Feminists and Liberals Gets Owned by Fake Studies

[SG854]

I've been using this site for well over a decade and every time I see this kind of shit, I think about deleting my account.

Why is alt right propaganda given a pass here?
Seriously. Can any of the mods tell me how they rationalize this?

@Costello @shaunj66 @T-hug @Chary @BORTZ @Issac @tj_cool @Cyan @Depravo @FIX94 @Foxi4 @porkiewpyne @Sicklyboy

How on the Hell is this alt right. This is exaclty what they talked about in the video and exactly why they pulled off bogus studies. Any decenting opinion even if the people are left wing, and the 3 researchers that did the bogus studies are left wing liberals, are labeled as alt right. Even the most hard core socialists are labeled alt right. They also recognize a left leaning bias in academia.

They are pointing out a corrupt system in the academic world because they want to bring real research back. You can’t help people if you do bad research.

 

[Deleted-401606]

Man,I haven't been on GBAtemp in a while. What happened to GBAtemp's liberal bias? A few years ago this would have been flamed to death and locked.

 

[SG854]

Man,I haven't been on GBAtemp in a while. What happened to GBAtemp's liberal bias? A few years ago this would have been flamed to death and locked.

People got tired of social justice creeping into everyday life. People got tired of being called alt right when they support all groups of people.

It is a fun thread for laughs. And I wanted to see how many people will come to try to defend what obviously shouldn’t be defended. Academic integrity should always be above bias. I like seeing people go at it in the comments. It’s entertaining.

Just look at the dislike ratio on this recent commercial and you’ll see people are tired of this stuff that starts in colleges creeping into every day life.

 

[Lucifer666]

Failure at such a fundamental level to do peer reviewed scientific journal very much troubles me, and the subsequent retaliation, and poses a problem for the state of science as a whole (I don't want to see what would happen when the similar set to anti vaccine cretins arises for this sort of thing).

I actually agree with you, but it's important to note that there's shit science for every cluster of the political spectrum. My friend, who is trans, was sent an article by his transphobic mum about "rapid onset gender dysphoria" (i.e. a study that basically says being trans is contagious/if you are exposed to other trans people you "become convinced that you're trans too") from Stanford, which was subsequently removed from the Stanford website, NOT because of its offensive nature, but because the trials carried out have been criticised by a plethora of other psychologists for being genuinely shitty, inconclusive experiments combined with confirmation bias on the researcher's part. Bad science is not an issue of the left, it's an issue of humanity as a whole and how people will see 'evidence' of their baseless opinions in anything. As you mention, take a look at anti-vaxxers and their autism defence as another example.

Similarly we are seeing hiring and firing advice become some very odd things, and the fear of offending people cause all sorts of trouble for all sorts of people (see various fun and games comedians, artists of many different stripes, executives in companies, advert campaigns causing backlashes among general consumers....).

I think that in an ideal world, offending people is worse than a comedian being shamed for making a joke that offends people. "Wah I can't make racist jokes anymore" – cry me a river man! You know?

Anyway, the bottomline of what I was trying to say is that the title of this thread is just incredibly clickbait-y and inflammatory, almost as though OP was trying to start shit. I dislike threads like these because they bring out the worst in people. Life is a wild ride when you're a member of multiple minorities for whom respect and protection is somehow controversial and up for discussion. It must be draining. I would rather take a step back and try to understand how/why things hurt people, avoid doing those things, and move on, rather than whine about "mah freedums", if you feel me.

 

[FAST6191]

I can't say I feel you there. Nobody has the right to not be offended, mainly as it is so arbitrary and unknowable beforehand. Similarly it tends not to be out and out racist jokes that are bothered but superficially racist ones (to say nothing of the bollocks that it the prejudice+power model some espouse, or the "no biological differences" set when it comes to sex) with the crux of the joke being how ridiculous the idea of being racist is. If you want to try to live that way then so be it, personally I will continue to meet people as individuals and assess their ideas and character rather than try to group people and try generalisations.

As for the other part I am not sure how the paper mentioned would be offensive in nature. If it was done with poor experimental procedure and sub par analysis then by all means strike it down.
As far as your mate goes then hopefully they get where they need to be, however that would seem to be more an example of why we tend to only let people with the relevant training to try do things in this sort of scenario.

I would agree bad science is a problem for everybody, in this case though it is a field promoted, researched and utterly dominated by the American left, one that still has to prove its legitimacy and is generally failing at such, is generally seen to be troubling all sorts of other fields, one that has been repeatedly observed to depart from academic ideals, and has people doing all sorts of odd things based upon it. Had the OP been similar in tone and about maths or physics it would be a different matter.

