What exactly are women marching for?

CallmeBerto said:

@Xzi - Think he means family court system and the whole gender diversity.

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Fair enough. Still, the results of family court are usually dependent on the individual parents in question. If the mom is certifiably crazy, the kid(s) are going to go to the dad. Vice versa if the dad is crazy. If both parties are reasonable, joint custody can usually be worked out, and that's a fair compromise.

CallmeBerto said:

Wage gap is straight 100% bullshit. I mean this has debunked 100 times by now. If you still think this is real I can't help you.

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The wage gap is real when you average it out, but really it's specific employers bringing that average down for women, not all of them in general. Still, if you have one large corporation who pays women less than men, that's enough to make a big difference.

If the wage gap is really "gone" for all intents and purposes, you shouldn't have any problem with solidifying equal wages into law.

Too bad they aren't just marching to lose weight.

I hate how people keep saying that white males are privileged. I can promise you that women and minorities get better treatment in the US than I do.

im not sure really, it seems like everyone has a different explanation.

DeadlyFoez said:

Too bad they aren't just marching to lose weight.

I hate how people keep saying that white males are privileged. I can promise you that women and minorities get better treatment in the US than I do.

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Generalize and insult based on physical appearance, then complain that the people you're generalizing and insulting get better treatment in the US than you.

Seems like in your case it might just be karma and not the way "the US" treats you.

CallmeBerto said:

I honestly want someone to explain to me what rights men have that women don't.

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You get to work more before your retirement even though your average lifespan is shorter than women's. Isn't that beautiful?

Xzi said:

Dear god, this is what happens in an echo chamber. Yeah, all the men who established government and our nation's laws totally wrote them to fuck themselves over. Makes sense.

That's why Donald Trump can be born into wealth, sit on his fat ass all his life doing nothing, and then be elected president. Because he was being kept down by the woman Illuminati. /s

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Sigh, I wouldn't argue with me and try to act all sarcastic when it comes to gender issues. I will tear you apart.

When it comes to protecting females males are willing to sacrifice themselves for females. Even creating laws that screws themselves over.
Like women and children out of a sinking ship before male.

If men made rules to benefit men at the expense of women we wouldn't have

• The male only draft. If men created laws to discriminate females then they would've create an all female only draft. And just sit back and watch women fight wars for them and die while they benefit. Males would have the option to join the army and not the obligation to.

• Males would make rules to make any women to be sexual with them whenever they would like. Instead of making laws that punish sex offenders.

• Make it and set up society so that males would have a longer life expectancy than women. It was a one year difference in 1920's, nowadays its a 5 year difference.

• Make it so that males won't the sex majority sex to commit suicide. More males in just about every part of the world except for 1 middle eastern country commits suicide at higher rates than women. If males were truly benefitting from disadvantaging women then why are they committing suicide at higher rates than women?

• Set it so women would more often ask on dates then males. And if a women went too far too quickly then we can yell date rape, but she can't. Then women would then have to wait till she was proved innocent, rather than innocent until proven guilty.

• We would have males studies classes rather than women's studies classes.

• Women would be the primary bread winner and earn higher pay. Earning more money takes a toll on your health, and its one of the reasons males die younger. And hard work stress weakens the immune system.

• Males would have 3 options when children are born. Be stay at home dad, full time worker, or a mixture of both. Instead of women having these options. For males right now is work, work and work. Or be considered a looser. Doesn't sound like options to me. And if women were to make more money we would blame them for discriminating us, but at the same time reject the women if they didn't make enough money.

This is what the world would look like if males created laws and rules and societal expectation that discriminates women at the benefit of men.

Lets take for example there were males that suspected their wives were cheating on them, they found that 30% of females were cheating on them because their kid wasn't theirs through DNA testing. It is legal in many states to force the man to pay for child support even if the kid is not his, even with DNA testing proving its not his. The male can't do the same to the women and force her to pay child support if he was caught cheating on her. 30% isn't a low number. If this doesn't sound like discrimination against males in our legal system then I don't know what is.

Xzi said:

Fair enough. Still, the results of family court are usually dependent on the individual parents in question. If the mom is certifiably crazy, the kid(s) are going to go to the dad. Vice versa if the dad is crazy. If both parties are reasonable, joint custody can usually be worked out, and that's a fair compromise.


The wage gap is real when you average it out, but really it's specific employers bringing that average down for women, not all of them in general. Still, if you have one large corporation who pays women less than men, that's enough to make a big difference.

