Hacking Nintendont - wiimote & nunchuck support discussions

[Howard]

Alright, i just tested this release and i can perceive some real improvements. C-stick on nunchuk feels less uncomfortable, the only thing left to suggest is if you could only lower the dead zone as it is still uncomfortable to tilt down.

When you say lower the cStick tilt dead zone:
Is the only direction you are having problems with down?
You want to have it start going down with less tilt?
You want it to require less tilt for full range?
You want to have it start going down with less tilt and require less tilt for full range?

Now onto the fps config: wow, even as proof of concept i can see the potential. I was playing a fps and i was really liking it, when moving horizontally it feels amazing, almost like a true wii fps; the problem begins when moving vertically: as soon as i pointed the wii remote up or down the c-stick began to flicker and move into other directions. With some minor (i believe) adjustments this could turn to be very close to emulate a wii first person shooter.

When if flickers were you at the up down points that the wiimote would no longer be able to see the sensor bar?

As far as the IR is confirmed, it works quite well! I think the sensitivity should be a bit higher (meaning the deadzone of the IR should be smaller) so that more fine small movements of the wiimote translate to fine small movements of the aim.

Any dead zone is being added by the game.
Are you asking for the movement of the wiimote to translate to a bigger or smaller movement on screen?

For button mapping What is their is was just copy and paste to see if ir could work.
Adding an additional config is possable if that is what seems best.
What ever config we come up with needs a button swap like the other bluetooth controllers have. Some gun casing use A and B as the triggers others use Z and C. For now I sugest you guys discuss, justifying what you are recomending. As has already been pointed out some game use the analog triggers others dont. What could be done is leave the analog triggers tied to tilt for games that need them but also map them to a button for those that dont to provide easier useage.

 

[VinsCool]

oh forgot to tell: Naggers should be used by default, and cstick should be triggered only if we hold the C button, otherwise that might cause some issues in games.
I mean, if IR is used by naggers config. it must be triggered only if we hold C button.

 

[nakata6790]

Any dead zone is being added by the game.
Are you asking for the movement of the wiimote to translate to a bigger or smaller movement on screen?

Yep, just a liiiitle faster, not by much though.All it needs is a little fine tuning (a small speedup). As for the sensitivity, i mean the cursor starts to move even with small wiimote movements (right now you need to move the wiimote a fair bit to start registering movement), that would make it even more precise (for headshots for example).

Anyway, to tell you the truth, i just blasted through the 5 first missions in TS3 on Hard with IR, it already works great! With a little spit & shine (and naggers button mapping) IR will rule. You have done an incredible job.

For button mapping What is their is was just copy and paste to see if ir could work.
Adding an additional config is possable if that is what seems best.
What ever config we come up with needs a button swap like the other bluetooth controllers have. Some gun casing use A and B as the triggers others use Z and C. For now I sugest you guys discuss, justifying what you are recomending. As has already been pointed out some game use the analog triggers others dont. What could be done is leave the analog triggers tied to tilt for games that need them but also map them to a button for those that dont to provide easier useage.

I really appreciate what you are saying, but things would be overcomplicated after a while.
Gun casing is really rarely used but even for those cases, you can have a Wii Zapper config if you want

IMHO the current 4 (+ the FPS one) configs already serve almost all genres. That's according to an extensive playthrough of at least 70 GC games i did, as well as from other members' feedback in here. See below for what IMHO FPS config and naggers config need, to be perfected.

oh forgot to tell: Naggers should be used by default, and cstick should be triggered only if we hold the C button, otherwise that might cause some issues in games.
I mean, if IR is used by naggers config. it must be triggered only if we hold C button.

Exactly.

• Naggers config must have IR registered only if nunchuck c button is held. It then acts like a GC cstick. All buttons stay as they already are in the current naggers config. In essence, just replace NC tilt code with IR code on current naggers config.
• FPS config is EXACTLY like naggers in button mapping, but IR registers ALL the time (acts like a GC cstick), regardless of NC c button. In essence, just copy paste IR code onto current naggers config like you did to the default one.

