it will enter a "Wii mode", just as the Wii does with GC games (BC and MIOS).

At least this is my understanding. I imagine tueidj could provide more information on the subject if I misunderstood how the Wii works.

I'd personally doubt they'll use just one IOS. While the piracy (or "backups") community have shown that the vast majority of games will run OK with just one IOS, the reason there are so many IOS on the Wii is to ensure compatibility with older titles. In other words, when a new version of IOS is developed, it is installed alongside the old version, and old games will continue to use the old version. New features are never added to old versions of IOS (e.g. IOS9 has never had any new features added to it). The reason being that games using old versions of IOS (in the case of IOS9, an example would be Twilight Princess) are tested using that old version of IOS. They definitely work with that version of IOS. There could be unforeseen bugs arising from the new features added to new versions of IOS.

Nintendo won't want to re-test the entire back catalogue of Wii games with just one IOS, it'd be much easier from their point of view to include all or most of the same IOS as are present in the Wii. Obviously they won't need the any of the SM IOS, or Korean IOS or whatever. Just any of the IOS used by games.

 

[JoostinOnline]

Just from the videos you can tell that it won't use the same IOS setup. Each IOS is firmware on the Wii, and only one piece of software can run at one time, which is why you can't access the System Menu and such without closing a channel. The opposite is true for the Wii U based on the videos.

Most likely they will have a single IOS for Wii games so it will enter a "Wii mode", just as the Wii does with GC games (BC and MIOS).

At least this is my understanding. I imagine tueidj could provide more information on the subject if I misunderstood how the Wii works.

I'd personally doubt they'll use just one IOS. While the piracy (or "backups") community have shown that the vast majority of games will run OK with just one IOS, the reason there are so many IOS on the Wii is to ensure compatibility with older titles. In other words, when a new version of IOS is developed, it is installed alongside the old version, and old games will continue to use the old version. New features are never added to old versions of IOS (e.g. IOS9 has never had any new features added to it). The reason being that games using old versions of IOS (in the case of IOS9, an example would be Twilight Princess) are tested using that old version of IOS. They definitely work with that version of IOS. There could be unforeseen bugs arising from the new features added to new versions of IOS.

Nintendo won't want to re-test the entire back catalogue of Wii games with just one IOS, it'd be much easier from their point of view to include all or most of the same IOS as are present in the Wii. Obviously they won't need the any of the SM IOS, or Korean IOS or whatever. Just any of the IOS used by games.

That makes sense as well. My point was that, based on the videos, Wii U games won't use an IOS for each game. I don't know how it will run, but it can't run both the background processes (i.e. the System Menu) that we see in the videos AND the games at the same time if it's set up like the Wii.

If they use a new IOS for Wii games, I believe that they can block all current disc exploits. Is that not the case?

 

[SifJar]

That makes sense as well. My point was that, based on the videos, Wii U games won't use an IOS for each game. I don't know how it will run, but it can't run both the background processes (i.e. the System Menu) that we see in the videos AND the games at the same time if it's set up like the Wii.

If they use a new IOS for Wii games, I believe that they can block all current disc exploits. Is that not the case?

Well, all the save game based exploits could be blocked with a simple SM update at this point (I'm not completely clear on how the block of those exploits works exactly, but it has to do with a blacklist in the SM, it's not down to IOS). Presumably the WiiU "System Menu" or whatever will implement the same blocks, including the currently unblocked exploits. That just leaves Smash Stack. It's unclear (to me, at the very least) whether they could fix that with an IOS change or not, although I'm sure there's something they could do to stop it working. Although all this really has nothing to do with Devolution.

 

[Maxternal]

I would guess that it would be something like the BC and MIOS in the Wii (BC and IOSes in this case)

I think there are a lot of people even on the Wii that think that the home menu included in each game is actually part of the system menu when it's actually part of the game they're playing. I think the ability to access MiiVerse from the home menu does not necessarily mean that the system menu is still running (although it could be)

I had heard someone theorize that no non-stub IOS existed above 100 because the 100-200 range would be reserved for Wii U IOS but even if that's so, I'd bet they'd be blocked in Wii compatibility mode (Unlike GameCube mode where DM(L) is proof that Wii hardware is still accessible) since I understand that the DSi and 3DS do have some sort of hardware disabling for backwards compatibility modes so hacking the whole Wii U from Wii compatibility mode might not be possible and a permanent HBC channel type setup might be difficult but some Wii retail disk exploits should still be available.

I'm not sure how much work it is to enable the AHBPROT flag (if it's even available) but I'd assume that would be the biggest hurtle to get over in being able to run Devolution in Wii compatibility mode.

 

[Cyan]

this discussion would be better in the other thread (about Gamecube on WiiU).
Please let's go back to Devolution subject here.
Thanks.

 

[Maxternal]

this discussion would be better in the other thread (about Gamecube on WiiU).
Please let's go back to Devolution subject here.
Thanks.

Sure, here's a link to that thread for reference.
http://gbatemp.net/topic/328659-theres-no-reason-why-the-wii-u-cant-be-compatible-with-gamec/
I guess we have permission to bump it then

 

[crono141]

This thread appears to be dying down. Can we get an update on what you're working on, tueidj? Something to fuel excitement?

 

[Etheboss]

This thread appears to be dying down. Can we get an update on what you're working on, tueidj? Something to fuel excitement?

You're kidding right, almost 2 pages of posts in 1 day...i would not call it dying down..

 

[tueidj]

Currently working on two separate features for PSO fans.

 

[crono141]

Currently working on two separate features for PSO fans.

Thanks.

You're kidding right, almost 2 pages of posts in 1 day...i would not call it dying down..

2 pages of off topic discussion about WiiU.

 

[Etheboss]

You're kidding right, almost 2 pages of posts in 1 day...i would not call it dying down..

2 pages of off topic discussion about WiiU.

NVM, i just think it's presumptuous to conclude at this time the topic is dying down..

 

[Maxternal]

Currently working on two separate features for PSO fans.

I will guess ...
One of those is BBA emulation.
the other one ... hmm ? ? ...

 

[JohnyNyga]

Hello, I've got a question. I've got a Wii with no backward compatibility with GameCube , and the box says sth like : No support for GameCube Controllers or discs. And afaik Devolution needs to verify my game disc, but I assume, that without compatibility with GC discs I cannot do this. Or can I ? I don't want to buy GC game only to learn that my Wii cannot read it and just waste my money.
Thanks in advance