I just don't like gamers...

Note in advance: I'm 35 and this is one of those "you darn kids!!!" posts. Be warned if you step on my lawn. ;)


So...I obviously wouldn't be on this site if I didn't like games or the technical aspects therearound (read: hacking). Reading about news, games, new hacks...that sort of thing still excites me after...well, ever since I first heard about it.
However, I now have a girlfriend whom I'm seeing more than any previous one (she'll be moving in in a couple months), and as such gaming is taking more of a backseat. Ironically, my time spend on this forum barely takes a hit. Perhaps it's the addiction to news and interesting tidbits, the fact it's PEOPLE rather than AI opponents. Perhaps it's my arrogance to tell youngsters how to do things ("you shouldn't like THAT game, but THIS one, damnit! YOU ARE SO WRONG!!!" ;) ). But as the title already mentions: I never really fit in to the group "gamers".
This may be strange, as the word is just a representation of 'one who plays games', right? So I should be a gamer as well...right?

Well...yes and no. The definition of a word depends on how it is collectively used. And while I do play games, I find myself drifting further and further away from the general perceived reception of the word. And I'm not talking about the socially inadequate nerd who embodies the cliché of the word "gamer".

First of all: my choice of games, and when I play them. I just can't get excited about trailers or hype trains. I can easily count the combined number of times I've made preorders, early access and DLC on one hand. This isn't about being hip to complain about it: I just don't do it. I play games, but I don't want a T-shirt with a Zelda emblem or a fallout miniature. To me, it feels like I'm endorsing a group I no longer belong to. Assuming I ever belonged to it.
Somewhat tying into that: board games. Perhaps it's these forums, but I feel like I'm the only one who even considers them GAMES (though it should be obvious).

Second is the attitude of gamers. It's like they're always busy complaining about things not working, no matter how small it is. And it might be these forums, but the whole "I pirate but I'm still ethical about it" gets annoying. Why am I on a same forum as someone who not only feels entitled to have to pay less than the asking price because he's a customer* and 60 bucks feels too much for him. Or why one should get a reduction in price because the game isn't long enough.
It's times like these I'm reminded of late last century. Games were around 1500 Belgian Franks back then for gameboy, 2000 for PC games. That's about 37, respectively 50 euros. Sounds familiar? Yes...these prices are still somewhat similar today. And that's pretty shocking, because inflation made pretty much everything else cost at least twice as much (same went for the average earnings). So in effect, gaming is half the price. And that's not taking into account a few other important caveats of today:
-the internet was basically non-existent. No user opinions, youtube videos or let's plays. There were gaming magazines, but if you think reviews are subjective now you should read up on a few of the old "reviews" (nintendo just had their own magazine that just sucked up to everything they made).
-PC gaming was excessively bad due to technological innovations. Since around 2006, things have slowed down a bit but back then you couldn't hope to buy a PC that wasn't obsolete within 2 years. And by obsolete, I mean that games just pushed the hardware that much. All this bitching about FPS being locked to 30 was nothing to your PC actually getting to start or play in non-slideshow mode.
-the second hand market wasn't up to snuff. Sure, console game trading happened, but stores carrying second hand games were rare. That, and the lack of virtual platforms (steam came much later), meant that prices remained set for years. If you told me I could one day get half a dozen games legally for the price less than a day's meal and support charity in the process, I would've said you were crazy.
-nostalgics to pixelart games either have selective memories or were too young to remember, but not every other game was a Mario or a Zelda. Storytelling usually sucked, elements like saving and new game+ weren't standard and the difficulty was only fun in, well...actually GOOD games. I'd say there was more variety then, but that's not entirely correct because there wasn't an indie scene like today. But granted: AAA-titles were still somewhat creative (read: they didn't sequel the reboot of the update of the addition of a spin-off).
-though not something your average gamer cares about but hugely important: game making assets were scarce. Creating games was a lot harder than it is nowadays (as I write this, you can get the entire physix engine and a bunch of assets in a humble bundle...even for commercial use), and the developers of today are the gamers of yesterday. That really shows, as there were certainly games made by people who had no idea what their audience wanted.