And that's it. Simple as that. BOOM

 

[nakata6790]

Last night i slept at 4 in the morning.

I ran all GC fps games i have in my library, except 007 Nightfire that does not work with nintendont yet:
XIII, Star Wars Jedi Knight 2, Turok Evolution, Medal of Honor Frontline, Medal of Honor European Assault, Timesplitters 2, Timesplitters 3, Die Hard Vendetta, Judge Dredd; Dredd vs Death, Red Faction II, King Kong, Hitman 2:Silent Assasin, and Geist.


When the game allows you to up the look/turn sensitivity in game, IR is already PERFECT. Examples include: Dredd, XIII, Die Hard, Star Wars JK, Timesplitters 3, Red Faction II, Hitman 2.
In the rest, a slight speedup would help, as mentioned in my previous post. It is however perfectly beatable as is.

When the game allows complete in-game customization of button mapping (Timesplitters 2, Timesplitters 3, Red Faction II) you can bypass the current default config's uncomfy mapping for fps. I set shoot & aim at A & B buttons in game.
All other FPS games however ALWAYS use GC L & R buttons for aim/shoot no matter what, so naggers is best suited for those.

So if naggers is paired with IR, we already are 90%+ we are 100% there.

=EDIT=
I saw that Howard was kind enough to perfect the IR in a new NC beta 3, so i edited my post to reflect the updated feedback.

 

[Disorarara]

Timesplitters 3 with IR aiming? My god it's a dream come true

 

[AbdallahTerro]

I like naggers' config too, It can be used as 2 configs with tilt for most games and IR for FPS.
I also like naggers+tilt as default

 

[nakata6790]

Timesplitters 3 with IR aiming? My god it's a dream come true

Yep, yep. Only naggers button mapping to go and it will be perfect!

 

[Howard]

Nintendont Nunchuck Beta 3

Tried posting this last night but GBATEMP was down.
The problems I am looking for are going to be setup specific. So I do want to hear everyione's results from the 5 minute test. (Or in nakata6790 case the how many hour test? ) The IR still needs a lot of work. An actual configuration is at the bottom of the list. I want it to work right first.


Seeing how some of you are doing extensive testing of the IR even tho I told you it isnt ready.
Could you all do a quick 5 minute test on the IR in this version? It should eather work better or not work.
I want to know about ir not working, unsmooth ir movement, or ir flickering.

Based on 2.167

Fixed IR horizontal centering.
Changed the IR so when the wiimote can no longer see the sensor bar it will keep its last good position.
This should get rid of all the flickering some of you were reporting.

 

[nakata6790]

Hehe that's right, for correct testing i can log hours

Howard until we get to the actual configuration, would a stopgap beta 4 with naggers button mapping & IR (from beta 3) be in order please?

That way you will have better feedback too, from ALL fps games not just TS2,TS3 & RF2 that have ingame button mappings.

 

[naxil]

that version of nintendont become public in future?

 

[nakata6790]

For anyone else wanting to give feedback and seriously test:

-since only default config is currently paired with IR, here is how to setup Timesplitters 2 & Timeplitters 3 in game controls in oreder to get them to play as best as possible with the current default config's unideal button mapping:

• Timesplitters 2

• Timesplitters 3 ​

Of course, in naggers button mapping no such extensive in game modification would be needed, so all other fps that have no ingame mapping like TS2 & TS3 would also be playable


PS. After finishing the TS3 campaign on Hard again earlier today, maybe the Y axis of the IR should be a little faster. X axis is fine as it is and so is IR tracking (meaning that there is NO flickering). Also bluetooth works as it should (tested both NC & CC attached to wiimote).

 

[Howard]

Those who donated should have recieved

Nintendont Nunchuck Beta 4
Based on 2.167

Made IR sensitivity match the wii configuration.
Make sure yours is setup to see only 2 dots

Made sensor bar above / below match wii configuration.
This also gives you the y axis speed up you were asking for.

Added new configuration TWO = FPS using IR as cStick alt based on naggers
A=A B=L Z=R 1=R1/2 2=L1/2
C not pressed U=Z D=B R=X L=Y
C pressed Dpad=Standard
L R tilt tied to L R analog triggers.
IR controls the cStick

Is their a better use for the 1 and 2 buttons in this configuration?
The other fps config is probably going away in a future update. anyoue object?