If the wage gap is really "gone" for all intents and purposes, you shouldn't have any problem with solidifying equal wages into law.

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Women and men arent working the same jobs or showing the same career ambition, this is to be expected when culturally most women didn't even have jobs until a few decades ago. Iceland just put a law in place for genders to have equal pay, but they have to check it themselves and certify the business (tax grab).

330 said:

You get to work more before your retirement even though your average lifespan is shorter than women's. Isn't that beautiful?

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I love the fact that men pay almost all the taxes yet women get most of the benefits.

CallmeBerto said:

I love the fact that men pay almost all the taxes yet women get most of the benefits.

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Yes when it comes to taxes males pay more taxes but take less out of governmental programs, Women pay less but take more out. So we have a transfer of wealth to women through our tax system. This should be included in the wage gap debate.

SG854 said:

Snip

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Your post assumes males are idiots and don't realize the kind of backlash there would be to your proposed laws in 2018. That doesn't mean women weren't barred from voting or working for the longest time, they were. It also doesn't mean that the laws written when first establishing this country weren't created to benefit white men specifically, they were. Yes, we've made a lot of progress, but there are still far too many systematic biases when it comes to women and other races. This stuff doesn't fix itself if we just plug our ears and go "LALALA DOESN'T EXIST," it has to be revised first.

SG854 said:

Yes when it comes to taxes males pay more taxes but take less out of governmental programs, Women pay less but take more out. So we have a transfer of wealth to women through our tax system. This should be included in the wage gap debate.

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That's ridiculous. People don't go on welfare to boost their wages, they do it because they're struggling. Companies need to pay fair wages so that the taxpayers foot less of the bill. And gee, I can't imagine what financial burden there is that women might have to deal with more often than men, can you?

Nerdtendo said:

Wow, a controversy board. If it's here, I might as well use it.

So.... What exactly were women marching for? I did a quick Google search and all the Wikipedia page said was "women's rights". That was vague so I Googled women's rights which told me, "Issues commonly associated with notions of women's rights include, though are not limited to, the right: to bodily integrity and autonomy; to be free from sexual violence; to vote; to hold public office; to enter into legal contracts; to have equal rights in family law; to work; to fair wages or equal pay; to have reproductive rights; to own property; to education." I'll go through these 1 by 1 because I'm confused.

Autonomy - so they want to make a self-governing country? Why?

Be free from sexual violence - this is a very real problem and a horrible one at that, but marching for it is like protesting against robbery. This world is evil and so are the people in it. You can't stop crime. There are certain measures you can take to reduce crime but you can't tell criminals to stop.

Equal rights in family law - please enlighten me. Don't we already have this?

To work - we've had that one for a while now. Good job

Equal pay - i have no critisism on this one. Equal pay should be real.

Reproductive rights - is that supposed to be like abortion and whatnot? If so, they already have the right to abort.

To own property - Already have it. Good job

Education - Already have it. Good job.

So it seems to me that only one of these reasons has much weight to it. That reason is equal pay. If that's really it, then why aren't they just marching for equal pay?

Now I'm really not trying to start a fight. I genuinely want someone to show me the other side of the coin. Thank you and have a nice day.

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I'll try to get @starly to genuinely respond to this in a bit. If things go well there won't be bloodshed

Well if your dressing like your a stripper and your name is Dirty Diana then you have your rights

Joe88 said:

its basically just a big "I hate white men and trump" rally

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100% True. I hate T-rump more than most but, In America, one of the worst things to be these days socially is a white guy. You have no sympathy. Everything is your fault and people can pretty much shit on you for being white and or a man at any time with no social recourse. I get called a stupid white boy frequently and no one gasps. They just look and wait for me to say something equally retarded. And if I do call them a stupid (insert any race and sex but white guy here) I will get nailed to a cross. When I bring it up and call people on it they tell me something like " Well, I guess it's finally you turn" or they call it reverse racism. Reverse? Racism is still racism no matter what color you are trashing. Stupid bastards. I never owned a slave, told someone to go to the back of the bus, made someone use a certain toilet/water fountain, use racial slurs or oppressed anyone. Saying it's my turn is just as stupid as the KKK outlook. Tiny minds.

330 said:

It's easy: if you tell a group of people that they are oppressed, they will eventually believe it and act accordingly.