Honestly: the more I think of it, the more I think this is the paradise I'd have imagined when I was a kid**: more games than the eye could see. I'm at 500 games in steam right now, and I still find novel gems to play. A simple example: Cook, serve delicious, my favorite game of last year, is getting a sequel this year. Not only that, but the developer has asked me to participate in beta tests. Things just couldn't get better for me unless Miyamoto offered me a blowjob! :D

...but why do I feel like I'm the only one actually LIKING games? It's as if there was a general gamer meeting where everyone agreed to be grumpy and angry for no real reason. Yes, yes...I know there are downsides to our industry and hobby. But I sometimes feel like all the community can do is whine about things. There is movement against DLC, and the voicing that it erodes games of "a full experience" by selling you bits and pieces back to you for - in total - more cash. Why can't I just be allowed not to have an opinion on it and just play games like I want? There are still plenty of games without it, or where it isn't tacked on. And there are plenty of reviews that are much easier to find than ever, so...why should I care?

Then there's the thing about branches and franchise. Game X killed the franchise. Or mechanic Y. Or story aspect Z. Yeah, so? I've got my own beef with UT3, and I love UT2004 more than most of you love your favorite game. However, unlike "gamers", I don't write that in the past tence. I've had an absolute blast with UT2004, and that experience doesn't diminish because the sequel wasn't up to MY personal standards (which it shouldn't be in the first place).
Gamers seem to wallow into that self pity. And I don't understand why. To me, personally, games are about challenges that you overcome. Strange, that gamers don't seem to realise that this just isn't something to do WITHIN a game. These same people will, like me, immediately search for alternatives if action A won't work. Outside the game, though, they'll keep repeating action A (complaining about something) ad infinitum. Why? It's not so hard to guess that complaining on a forum developers don't even read won't improve a game. As such, I spend my time with other games (since when was gaming about protecting a franchise, btw? or worse: about protecting your own identity***).

Worse still is the shortsighted view that one's taste correlates to all games. And that's just...sad. In addition to gaming, I like reading, watching movies and listening to music. Do you know how much time I would waste by telling everyone who reads a book I don't like, watches a movie that isn't my style or listens to hiphop? I wouldn't have any life of my own left! Gladly, my fellow bookers, movie-ers and musicphiliacs allow me my own choice in what I like. Not so on games. Gamers make a sports of telling everyone else that their opinion is wrong. The wiiu sucks! Mobile games suck! Controllers are nothing compared to keyboard and mouse! Gaming platforms that aren't called steam are terrible! EA is the devil! Indies are too much hipster!
...and so on, and so on. I get that since games take more investment time than other media, we tend to go for more familiar experiences. But is it so hard to leave other gamers to their opinion? Rather than encourage others to share the same medium, we dish everyone who isn't into our little subset of the kind of games we like.
Take Cook, serve, delicious again for reference. It's hard to pin down if it is actually, objectively a good game because it is pretty unique in what it does. Nonetheless, the CSD2 announcement was somewhat spoiled by people who dislike it because it "isn't making enough use of the graphical capacibilities of the PS4"****. Translation: so-called gamers want all games to clock in 60 FPS as well as attempt to be as realistic as possible (even though the handdrawn style fits the game much, much more).