 

[VinsCool]

Thanks for the new beta Naggers + IR was exactly what I was looking for
I don't have any FPS to test, but I will still give it a go for camera control on other games.

Edit: Yes, indeed, IR now works very well! no more flickering! Good job Howard!
Nunchuck tilt, IR pointing and all bluetooth controllers works perfectly

As nakata6790 have fps games to test, I think he is the one who could have a better feedback for IR pointer controlling.

To me, every thing looks perfect

 

[Farowe]

Alright, i just tested last beta release. I will be short: reduce horizontal dead zone on the IR and this is perfect. Vertical movement of the cursor is on par with the movements of the wii remote, feels almost like pointing; however, horizontal movements still feels clumsy as if it lacked sensitivity.

 

[OriginalHamster]

Would be nice add classic controller in the future

 

[VinsCool]

Would be nice add classic controller in the future

It is already supported, along with WiiU pro controller

 

[nakata6790]

Those who donated should have recieved

Nintendont Nunchuck Beta 4
Based on 2.167

Made IR sensitivity match the wii configuration.
Make sure yours is setup to see only 2 dots

Made sensor bar above / below match wii configuration.
This also gives you the y axis speed up you were asking for.

Thank you, thank you THANK YOU!!

Added new configuration TWO = FPS using IR as cStick alt based on naggers
A=A B=L Z=R 1=R1/2 2=L1/2
C not pressed U=Z D=B R=X L=Y
C pressed Dpad=Standard
IR controls the cStick

This is great

L R tilt tied to L R analog triggers.

This unfortunately causes issues in fps, like accidentally shooting allies or droping grenades at my character's feet.

I really get what you want to accomplish with this, but as i said in earlier post, no GC fps game makes meaningfull use of analog triggers.

You can however make the issue go away, if nunchuck tilt only registers when C is held.
That way we won't need 1 & 2 for L, R midpress in other GC games that use them (Super Mario Sunshine, Rogue Squadron, Rebel Strike, etc) and those buttons will be free for other nintendont functions.

Is their a better use for the 1 and 2 buttons in this configuration?

1 & 2 held together should amount to game reset

The other fps config is probably going away in a future update. anyone object?

No objections from me!

Alright, i just tested last beta release. I will be short: reduce horizontal dead zone on the IR and this is perfect. Vertical movement of the cursor is on par with the movements of the wii remote, feels almost like pointing; however, horizontal movements still feels clumsy as if it lacked sensitivity.

Hmm, what game did you try? You can turn up the sensitivity in the in game options. We should however give it a shot, ie make IR X axis as sensitive as IR Y axis as you propose.


So to summarize:
1) Make NC tilt register only if NC c button is held. That way no accidental L & R inputs will occur and 1,2 buttons of wiimote will be freed for other uses.
2) As a test, let's make IR X axis as fast as IR Y axis of beta 4 and see how it goes.
3) Possible assignment of 1 & 2 buttons to nintendont functions like game reset, etc.


P.S. I'll donate again today and I will also update the OP with info about the latest beta as well as a link for donation to Howard in order for members to participate in the beta.

 

[Howard]

Those of you that donated should have recieved

Nintendont Nunchuck Beta 5
Based on 2.167

Changed configuration TWO = FPS using IR as cStick alt based on naggers
to only tie L R tilt to L R analog triggers while C is pressed.

For x axis ir movement I believe I am getting oppisite requests from different people.If everyone could answer these questions.
Do you want the same wiimote horizontal movement to result in more or less movement in the game?
By what percent should it be changed?

Any x axis dead zone you are seeing is added by the game it self not anything in nintendont. While it might be possable to compensate for the dead zone the game is adding, any change for it will need to be added after we get horizontal movement the way we want it. Also keep in mind if their are any games that have a dead zone smaller than what we try and compensate for they will always be spinning.