These sorts of threads around here tend to do OK. Occasionally you have to knock people back on topic and it pays to have a relentless focus on logic but such is forums in general.

I stopped wondering why they allow alt right propaganda fake news in here. It is sad we have to read this political nonsense on a gaming site. This aint 4chan and no one really gives a fuck about their "opinion"....
Why are these inbred white supremacists so scared about women, muslims, blacks and the left or even - god forbid - educated university students? Seems like they arent so superior after all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The researchers as mentioned genuinely got this stuff published, something that speaks to a systemic failure in the field covered. They are genuinely in the middle of a backlash from their overseers because of it, one that people struggle to assign merit to.

As for politics then discussions of it have been here as long as I have, and far as I can tell we here before that as well, and they often garner hundreds of replies in a given discussion. We even have a nice section for it these days. There are apolitical sites and gaming sites, this never has been one though.

I could speculate as to the reasoning used by said inbred white supremacists but I am not sure what relevance it has here; they don't appear to be the ones doing the research, posting it here, pushing the narrative or otherwise of any great relevance to the goings on under discussion, and are generally of such small number and lacking any real clout in any field.

 

[spAik]

You know those arent staff members posting these threads right?

but its the staff members like you, who are participating and defending these threads. Protecting the opinions you like and removing replys of opinions you dont like.
Good job, bro

Because we're not going to censor based on political alignment or personal opinion, that's fascism. You also happen to be in a sub forum that is used for discussions that are often politically charged. You're also derailing so that's all I'm going to say about it.

Well, looking at these threads I see some censor. Well, removing an argument you pretend of being "offtopic" is a way of censoring and doesnt really contribute to a discussion. Get your facts straight and dont use big words like facism, when you cant even stick to your own standards...

Vipera, is that you?

I dont know her (?) - i bet she was someone with an own opinion.

 

[Kioku]

but its the staff members like you, who are participating and defending these threads. Protecting the opinions you like and removing replys of opinions you dont like.
Good job, bro

Vipera, is that you?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Not really in the US

My company introduced it this year and I'm gonna take it. So excited. It sucks how rare it is here.

 

[WeedZ]

but its the staff members like you, who are participating and defending these threads. Protecting the opinions you like and removing replys of opinions you dont like.
Good job, bro


Well, looking at these threads I see some censor. Well, removing an argument you pretend of being "offtopic" is a way of censoring and doesnt really contribute to a discussion. Get your facts straight and dont use big words like facism, when you cant even stick to your own standards...


I dont know her (?) - i bet she was someone with an own opinion.

At least I can spell fascism. You are the one that wants topics and posts you dont agree with removed. If you made your own thread and kept it on topic and respectful instead of derailing this one, I promise I wouldn't delete your posts. That goes for anyone in this thread that feel they need to discuss things not related to this topic. Im going to start issuing warns for continued derailment.

 

[comput3rus3r]

If feminists really cared about women how come they're not rallying up against pornography which is the number one female degrading aspect of our society? At best teaching the young male generation to objectify women and at worst teaching sexual violence. I haven't seen a single feminist even mention it. Has anybody? Have you looked into what happens to the majority of women who get involved in the porn industry? It's really nothing short of being a sex slave. Again you don't hear a peep from feminists.

 

[FAST6191]

If feminists really cared about women how come they're not rallying up against pornography which is the number one female degrading aspect of our society? At best teaching the young male generation to objectify women and at worst teaching sexual violence. I haven't seen a single feminist even mention it. Has anybody? Have you looked into what happens to the majority of women who get involved in the porn industry? It's really nothing short of being a sex slave. Again you don't hear a peep from feminists.

I would fundamentally disagree with your assessment, both on the basis that people should be free to do what they want when it is not hurting others, and that it is a degrading concept. If there is a fault with the industry then that is a fault with the industry and not a thing inherent to the concept. That said there are plenty of anti pornography campaigners among various things falling under the umbrella of feminist or social activist.

 

[comput3rus3r]

I would fundamentally disagree with your assessment, both on the basis that people should be free to do what they want when it is not hurting others, and that it is a degrading concept. If there is a fault with the industry then that is a fault with the industry and not a thing inherent to the concept. That said there are plenty of anti pornography campaigners among various things falling under the umbrella of feminist or social activist.

You think it's not degrading to women? lol, maybe you just want to justify your porn addiction. Not only is it degrading to women, research has proven time and time again that it is detrimental to the man's mental well being. porn addicts are less likely to get married and have a family probably due to the fact that women aren't attracted to guys who sit at their computers with their pants down.

