US Government to shut down in less than an hour, would be first single-party shutdown ever

[invaderyoyo]

Becoming a Citizen has been SUPER Streamlined since the 80s when my parents did it and it has also become QUITE a bit cheaper, but somehow that's "too hard" for illegals to do these days.

What are you talking about, dude? It absolutely has not been "SUPER streamlined". In fact, it's almost impossible for poor people without immediate family in the US.

It's summarized in this pic.

Spoiler

 

[the_randomizer]

It may be indeed. I'm not saying one way or another. But that means a lot of what is being done to the undocumented immigrants simply illegal.

Something being law and moral don't always go hand in hand, either.

 

[Tigran]

Something being law and moral don't always go hand in hand, either.

I can agree with that. Unfortunately moral is a very subjective term.

 

[the_randomizer]

I can agree with that. Unfortunately moral is a very subjective term.

I know, I just hate the direction our government's been going the past several years.

 

[Tigran]

I know, I just hate the direction our government's been going the past several years.

That's another thing we can agree on. We may however disagree with which way it's going. LOL

 

[the_randomizer]

That's another thing we can agree on. We may however disagree with which way it's going. LOL

I just want to curl up in a ball, closing my eyes and plugging my ears and wished for it to just be done.

 

[Tigran]

I just want to curl up in a ball, closing my eyes and plugging my ears and wished for it to just be done.

While I agree to some extent.. Doing that has gotten us where we are.

 

[the_randomizer]

While I agree to some extent.. Doing that has gotten us where we are.

What do you mean? I just admitted to having a negative attitude about the government.

 

[Tigran]

What do you mean? I just admitted to having a negative attitude about the government.

I mean that most people just closed their eyes and hid, thus we've gotten to this point in many ways. I understand your feelings, but the only way to fix the goverment is to fight against it.

It may be "Voting for the less evil." But everytime we vote for the "Lesser evil.. eventually our options are not evil." Though the shutdown is going to be problematic.

Please, I understand you're dislike of the goverment, I dislike a whole lot of what they do, but every once in a while they do do good things.

 

[Navonod]

Interestingly.. The 14th amendment actually points out this can't happen: A primary motivation for this clause was to validate the equality provisions contained in the Civil Rights Act of 1866, which guaranteed that all people would have rights equal to those of all citizens.

This was for slaves who were already here in America. When they got their freedom, they would also get full legal citizenship and rights. Alot of people misinterpret this. It wasn't intended for illegals to come over and have anchor babies. Those people should technically be illegal until they go through the right steps to become a citizen.

 

[Tigran]

This was for slaves who were already here in America. When they got their freedom, they would also get full legal citizenship and rights. Alot of people misinterpret this. It wasn't intended for illegals to come over and have anchor babies. Those people should technically be illegal until they go through the right steps to become a citizen.

That may indeed be true, but the entire legal system in the US is based on technicalities.

 

[TotalInsanity4]

This was for slaves who were already here in America. When they got their freedom, they would also get full legal citizenship and rights. Alot of people misinterpret this. It wasn't intended for illegals to come over and have anchor babies. Those people should technically be illegal until they go through the right steps to become a citizen.

Doesn't matter what the intentions were, it still applies as it's in our Constitution. Until a constitutional convention happens and the 14th amendment is revised (which it likely won't be), that's the law that our elected officials swear to uphold

 

[Xzi]

This was for slaves who were already here in America. When they got their freedom, they would also get full legal citizenship and rights. Alot of people misinterpret this. It wasn't intended for illegals to come over and have anchor babies. Those people should technically be illegal until they go through the right steps to become a citizen.

The parents remain illegal even if they've had children in the US, but the children are citizens. Again, the bigger issue is that there are no "right steps" to become a citizen. There is no way for an illegal to become a citizen even if they've been here 40-50 years, and that's problematic. The system is broken more than the people in the system are.

 

[Navonod]

The parents remain illegal even if they've had children in the US, but the children are citizens. Again, the bigger issue is that there are no "right steps" to become a citizen. There is no way for an illegal to become a citizen even if they've been here 40-50 years, and that's problematic. The system is broken more than the people in the system are.

I know all that. I was just pointing out what the intentions were for the civil rights act. I'm not stupid. Lol

Edit: There are right steps and it's through the government. A guy I worked for had to go through tons of paperwork and waited 7 years to become a US citizen. The process is to damn long. I do think they should shorten it maybe one year or a few months because that's ridiculous. But he did it the right way.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Doesn't matter what the intentions were, it still applies as it's in our Constitution. Until a constitutional convention happens and the 14th amendment is revised (which it likely won't be), that's the law that our elected officials swear to uphold

Something needs to happen. It needs to be universally understood with out any loopholes.