Time for a confession: I never played minecraft or MOBA's. The premise of just building stuff simply doesn't appeal to me. However, I'm glad it got made and is hugely successful. This isn't a game for ME, but it captures an audience with values I feel strongly about. It proved once and for all that if you take time and effort, you'll get something in the end. People who play games can be socially active, engaged and passionate. They can spend hours in making something of beauty. It's a young audience, but these will be the gamers of tomorrow (while the gamers of today will be the old grumpy men of tomorrow...probably with artritis on their hands). If it was up to me, they inherited the term today. Gamers like me mostly grew up with violent games that putted you against enemy players. Winning happened inevitably at the cost of other players...fairly often humans. These are not the only kind of games. Console games now often have co-op modii, games where you help each other out are fairly common and even on board games, co-ops have blossomed into a genre. If games really teach things (and we shouldn't kid ourselves: they do), we'll see more co-operative minded players entering gaming boards. Until that time...I just don't like gamers.

Thanks for reading. I hope it gave some food for thought. :)


*which is an oxymoron in itself: you're not a customer until you pay, and you can't pay because THE GAME ISN'T EVEN OUT YET!
**this was before I got into girls. Now I have a girl AND a smorgasmboard of games
***someone threw that argument at me when I questioned his reason to crusade against expensive games. I could point out that he CHOOSE to act bitter and entitled to something he had no right to, but again, I've learned to adapt. he's on my ignore-list now.
****I guess just calculating pi in the background isn't going to cut it ;-)
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good article :)
gamers are awful shits now. and yeah reviews were biased shit just no one cared back then it seems.
 
I agree the gaming community has definately took a dive over the years. I think it has to do more with society shifting than actual gamers. In general more people feel entitled to do/say whatever they please since the "everyone is a winner" generation. We also have Social justice warriors polluting the scene with their rhetoric. In general the gaming community has mostly gone to shit and it just isn't as enjoyable as it once used to be.
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I also love how everyone's hyped about the XB1/PC cross-platform online play but yet could be done on Dreamcast. I believe one of SNK vs Capcom titles could be cross-played DC and PS2.
 
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I don't care about reviewers, I don't care about console wars, don't care about PC vs consoles, don't care about online multiplayer, don't care about youtubers.

Me bf n me are going to live together in a few months as well.
We both play games and both will continue to play games for ourselves and or with each other.
One thing is for sure, the both of us hate children so we won't ever adopt ;'D
 
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I don't follow any of those 'funny YouTubers' anyway I have a traditional and British sense of humour thanks to watching classic sitcoms etc.

I just play for fun that's the entire point.
 
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I don't know about the rest of the stuff, but some of the first games I ever played (Wizard of Wor, w0000t ) were co-op. This probably stemmed from the fact most of these games had arcade roots or were copying arcade games, where the goal was to extend the gameplay your coin would buy, instead of kicking each other out of the game as soon as possible. So the co-op mode was more popular and more catered to.

Then again I may be terribly biased :tpi:
 
I'd like to add a bit, if I may. Mainly about this notion of "hardcore", or "true" gaming. This usually translates to meaning First Person Shooters/Action here in the west (which, for our discussion, includes games like skyrim and fallout). Why. WHYYYYYYYY.

Because of the complexity? surely not, because complex and difficult puzzle games are written off as "filthy casual" games.
Because of the difficulty curve of controls? surely not, because that could just be bad design. The opposite could just as easily be good design.
Because of the story? surely not, but Japanese RPGs are written off as "behind the times" and "weeabo lolol".
Because of the community and discussion? surely not, because pokemon is thought of as a baby game by many of these silly people.
Because of the money put into it? possibly, because of reputation. Though there are many indie games that some consider "hardcore" or "for real gamers".
Because of the graphics? ahh, this, possibly. "it looks realistic, so therefore it's made for only the most hardcore! ME!" which sounds like someone who enjoys the smell of their own farts. Shallow and short-sighted. Which is align with most people who feel the need to use the "no true Scotsman" fallacy to make themselves feel like the more "real" gamer.

This is probably due people's odd need for community and belonging. Not only belonging, but high standing in their community. It becomes a pissing contest. The more that join the community, the more the need these individuals feel to prove themselves. Meaningful discussion turns into "this is mine, and you don't belong among my group". It's ego based and annoying. This runs parallel to your argument, not against.

