PS1/2 Any Class action lawsuit yet for PS3 linux feature removal?

[bRKcRE]

I wonder what is causing their actions with blocking the possibility of linux installation.

Geohot is using it to hack the ps3's OS. So Sony got pissed and removed it for everyone. They want to make sure it doesnt turn into the pirate-fest that is every other console in the world.

wouldnt the removal of OtherOS from the PS3 be actively encouraging people to hack the internal hardware more now though in order to run unsigned code and backups?? i thought linux was included originally to allow people to run homebrew type stuff..

 

[bialy_gibson]

I wonder what is causing their actions with blocking the possibility of linux installation.

Geohot is using it to hack the ps3's OS. So Sony got pissed and removed it for everyone. They want to make sure it doesnt turn into the pirate-fest that is every other console in the world.

wouldnt the removal of OtherOS from the PS3 be actively encouraging people to hack the internal hardware more now though in order to run unsigned code and backups?? i thought linux was included originally to allow people to run homebrew type stuff..

As an owner of PS3 and DS i noticed couple of strange actions taken by japanese companies. Maybe we can't understand their decisions because of cultural differences.

 

[Maikel Steneker]

I wonder what is causing their actions with blocking the possibility of linux installation.

Geohot is using it to hack the ps3's OS. So Sony got pissed and removed it for everyone. They want to make sure it doesnt turn into the pirate-fest that is every other console in the world.

wouldnt the removal of OtherOS from the PS3 be actively encouraging people to hack the internal hardware more now though in order to run unsigned code and backups?? i thought linux was included originally to allow people to run homebrew type stuff..

Exactly. Besides, this won't solve anything for Sony. If the PS3 were to be hacked through Other OS, it would probably become possible to discover some kind of other exploit. Just look at what happened with the Wii. It's not like Team Twiizers just used a random file as a Twilight Hack. First they got access through the system via the GameCube hypervisor, then they were able to make all kinds of exploits.

 

[NoSmokingBandit]

Yes but Geo is using linux to access the hypervisor. Cut off access to that and you have to start the process all over again.

It would be like Nintendo cutting of the GC stuff on the wii to stop them from working on accessing the hypervisor and constructing hacks based on saves or whatever. But nintendo doesnt care as much because the wii is still selling like mad.

 

[Sumea]

I have a slim so there was never an option in the first place. I wouldn't miss it even if i had it. A PS3 is for gaming, a PC is for Linux and for doing work.

Funny, considering one of the quotes around the time the PS3 came out from the company was that they weren't selling you a game console, they were selling you a personal computer.

Actually, after some time of release of PS2 - PS2 was registered as personal computer even - mostly for tax reasons but yes; Even PS2 already was registered as a computer device instead of game console.

 

[playallday]

Sony still has the right to change anything they want at any time.

Nope, suing won't work.

 

[dioioib]

Sony still has the right to change anything they want at any time.

Nope, suing won't work.

I don't know if that's actually true. I am assuming you are not a lawyer. But miss representation of a product at the time of sale is a crime.

I personally will be contacting a lawer to discuss the matter further. When I purchased this unit it was specifically for the otherOS functionality, and the game console side of things was secondary to this. The classification of this unit being a computer system and not game console could be argued as this system lacks critical functionality as a computer system.

The fact remains Sony is the only company which can get away with treating its customers like this. Aside removal of this feature we also have to be aware that now devices like my PSP will have limited functionality. Most of what I have purchased in the SonyStore will be inaccessible, as the unit no longer lets you login to your PSN account. So this unit no longer has internet connectivity for a number of things. This was not the unit I purchased, and this was not part of the agreement for the other content I purchased.

 

[NoSmokingBandit]

When I purchased this unit it was specifically for the otherOS functionality, and the game console side of things was secondary to this.

Then dont update. Problem solved.

 

[VmprHntrD]

I'm lost on this crybaby shit especially with the PSP. How is not updating a PS3 infringing your ability to use the PSP and PSN? They're unique systems, neither needs the other to get 100% usage out of either device. I had a PSP for like 8mo before a PS3 and nothing has changed since having both.

You're making a huge stretch trying to use some loose marketing buzz that the PS3 is a computer and therefore you got robbed. I recall the old marketing crap but it wasn't on the box, never advertised in tv or print spots, not on kiosks, nothing. It was some shit those idiots shoveled to the suck up saps of the gaming media just as they did with PS2 back in the day talking how Saddam Hussein was importing them to use the chips in missile tech and other dumb claims. It was sold as a gaming system and multimedia device heavily dropping names of gaming and blu-ray movie player out there with net junk being a secondary cool thing to do. You're going to have to prove conclusively they sold this as a system that is a computer and can have an OS installed on it, and that these features were listed as a primary function on the box, packaging, things seen in the public without opening the box to a blind shelf buying consumer.

Trust me, as someone who may not be a lawyer but worked on a poly sci degree and took some law courses and looked at case studies you're not in a good position to win anything but a smaller bank book.

I will add I get your problem and you want to use other OS and the PSN, but it's just not going to happen. Sony was forced into that because that asswipe Geo who was using that as a backdoor to crack their security methods and this locks it down but good. They do as a company primarily have to serve their best interests and the best interests of their paying customers on the majority, and that would be for a secure device that hasn't been hacked to bits to be pirated rampantly. You can try and do your case, but the odds seriously are not in your favor. You still can get online, still can do netplay games, but you can't get into the PSN is all. As the guy above me said, don't update. You're not being forced, it is a choice. You'd have a hell of a case though if you flipped the system on and it forced the update locking you out with no choice, and that likely is the key why you'll lose -- choice.