 

[Tigran]

I know all that. I was just pointing out what the intentions were for the civil rights act. I'm not stupid. Lol

Edit: There are right steps and it's through the government. A guy I worked for had to go through tons of paperwork and waited 7 years to become a US citizen. The process is to damn long. I do think they should shorten it maybe one year or a few months because that's ridiculous. But he did it the right way.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


Something needs to happen. It needs to be universally understood with out any loopholes.

I know it would make "Second class citizens" which I don't really agree with. But honestly our immigration policy should be.. they come through a gate. A background check is done. If they are clean, (for the most part.. Minor misdemeanors would be case by case) they get allowed. They go work on farms *which have to provide food and shelter* and maybe get the wage they would get anyways. After two/three years without a serious criminal record, they become full citizens no question asked.

 

[Vahnyyz]

AFAIK there's no path to citizenship now, I'm not sure about the 80s. If there was a way for DREAMERS to become citizens, they would've done so a long time ago. They've been stuck in legislative limbo instead, and unless something is included in the budget for them, they're being deported beginning in March despite the fact that they're law-abiding citizens who contribute to the economy like anyone else.

Your whole argument reeks of "got mine Jack, don't care about anyone else now." Yes, immigrants who commit crimes should be deported, but equally immigrants who contribute to society should be rewarded. You don't build loyalty with only a stick and no carrot.

well that's quite interesting actually, because just last year I helped my mother in law become a US citizen for less than 2k (quite a bit less) and it was very similar in process to how my parents did it. And I should mention my mother in law doesn't speak almost ANY english, she works at Marriot hotels as a maid and she became a US citizen VERY HAPPILY I might add after living in the US for 20+ years. She was very much like you in that she thought "no, I can't become a US citizen I can only be a legal resident". Just because "as far as you know" there isn't a way doesn't mean there isn't one. I'll have you know she did it in California 2017. Very much the place that tries to harbor and what not these illegals all the time. She's from El Salvador, almost NO school education because she had to drop out and take care of her family she came to the states with my father-in-law and he got his citizenship back in the 80s. Sure, maybe having a family member that's american makes things easier. I won't lie I never considered it because A) It's a question that's asked and the people I know have said no when they're not a part of my family B) if we considered the USA a home instead of a country and in this critical thinking exercise we're going to say its YOUR home. Do you want someone who is going to expect you to pay THEIR rent, THEIR food, THEIR clothing, THEIR electricity usage and are you supposed to be happy about for the rest of your life when you have mouths to feed not just your own. Or is it possible that you'd want that person to contribute when you say "yes, of course you're in need, let me help you. we can WORK TOGETHER and be family/friends/whatever BS title and make this work".

I totally get that you guys want to say "oh we're being mean (boohoo) that makes me sad" but at the end of the day, we're not talking about Bill Gate type immigrants that are being kicked out, we're talking about that one friend that's always borrowing money and says "yeah i'll pay you back" and then when they get paid they go and buy themselves a PS4 or an Xbox, but the moment you come up to them and say "hey buddy can I please have my 5 dollars back" they pretty much shun you and say "you said you were my friend, you said you were a good person" and make themselves the martyr and you the executioner by extension.

 

[HamBone41801]

Don't get too worried. Unless someone in your family works for the federal government or so you probably won't feel the effects of it. Not unless it drags on a long time.

so when it shuts down, no one in the government or military is paid?

 

[Navonod]

I know it would make "Second class citizens" which I don't really agree with. But honestly our immigration policy should be.. they come through a gate. A background check is done. If they are clean, (for the most part.. Minor misdemeanors would be case by case) they get allowed. They go work on farms *which have to provide food and shelter* and maybe get the wage they would get anyways. After two/three years without a serious criminal record, they become full citizens no question asked.

I can't agree with that process personally. But yes I do agree it should be a bit easier.

 

[HamBone41801]

I know it would make "Second class citizens" which I don't really agree with. But honestly our immigration policy should be.. they come through a gate. A background check is done. If they are clean, (for the most part.. Minor misdemeanors would be case by case) they get allowed. They go work on farms *which have to provide food and shelter* and maybe get the wage they would get anyways. After two/three years without a serious criminal record, they become full citizens no question asked.

that is a terrible idea.

 

[TotalInsanity4]

that is a terrible idea.

Why though? There are countries with less stringent citizenship laws

 

[dimmidice]

so when it shuts down, no one in the government or military is paid?

It varies from place to place, employee to employee. Last time this happened everyone got paid eventually i think. But that doesn't mean it'll happen this time.