I'm not anti-pirate, though the rest of your points I can agree with. EA is satan, though :P
 
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@osaka35 I don't think many gamers like the smell of their own farts as in I do not think most gamers are narcissistic,lots of gamers have absolutely filthy personal hygiene.
 
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I feel like there's somewhat of a confirmation bias when it comes to gamers complaining today when compared to in the past.

There's a few issues with this. The first major one, is that the internet wasn't so widespread in the past. If somebody complained about anything in general, not just games, you heard it from one of your friends. Now, because of the internet, you can hear anybody around the world voice their complaints.

Another issue is that, people tend to be more vocal about things they dislike over things they like. If there's twenty things somebody likes in a game, but one thing they don't, they're going to complain about the one thing they dislike if they want it to be fixed without mentioning the twenty things they do like.

There's other issues with the whole ability for developers to patch games over the internet. There wasn't really a reason to complain in the past. Even if you complained, the issue wasn't going to be fixed. Now because developers can fix the issue over the internet, people are more likely to complain, as it's actually possible for the issue to be fixed.

Of course, this isn't the case for all complaints, such as graphics. Personally, as long as the game is fun, I couldn't care less about how it looks. Sure, good graphics are nice, but good gameplay should always come first.

Also, remember the video game crashes that took place in the past as well. People weren't buying video games, as they didn't like the quality of video games being released. While it may not be vocal, it is still a form of complaining.

Anyway, personally, I don't really complain about too many things in games (unless it's something I think is extremely stupid), but I do feel like there's confirmation bias about gamers complaining in the past when compared to today. Also, as long as playing games is one of your hobbies, you're a gamer. Your opinion doesn't have to be the same as everyone else's to be one.
 
Wow...I didn't expect this many replies. Apparently, blogs do get read. :)

Let's see...I certainly have to mention that there are exceptions. Or not even exceptions but a silent majority. But majority or minority: there is a part that speaks (or pretend to speak) on behalf of gamers in such a way that I just don't identify with. When I game with friends (board games, mostly), it's about having fun. Yes, we try to win, but we never do it at the cost of someone else. I guess it does help to actually SEE the one you're gaming with.

@Cammygirl192 : reviews have changed mostly in perception. Nowadays, everyone expects reviews to be but a personal opinion, based on sufficient play. So it's mostly about finding a reviewer who has a general taste that is the same as yours; his/her opinion will be most likely to correlate with your own. So in that aspect, it's an improvement (in other words: a hundred opinions on a game is better than a few who pretend to have The Definitive Opinion about a game).

@funnystory : very nice graph (though I'm aware it can reflect my own opinion here). :) I...am not sure whether I want to further generalize ito an entire generation. The anonymity of the net certainly brings out something in us, but I know online communities that are more heartwarming than the gamer-crowds.

@Margen67 : yeah, sure, whatever. I'll give more value to your opinion if you actually optimize a game for 60FPS yourself. For now, I don't think you have an idea of how much work that involves (unless you want to render a bland white room).

@Cammygirl192 (again): yeah...it's not the first time people have hyped over something that was already pretty much granted. Marketing budgets sort of do that to people, I guess. :unsure:

@DinohScene : me neither. But it saddens me I have to plough through these remarks every time I want to talk about games. It's also about complaints that make no sense if you turn them around ("it's an awesome game because it runs at 60FPS!!!", or "this is great because it's a console exclusive! :D "). It's as if gamers are too busy setting standards as hoops to let developers jump through in order to get less flak.

@Veho: you're actually right. Old 90's arcades were pretty often co-op (for twice the money). The genre sort of got forgotten with the arcades themselves.