 

[dioioib]

I'm lost on this crybaby shit especially with the PSP. How is not updating a PS3 infringing your ability to use the PSP and PSN? They're unique systems, neither needs the other to get 100% usage out of either device. I had a PSP for like 8mo before a PS3 and nothing has changed since having both.

You really do not understand the problem. Yes the features I use do integrate the PS3 and PSP. And yes you do need a PSN account to use the Remote Play feature as it verifies you are the owner of the paired device through their DNAS server much like verifying a game is authentic.

It was sold as a gaming system and multimedia device heavily dropping names of gaming and blu-ray movie player out there with net junk being a secondary cool thing to do. You're going to have to prove conclusively they sold this as a system that is a computer and can have an OS installed on it, and that these features were listed as a primary function on the box, packaging, things seen in the public without opening the box to a blind shelf buying consumer.

The argument is already proven by the fact they enabled the feature in the first place. The item is actually listed for importation into my country as a computer system, not a game system which is a legal distinction of its own. And their own website did give links to Yellow Dog which was the "Official Distro" and limited instructs on how to install the otherOS although it stated it could not support the os. Which is of course the responsibility of the OS distributor. But as we all know the ephemeral nature of the internet these pages can be easily removed, and we would have no way of knowing if they are still available. The best chance for any sort of legal action exists in the UK where customers are protected under more provisions than North Americans. Honestly, I would rather not have to consult any legal counsel I just want a feature I originally paid for with continued support for the other features I also paid for. I'm not sure if you bought your own system, or if you purchased the less expensive $299 PS3, but I paid substantial more for a now limited system. I would gladly take a $300 rebate for the loss of functionality, and not use otherOS. However, the likelihood of that happening is slim so what other choice do the thousands of users worldwide, who do use this feature have?

QUOTE(Vampire Hunter D @ Apr 7 2010, 05:39 AM)

They do as a company primarily have to serve their best interests and the best interests of their paying customers on the majority, and that would be for a secure device that hasn't been hacked to bits to be pirated rampantly.

And I agree in part with this. But I am a paying customer as well. In fact I am one of there better customers who has never utilized circumvention methods to copy content illegally for PSP, PS1, PS2 etc. I own all the content for my systems. This Geo you speak of is surely the cause, I have read about the RAM dumping he was able to do. But to be honest knowing quite a bit about programming and electronics there are other ways to obtain this information and they do not necessarily have anything to do with otherOS. I could setup an FPGA to farm the information out of the signal path going into ram if I wished and have that dump to practically anything I choose, after decrypting the data which probably isn't difficult seeing as someone has completed it already you are in business. To me this seems like a quick bandage solution to a problem sony corporation is to ignorant to fix. No system is infallible. Are we not just delaying the inevitable? The PS3 will eventually be cracked anyway, through hardware or other methods, as every system is, I just see it as pointless to crack a system which had a function only to reinstate that same function which was previously part of the firmware.

If we are going to argue that security is the reason for the update than perhaps using another method on the server side would be the way to implement more protection. But this is just the typical sony way of doing things. If you go to there own blog you will see just how many people are infuriated about the issue.

 

[VmprHntrD]

No I do, I just have a huge level of disgust for whiners who can't handle what the company did to it's software. You may own the hardware but you do not own the licensed materials including the OS whether you like it or not. They took out the OtherOS feature to keep piracy away best they can while also putting the old unit on the same level as the slim. That's the facts, you don't like them either.

I've never tried remote play, seemed like an entirely worthless concept so I'll trust you that it works that way as I've just never bothered.

I paid for the last of the original style 80GB units, but I did pay $300 as I got it from a company going out of business. I didn't care it was removed, and in all honesty I was happy to see it removed after what Geoasshat was doing in trying to bust the encryption. I've always been of the don't swipe/emulate until the system is at the least on the way out if not already 'dead' group in all fairness.

Now you're in Canada, not where I am, so I was speaking on what can be done here, and that's really jack shit. Perhaps Canada or the UK can get what you wanted done, for that region alone though so anything is possible. Basically I'd say if someone was legitimately using OtherOS and using the device to play online or off with normal games that sucks and they're fucked unless they just want an offline only system though I imagine in time some games may fail to run.

In that last part where you partly agree with me, yes it is Geo that's causing this. He has figured out using his tools and that feature alone how to go in the back door loosely speaking to get his code to run on the device. It was matter of a short bit more time before that hacker would have busted the flood gates open to rampant PS3 game theft so Sony slammed the door shut the best they could. He supposedly found a way using Firmware 3.15 or earlier to hack in 3.21 with OtherOS in place but hasn't made it public -- for now. Sure no system is unbreakable, but the longer they hold out the better it is for everyone who uses the PS3 legit, and considering the billions they lost in R&D and overkill losses per system sold since 2006 I'd rather them keep it under lock and key until PS4 comes damn near knocking. I know a good many are infuriated about it, but in perspective considering how many PS3s are out there, you're seeing the complaints of a very very small vocal minority here. If it pissed off a majority of owners and game sales started to decline they wouldn't dare keep it as is.

 

[dnniwa485]

anyway.. if your living somewhere in europe.. you can have a refund for your OtherOS removal (20% refund) ..

but its under EULA if you read carefully .. it states there that they can remove such feature just for console's security reasons. Thats why there are always EULA showing up everytime you update your firmware. Once you accept it.. means you agree any changes made on that latest firmware, for better or worse.