 

[Xzi]

Just look at the dislike ratio on this recent commercial and you’ll see people are tired of this stuff that starts in colleges creeping into every day life.

I already brought this example up earlier in the thread. It's an example of the right-wing's PC culture. Nothing is going to change or improve if everyone keeps getting offended over innocuous stuff, like that commercial. "Don't beat or sexually harass women/children or put up with people that do" didn't used to be a controversial stance.

 

[FAST6191]

any one else noticing missing posts? might there be someone censoring posts?

I can see all the removed posts. comput3rus3r started blathering on about abortion despite being told to stay on topic so it went and lives https://gbatemp.net/threads/how-do-you-feel-about-abortion.501574/ (the 500 odd reply thread we had a few months back that they were also involved in) now.

Everything else was not adding anything to conversation, name calling, decrying that there is a thread with a slightly political nature in a forum that has had threads of a political nature* for the better part of two decades now (search engine has troubles going too far back so here is a 2007 thread https://gbatemp.net/threads/jack-thompson-is-a-douche.49277/ , 2006 https://gbatemp.net/threads/is-jap-still-considered-a-racial-slur.36349/ ) and stuff like that.

*... thread incoming as that might be an interesting discussion.

 

[mattytrog]

That's socialism? Then so is all our public services that people use with no problems.

Absolutely correct. Thats why our economy is called a "mixed economy". An attempt to combine the best of socialism and capitalism. It works for the most part.

 

[piratesephiroth]

Absolutely correct. Thats why our economy is called a "mixed economy". An attempt to combine the best of socialism and capitalism. It works for the most part.

Yeah, capitalism is good for the people and socialism is good for corrupt politicians.
It just works.

 

[notimp]

Quick comment on the Gillette commercial. (If thats the one that was in the news recently. Havent seen it then, and now.. )

Thats just the advertisers playing everyone..

Dont take the bait.

Here is how 'it worked' conceptually.

"Super PC - why can't we have more caring characteristics in men" is a "trend".

Gillette marketing department sees it, captures it in a spot. They know that this will provoke. They know that PC culture and left wing (you neednt make this political though) progressive positions are on their side.

'Culture war' breaks out. Media outlets write about the horrible right wing yesterdayers who conjured up boycott campaigns.


In the end it even gets talked about in here == FREE PUBLICITY.

Now here is the calculation on the part of the ad department:
1. Its a trend
2. Its controversial
3. People who get triggered by this are a minority
4. PC and public morals will be on their side.
5. Most people orient themselves around what everyone else says
They've got all the big groups of people covered. They can promote a controversial issue. They get news coverage. They don't get burned in any way.

Its the perfect PR/marketing ploy.
//

Lets look at the "issue" here. Are 'romantic' interpersonal relationships something where 'power differences' (which can change situationally, playfully...) exist? Yes. Will this change? No.

Lets say - this becomes a "new default" for all young people growing up. This might hold for the first few relationships they are in, then they'll probably realize, that this - is still a thing - sometimes. ( https://thoughtcatalog.com/anonymou...ask-if-they-can-kiss-me-and-i-blame-feminism/ , there were more prominent recent (after metoo) articles on this 'concept' as well, but this is the first one I found on google.)

Now, dont be idiots, dont be jerks, dont go out and rape people (*duh*), and you'll be fine.

You cant be "de-emasculated" by a "be more considerate" movement.

Also understand who these ads target. Young, impressionable males, who are deciding on what razors to buy for the rest of their lives. No one is taking anything away from you. People are playing to current societal trends. (Poor generation being young and still naive right now.. )

The field is large, human psyche is complex and not rational. No one is asking you to give up your 'male ideals'. If during courtship 'being more considerate' becomes a trend. It wouldnt be the worst. (In other relationships it wont matter as much.) But thats on the level of in 16th century europe: Everyone wore powdered white wigs.

Doesnt change human psyche.

Dont be stupid and get up in arms about this one.

Or simpler. Just never do what ads insist you do. In general. Your IQ (EQ rather) rises by about 20 points automatically.

 

[piratesephiroth]

Quick comment on the Gillette commercial. (If thats the one that was in the news recently. Havent seen it then, and now.. )

Thats just the advertisers playing everyone..

Dont take the bait.

Here is how 'it worked' conceptually.

"Super PC - why can't we have more caring characteristics in men" is a "trend".

Gillette marketing department sees it, captures it in a spot. They know that this will provoke. They know that PC culture and left wing (you neednt make this political though) progressive positions are on their side.

'Culture war' breaks out. Media outlets write about the horrible right wing yesterdayers who conjured up boycott campaigns.


In the end it even gets talked about in here == FREE PUBLICITY.