@osaka35 : you may certainly add it, and it probably holds merit. It may even be a very good analysis. Truth is that I can't tell. I'd walk around in T-shirts with "I played fallout and daggerfall before it was cool" if I wanted to make a statement, but I don't. It's easier to just avoid the spawn pits of "this game is hardcore!!!". And perhaps play them after the hype train has left the station (I'll get to dark souls one day...) and form my own opinion then.

@BobDoleOwndU : very true points. I'm certainly less inclined to make blogs about all the things RIGHT in video games than with the few things that bug me.
Still...the fact that a dev might pick it up in an obscure forum - or even a known one such as this - is pretty minimal. For one thing, it would mean that there'd be less complaining elsewhere since early access became a thing (the compl...criticism could go directly to the devs!!! :D ). And as mentioned: people LOOK for things to complain about. When talking about first hand experiences, I heard just as much people complaining about the issues with that latest batman games as ones who had no problems. Nonetheless, it was pulled from steam shortly after. Is that the power of the internet? :unsure:
 
It seems like you're referring to younger gamers. People that enjoy games just as varied as people that enjoy movies. I don't pre-order and I generally don't buy merchandise. I also don't needlessly complain about things on the internet or get into meme culture. I simply enjoy games between responsibilities. Just enjoy what you want, as long as you aren't hurting anyone. :grog:
 
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I'm really tired right now, so I probably didn't read everything properly or I'm just not understanding it completely, so excuse me if I say something wrong.

I agree with you to a certain extent, I wouldn't say we're entitled (at least in my case), it's more like my expectations for games are so high, that most games disappoint me. I've played amazing games such as Persona 4 Golden and the FF13 Trilogy, that a lot of other games simply bore me. I bought most AAA from 2015, I thought they all sucked (with the exception of Arkham Knight). I disliked MGSV, I disliked Fallout 4, and I tried forcing myself to like The Witcher 3, but I just couldn't. I'm one of the few people that thinks 2015 was a horrible year in terms of gaming. I remember watching the VGA's in December, underwhelmed as most games didn't interest me.

2016 however, now the games being released this year finally seem interesting. Games such as Persona 5 (sequel to the best game ever made, P4G), Uncharted 5, Quantum Break, Final Fantasy XV, and probably some more.

Someone recommended me Fire Emblem: Fates. I was hesitant, as Tactical/Strategy RPG's didn't seem appealing to me, but I bought it anyways. I do not regret that decision. After a year of disappointment, I'm finally playing something interesting. The story is great, and I can't wait to continue playing it tomorrow. What did I say? 2016 will be a much better year for gaming.

(As I said, I'm currently tired, so pardon me if I'm not understanding your message clearly.) As for DLC, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. You can't deny that some devs make DLC as a cash grab. Content that should have been in the main game in the beginning, but was instead made into DLC. If done right however, it's a great way to squeeze more hours into an amazing game you enjoyed.

So what's my final conclusion? Are gamers entitled? Maybe. That's for you to decide, depends on how you view things. (I think I saw a few replies stating society in general is entitled, maybe.) Are gamers setting their expectations for games too high? In my opinion, yes. This is why (as you stayed) hype isn't good. Just look at Destiny. That was hyped to shit, but it ended up being a disappointment to a lot of gamers. If you're going to hype something, make sure it meets people's expectations.

Feel free to give an opinion on what I said. Thank you, and good night.
 
@taleweaver thanks,I found the graph online and found it very funny. Even though the millennial ages vary according to source,I noticed that many times when arguments are picked on this site that go against general consensus,they seem to follow the pattern I listed above.
 
Very good blog post, I thought I was the only one who didn't feel like a "gamer", despite liking videogames; I just don't really associate myself with the typical cliche and things tied to gaming now (or ever?). I don't really think I could ever see myself wearing a Zelda T-shirt, collecting videogame miniature figures, or even really preordering a game/buying early access either.
 
"I don't think you have an idea of how much work that involves (unless you want to render a bland white room)."
@Taleweaver have you ever optimized a game for 60fps yourself?
Regardless, it doesn't take a chef to criticize food. Just like it doesn't take programming experience to judge the optimization of a game.