Autonomy - an adult woman can take decisions like an adult man*

Be free from sexual violence - well, according to many people in this forum, victims always deserve what they get for some reason. I don't think the same way. Rape is horrible. However, not only it isn't a controversial subject (you will never hear people on the streets defending rapists*) and a judge will always stay behind a woman who tazed/shot a rapist, but the voice of a woman is much stronger than the man. If a woman accuses someone of rape, especially in the US, they will be, in most cases, guilty until proven innocent. And rarely punished in case of false accusations as well. You're a student? Forget your college.

To work - while I agree that some companies rarely do discriminate women, those are 99% of the time due to the company being small and on budget and not taking the risk of hiring a woman for one year that might spend 6 months away for paid maternity leave. You forced companies to accept this burden and some of them can't really take it. The law should be changed. Also, a lot of countries require companies to hire a certain percentage of women no matter their skill level. So yeah.

Equal pay - bullshit*. One hundred percent bullshit*.

Reproductive rights - they have the right to do whatever they want with their body already*. But what about men? If a couple wants to have a baby and the woman is pregnant but she changes her mind, why doesn't the man have any right?

To own property - lol*

Education - considering how women obtain scolarships and specific courses all the time just because they have a vagina, this offends me. A lot.



* This can all be true in some Muslim countries, but... why aren't they protesting there then?



By the way, let me add something that a lot of people don't consider an issue or a "first world problem": try being part of the 1% like me and find a woman that honestly wants to be with you because she loves you.

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This is HILARIOUS!!

1. Autonomy- Not all decisions are good. Ideas generally get judged on merit, not sex. Guys, even white ones, get their ideas shit on and or stolen by people above them all the time. It's the American way to take credit for someone else's work. It's how most of the 1% gets there and it's what most people really want. Something for nothing. Get over it.
   
2. Free from sexual violence- This should be a given but there are two BIG issues. First, you can't expect all the spoils of acting like you are weak and cute (opening doors for you, picking up the check etc. etc.) without someone thinking you are weak and cute. Predators will pick up on that. They should be shot but what can you do? I am not victim shaming. You know what you are dealing with when you are dealing with the public. Be smart. I think rapists and moelsters should get life in prison. Unfortunately with all the false allegations, half the country would get locked up. The other thing is that it's mostly hear say and people lie. Hitting on someone is not assault. Men are supposed to be the pursuer in the typical American courtship. All of a sudden asking the hot chick at work out that has been giving you a lot of attention and you have a nice time talking to is a crime. IF people want to be taken seriously they need to drop this bullshit. There is a certain amount of guess work and trial and error in hooking up. Now asking someone out is a crime?!?? Stupid. Our species need us to have sex to continue the line and for our mental health. And a kiss is not assault. IF a guy acts the fool and crosses some lines he should have social ramifications but not legal ones. Please. I heard of a bus driver, female, that told some guy to sit down. There is no law about sitting and she really didn't have a right. The guy was a germaphobe so he said "Fuck that. The bus is covered in shit and I will not sit." She said " SIT!" He said "Fuck you CUNT!" Next thing you know she is claiming a "Verbal Sexual Assault." WTF Guy is an asshole and he obviously has issues. Calling someone who is acting like a cunt a cunt is not assault. Bullshit. If we are to take EVERY case seriously then we need to stop this type of bullshit crybaby nonsense.
3. To Work- Things have changed. Back in the 70's there were separate job listings for men and women. Total segregation. That is LONG GONE. Women have the right to apply anywhere and work if they qualify. There are some bigoted sexist asshole employers out there. It should be a social issue. The 1% doesn't care and every time a woman doesn't get the job they claim gender was the issue. Not everything else about them. Another bullshit thing most of the time. I have hired and fired a ton of people over my years and never use gender or color as the basis of my decision. Did I get accused of racism or sexism anytime I fired someone not white or a guy? You bet your ass. I have a multi cultural crew. I live in the bay area. It's VERY diverse. I don't care what color or sex you are. If you are not qualified I WILL NOT HIRE YOU. If I do hire you and you suck I WILL FIRE YOU. I realize not everyone is like that and decide they want certain "type of employee". If its true then that business should respond by firing the asshat or the people should stop using that company's services. Not a law suit. Some people suck. And this country is way too litigation crazy, Get a grip.
   