 

[Ramzee]

Beta 4 Feedback (Wii, 4.3e)

Alright, i just tested last beta release. I will be short: reduce horizontal dead zone on the IR and this is perfect. Vertical movement of the cursor is on par with the movements of the wii remote, feels almost like pointing; however, horizontal movements still feels clumsy as if it lacked sensitivity.

Hmm, what game did you try? You can turn up the sensitivity in the in game options. We should however give it a shot, ie make IR X axis as sensitive as IR Y axis as you propose.

I found the IR Y axis in Time Splitters 3 too sensitive (dead zone too small) and mostly ended up looking at the sky or down at the ground when play testing. IMHO the sensitivity/dead zone setting will have to be a compromise for different players or have a fast IR twitch config and a second slower config with a bigger IR dead zone (I found the x axis good).

I'd guess my experience differs from @nakata6790 because I was using the wiimote freehand with bigger/less accurate movements and if I was to rest my wiimote hand on a surface I might do better with practice.

That said, I only occasionally play Zelda: Windwaker, Ikaruga, Mario Sunshine, Simpson's Hit and Run, etc. with a wired GC controller or the CC out of nostalgia, so TS3 may not be the best game for an initial test.

On a positive note: I found the beta 1 -> beta 4 improvements in the nunchuck tilt - c stick emulation very good, so would most likely use nagger's nunchuck config (but temp switch to the other configs for in game menus etc. as A=A, etc. is easy to remember) if the wiimote/nunchuck was the only control scheme I had.

I'd also like to publicly thank @Howard for taking on the task of expanding Nintendont's supported controllers to include the standard Wiimote/Nunchuck.

 

[nakata6790]

Those of you that donated should have recieved Nintendont Nunchuck Beta 5
Based on 2.167

Changed configuration TWO = FPS using IR as cStick alt based on naggers
to only tie L R tilt to L R analog triggers while C is pressed.

Excellent! Thank you once again, Howard

For x axis ir movement I believe I am getting oppisite requests from different people.If everyone could answer these questions.
Do you want the same wiimote horizontal movement to result in more or less movement in the game?
By what percent should it be changed?

Do what Farowe suggested, up the speed of X axis to match the speed of Y axis. Even if for me x axis is ok as is, personally i can adapt so i do not mind at all . After all, if we don't try it we don't know how well it can work. In the worst case, i just turn down the turning speed from in game options.

So to sum up, Howard: please make it so that the same wiimote horizontal movement results in more movement in the game. IDK what percentage of speedup is needed, but a +30% would be a good start.
Also make the horizontal deadzone a little smaller IF possible, otherwise leave it as is (meaning that in game X movement starts as soon as even a small X movement of wiimote is registered

Any x axis dead zone you are seeing is added by the game it self not anything in nintendont. While it might be possable to compensate for the dead zone the game is adding, any change for it will need to be added after we get horizontal movement the way we want it. Also keep in mind if their are any games that have a dead zone smaller than what we try and compensate for they will always be spinning.

That is correct. To remind people, that turning speed and deadzone are two different things.
Deadzone is explained in the pic below

and turning speed is how fast the camera turns when you point OUTSIDE of the deadzone.

Seeing as Gamecube fps were made with shitty dual analog controls in mind, deadzone is non existant and turning speed is upped to compensate. So we should do the same in this case.

Beta 4 Feedback (Wii, 4.3e)
I found the IR Y axis in Time Splitters 3 too sensitive (dead zone too small) and mostly ended up looking at the sky or down at the ground when play testing. IMHO the sensitivity/dead zone setting will have to be a compromise for different players or have a fast IR twitch config and a second slower config with a bigger IR dead zone (I found the x axis good).

I'd guess my experience differs from @nakata6790 because I was using the wiimote freehand with bigger/less accurate movements and if I was to rest my wiimote hand on a surface I might do better with practice.

Yes i always rest my right hand controlling the wiimote either on my right thigh or on the armchair's right sidepiece. That way is have steadier and pixel perfect aiming

Timesplitters 3 is kinda weird cause you can set the aim reticule/crosshair to fixed or moving. If you think the deadzone is small, lower the ingame turning speed and set the reticule/crosshair to fixed.