Of course it takes effort to program an engine well instead of half-assing it and capping the framerate, but that's no excuse for an AAA developer to not put in the extra effort needed for the engine to run properly at all framerates. Hell, the Source engine runs properly at 300+ fps. It's their JOB to make the game work properly. There is no reason for fps caps or poor optimization besides developer laziness, or tight release schedules. Which in that case they should delay the game and fix it instead of releasing a broken pile of crap.
Look at GTA 5. They took forever to release it, yes, but since they didn't rush it, the port turned out great, and it runs well on most PCs.
And no, it's not hard to run a game at 60fps in 2016 if you have a good enough PC, consoles however have underpowered hardware, so they can't run above 30fps above 720p.
PCs do not need FPS caps since they can run games well above 30fps.

And no, it isn't all about "graphics." Lower framerates increase input latency and makes the game look more jagged so it can actually affect gameplay.
And while 30fps may not be noticable to some people, that doesn't mean you shouldn't properly code your game engine.
Having the engine's speed depend on framerate is nothing more than a byproduct of bad coding.
 
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@margen67 it is not just laziness,it has to have a financial incentive to justify spending the money into making the game as optimized as possible. Too many people pirate games and it gets to a point where it just isn't worth it to spend more money on it if the same people that will buy it will buy it regardless.They make the games to make money not to make a few users happy.
 
@Supster131 : if your expectations are so high and they aren't met, shouldn't you wonder why that is? I don't want to bash AAA-titles or award ceremonies, but they barely mention anything aside games that have cost a few millions to make. And with that kind of budget, it barely strays from the path of what is expected of gamers to like (nowadays: open world and crafting). But when was the last time you've played a game that was completely different than a game you liked? (I assume it's fire emblem, but I'm not sure).

@Margen67 : as a matter of fact, yes. I've created a handful of maps for UT2004. Though I never really attempted to make the prettiest level, I learned a few of the tricks about optimization. They either fell in the category of reducing visual aids for lesser PC's, which requires basic guessing, as at the time you're building your level you have no idea how the level will play out, let alone how it will handle on PC's you have only theoretical knowledge about (I guess you can compare it to estimate which spices to add to a dish you've never cooked for an audience you don't know). The other category are simply restrictions: you can't build X, Y and Z in your map or it'll slow things down. Better redesign that different. These are even harder to predict in advance, and require extra work to remove some of your earlier work, fully aware that it'll make the level less beautiful.

Regardless, you weren't criticizing the proverbial food but blaming the chef. And I call bullshit on your other claim. No, you don't need to have optimized games or levels yourself, but a basic knowledge is absolutely needed, just like a restaurant criticus needs to have taste buds and a general knowledge of cooking (you can't compare waiting times between a 3-star restaurant and McDonalds, for example).
 
@Taleweaver Can you try rephrasing your (last) question, please?
I'll try answering it though. Before Fire Emblem, the last game I enjoyed was Arkham Knight (I also enjoyed P4: Dancing All Night, but that's a spin off to my favorite game).
Before Arkham Knight, I enjoyed Persona 4 Golden. Before that.. well, I enjoyed a more broader amount of games.

All those games, are from different genres, if that makes a difference.
Fire Emblem is a strategy/tactical RPG, Arkham Knight is an open world action game, Persona 4 Golden is a turn based JRPG.

As for your first question, it's probably thanks to Persona 4 Golden. That game was really good. I know, it's a habit no one should have. Having high expectations for anything will disappoint you.
Just look at the Batman vs Superman movie that just came out today, it's getting mixed reviews. One of my friend's even said it sucked, he also told me he was hyped for two years. I also went to go see the movie, I enjoyed it. I wasn't hyped for it, it was just a movie that looked interesting, and interesting it was. In the end, I probably couldn't answer your question.
 
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