4. Pay Inequality- I agree within reason. When she is just as qualified. Not always the case! Kevin Spacey gets fired for being a turd. I actually agree with that. He is the type of guy who DOES deserve what he's getting. (IF the reports are true, who knows) So they have some of the cast do re-shoots and try to call it pay inequality when Marky Mark gets paid more than Michelle Williams??!? First his contract said "No re-shoots" so they had to pay the man. Her contract INCLUDED PAY FOR RE-SHOOTS. She already agreed. Besides that he is MARKY FUCKING MARK. Michelle who? Who cares. She is shit and shouldn't be paid as much as a real actor or actress. Period. People cry and say inequality and I say YES! Her talent,fame and box office draw are totally in equal to that of Marky fucking Mark. So should her pay.
5. Reproductive Rights- Didn't we fight that already? T-Rump and his band of treasonists want to change that. Please. Abortion is necessary for our culture. Without it we would have too many unwanted kids and more shattered lives. I don't think abortion as birth control is okay. I have seen cases where a woman has had 10+ abortions. That bitch should be strung up in the middle of town and stoned to death. Slut shaming needs to come back. If you have had multiple abortions and weren't because of rape or defect you should be held accountable. Be her conscious. Plus most of the women who get multiple abortions are morons. Maybe shaming will make them have less sex and less kids. The species will be better off if the Moron Whores don't reproduce. If we make abortion illegal they will explode! We should make abortion/sterilization mandatory for people with low I.Q. LOL Just kidding. But if you are stupid, please don't have sex. Then this mess will work out.
6. Own Property? Is this an issue? WTF? And as far as the Muslim crack. Women in MANY countries can't own anything because the women ARE property. Not just Muslim. Pigeon holing Muslims shows your creed.
   
7. Education - Education is there for anyone qualified. Women are free to attend any college that accepts them. The true travesty is that education costs anything in the first place. Education should be free, in all levels.

And Finally this gem!

By the way, let me add something that a lot of people don't consider an issue or a "first world problem": try being part of the 1% like me and find a woman that honestly wants to be with you because she loves you.

LOL. Keep crying! The 1% for the most part are nothing but their money. The fact you are crying about it but still have to point out you are a 1% is 100% HILARIOUS! No body cares about your plight. Your problem is bullshit. What's wrong? Abercrombie run out of khakis? The espresso machine broke? Are you trying to say you are in a similar situation? You and you're buddies put us in this situation. Your opinion doesn't really matter. 1% is how much of your soul the devil left you after you sold it. How about the poor guy getting judged on a date because he can't afford to pay for a fancy meal? Or nice clothes? You don't deserve to be loved for something other than your money if you are not something other your money. I would love to "try being in the 1%". Most of us would. Please,

Xzi said:

Your post assumes males are idiots and don't realize the kind of backlash there would be to your proposed laws in 2018. That doesn't mean women weren't barred from voting or working for the longest time, they were. It also doesn't mean that the laws written when first establishing this country weren't created to benefit white men specifically, they were. Yes, we've made a lot of progress, but there are still far too many systematic biases when it comes to women and other races. This stuff doesn't fix itself if we just plug our ears and go "LALALA DOESN'T EXIST," it has to be revised first.

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Could you explain what you mean by "are still far too many systematic biases when it comes to women and other races"

From my point of view I see nothing but opportunities for those who are willing to put in the work. Are there racist and sexist assholes? Yes but we have laws in place to prevent that.

DRAGONBALLVINTAGE said:

Well if your dressing like your a stripper and your name is Madonna

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I hate her.

Xzi said:

Generalize and insult based on physical appearance, then complain that the people you're generalizing and insulting get better treatment in the US than you.

Seems like in your case it might just be karma and not the way "the US" treats you.

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It's the other way around. The world has treated me like shit and now I am bitter. You can't honestly tell me that you didn't notice that a lot of these women that keep protesting are grotesque in one way or another.

It is common knowledge that women win around 85% of custody cases, even though men are just as capable, if not better, at being a good parent than the woman. You can not tell me that it is fair that minorities can have these Black Entertainment Awards, Black scholarships, black tv channels, black dating sites, black lives matter...
... but the moment a white person tries to create something of the same type then it gets called racist. Now, how is that karma against me? Are you trying to say that all this unfairness that is in the US is all because of me?

Sorry for my examples of "black" this and that. Not trying to pick on blacks here, but I can not think of any other things off the top of my head that is made for certain races, besides scholarships for native americans and asians. But I am sure you guys can pull up many other examples.

CallmeBerto said:

Could you explain what you mean by "are still far too many systematic biases when it comes to women and other races"

From my point of view I see nothing but opportunities for those who are willing to put in the work. Are there racist and sexist assholes? Yes but we have laws in place to prevent that.