Now here is the calculation on the part of the ad department:
1. Its a trend
2. Its controversial
3. People who get triggered by this are a minority
4. PC and public morals will be on their side.
5. Most people orient themselves around what everyone else says
They've got all the big groups of people covered. They can promote a controversial issue. They get news coverage. They don't get burned in any way.

Its the perfect PR/marketing ploy.
//

Lets look at the "issue" here. Are 'romantic' interpersonal relationships something where 'power differences' (which can change situationally, playfully...) exist? Yes. Will this change? No.

Lets say - this becomes a "new default" for all young people growing up. This might hold for the first few relationships they are in, then they'll probably realize, that this - is still a thing - sometimes. ( https://thoughtcatalog.com/anonymou...ask-if-they-can-kiss-me-and-i-blame-feminism/ , there were more prominent recent (after metoo) articles on this 'concept' as well, but this is the first one I found on google.)

Now, dont be idiots, dont be jerks, dont go out and rape people (*duh*), and you'll be fine.

You cant be "de-emasculated" by a "be more considerate" movement.

Also understand who these ads target. Young, impressionable males, who are deciding on what razors to buy for the rest of their lives. No one is taking anything away from you. People are playing to current societal trends. (Poor generation being young and still naive right now.. )

The field is large, human psyche is complex and not rational. No one is asking you to give up your 'male ideals'. If during courtship 'being more considerate' becomes a trend. It wouldnt be the worst. (In other relationships it wont matter as much.) But thats on the level of in 16th century europe: Everyone wore powdered white wigs.

Doesnt change human psyche.

Dont be stupid and get up in arms about this one.

Or simpler. Just never do what ads insist you do. In general. Your IQ (EQ rather) raises by about 20 points automatically.

It worked fine for Nike but those were only shoes. Their customers are stupid people who will still buy anyway just because of the brand name.

I'm not so sure about Gillette though. The target audience of that commercial is very different from the vast majority of the company's actual customers.
It's not so difficult to use that as an excuse to try a different brand that most certainly has a better price.

 

[notimp]

Gillette is a multi generations brand by now. They need to 'capture' new trends.

Stupidity works in both ways. ("But I bought mine, because it was the fighter pilots brand.." (Commercials, where suddenly fighter jets flew through the image, while the guy was shaving.))

They are targeting a new generation of young customers right now.

 

[mattytrog]

Gillette is a multi generations brand by now. They need to 'capture' new trends.

Stupidity works in both ways. ("But I bought mine, because it was the fighter pilots brand.." (Commercials, where suddenly fighter jets flew through the image, while the guy was shaving.))

They are targeting a new generation of young customers right now.

You aren`t going to stop men being men. No silly advert is going to change human social ideas overnight.

A few easily triggered people will probably take offence at it. However these are in the minority.

Heres a newsflash... You can still be masculine without being a complete arsehole. This advert exaggerates this arseholery deliberately.

Personally, in a commercial, I would like to know why I should buy a Gillette razor rather than a competitors` razor.

Does it give a closer cut? Does it stay sharper for longer? etc etc

Too many commercials nowadays are just about causing controversy to get people talking about the brand. Doesn`t matter anymore if its any bloody good or not.

 

[notimp]

And it isnt even their intent. They want to sell. They want some controversy and maybe brand recognition. And if in three years the boyband craze has died down (and we all have learned a thing.. ) they'll make new ads.

Here is how brand recognition works.

In stuff thats "impulse purchase" (i.e. where you dont sit down and weigh the pros and cons of what to purchase) - you'll buy what you know. So recognition trumps everything - even emotion (if the brand is not entirely charged with that theme).

It basically goes like this: You are convinced, that you are making good/better than average decisions. You dont care to do research. You stand in front of a store shelf. What do you pick? The brand you know.

How do you "know" it - by having it seen 3-10 times in any context. As long as you didn't make an active effort to decide if thats really something you want - you go by "I've heard of it" > "so people are talking about it" ('thats what advertising buys' at least the notion, if not the act) > "so it must be good". The rest then is a selfenhancing effect of "I'm not stupid, so if I bought it, it must be good > look that guy agrees". And now you have understood the 4/5 stars principle on amazon.

(In other cultures they give harsher ratings.. )

Thats also why "spread/mass" works. (Why superbowl ads still are valuable.)

On stuff people do research on ("What is best") - so non impulse purchases, you highjack decision making differently, by for example agenda setting (telling people which aspects of your product they should look at, or whats important ("But is your phone new enough?, OLED has the inkiest blacks - or much more fun by telling them "what is best" (People dont want to do research, but the feel that they've done research. Its stupid. )").