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Just to start, we've never had anywhere near an equal number of female representatives in government. It's usually closer to 1/10th at best. This is reflected in boardrooms across America as well, the number of female executives is staggeringly low. In other words, while we might be happy to give women jobs, their upward mobility is clearly being stifled. As is men's upward mobility I'd say just because of unregulated capitalism, but not quite to that same ridiculous extent.

Women are naturally going to be the target of more sexual crimes, and while the #MeToo movement has put a spotlight on women who were previously afraid to speak up, we're already seeing massive backlash to that by those threatened by it. That's just going to cause more fear in victims and keep the cycle going.

And while I don't attribute Trump's win to sexism, Hillary Clinton was clearly more qualified than Donald Trump to be president. People were willing to glorify Trump's "experience" and downplay Hillary's for the sake of keeping a false narrative going.

Just a few points among many more I could make.

Xzi said:

Your post assumes males are idiots and don't realize the kind of backlash there would be to your proposed laws in 2018. That doesn't mean women weren't barred from voting or working for the longest time, they were. It also doesn't mean that the laws written when first establishing this country weren't created to benefit white men specifically, they were. Yes, we've made a lot of progress, but there are still far too many systematic biases when it comes to women and other races. This stuff doesn't fix itself if we just plug our ears and go "LALALA DOESN'T EXIST," it has to be revised first.

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Benefiting white men. But what about poor men, black men, asian men, south american men, men of different races. The slaughter of Indians. Not all men had those same rights.

Most males didn't have the right to vote for most of history either. Voting for your government was rather a recent concept.

Lets take for example in the UK. A good chunk of males males did not get the right to vote till 1918 the same year women got the vote.
Before that males fought for their right to vote. In 1832 the Great Reform Act increase 1 in 7 males the right to vote. And more reform acts through out the years till Universal male suffrage was achieved in 1918, same year women got the vote. They didn't want poor men to have the right to vote, but it was until WW1 that got them Universal Male Suffrage with the representation of peoples act. It was a similar story in other countries of voting rights not existing till 1800's and 1900's.

Most jobs that existed today didn't exist in the early 1800's and before that. Most people were farmers. So what jobs were women being barred from? The female did domestic duties while the male did hard physical labor like chopping down trees near the land. A women job was to raise the average 8 kids, knit clothing for those 8 kids, wash all those clothing, prepare food from scratch, It was more than an 14 hour job for the women. The was no time for the female to take on other jobs, she had to do what she had to do to for the family to survive.

Nowadays with microwaves, having less kids, being able to take a trip to the clothing store, and machines making life easier, women are able to complete the tasks much quickly, having more free time, and able to take on other things like a job. It was machines and technology that freed women from their roles. It wan't because males were holding women back. Women and males had to do what they needed to survive.

Xzi said:

Just to start, we've never had anywhere near an equal number of female representatives in government. It's usually closer to 1/10th at best. This is reflected in boardrooms across America as well, the number of female executives is staggeringly low. In other words, while we might be happy to give women jobs, their upward mobility is clearly being stifled. As is men's upward mobility I'd say just because of unregulated capitalism, but not quite to that same ridiculous extent.

Women are naturally going to be the target of more sexual crimes, and while the #MeToo movement has put a spotlight on women who were previously afraid to speak up, we're already seeing massive backlash to that by those threatened by it. That's just going to cause more fear in victims and keep the cycle going.

And while I don't attribute Trump's win to sexism, Hillary Clinton was clearly more qualified than Donald Trump to be president. People were willing to glorify Trump's "experience" and downplay Hillary's for the sake of keeping a false narrative going.

Just a few points among many more I could make.

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I don't see this as such a big deal. As long as they are being represented who cares? I don't need someone who looks like me to represent me. I mean clearly women are getting all the rights they want just fine due to the fact they are the majority of voters and they which side their bread is buttered on.

I disagree the #MeToo movement is salem bitch trials. If there is no police report they are full of shit. None of this allegations by facebook or whatever. Harvey Weinstein did nothing wrong. He basically said "hey I can help your movie career if you fuck me" maybe did many didn't. They are just mad that they had to be whores to move up. On that note I can see their point but it wasn't rape.

There are so many laws in place to protect rape victims if they are afraid to come forward. While there is so much hate based purely on allegations.

On Trump and Clinton I think the people in general just didn't trust her or trusted her less then Trump.