What do I need to know if I want to build a NAS?

Noctosphere

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Hello

Let me get straigth to the point. I want a NAS.
Let me get straigth to the point agai. I know nothing about NAS.

In short, I have a Plex media server I use to stream all my videos everywhere. My family outside also use my server.
I'd like a dedicated machine to run the server and to be powerful enough to transcode videos whenever needed.

I'd need a poweful enough CPU to transcode, but that's all I know I'll need.
I already have a couple of hard drive I can use for the stockage.
What else do I need? I see some NAS online, but I don't know what I'd need for what I'll use it for.
For example, how much RAM would I need for each user? As in, if we are 6 person at the same time using the PMS, how much ram would I need? How much RAM if we are 8 to use it at the same time?
I'd like to acces it from distance, as in that I wouldn't need a dedicated monitor to use it. Either that I could a wire from the NAS to my actual computer or use a wireless connection to manage it.

I'll use Windows, but I'd like to acces the BIOS to configure it so that if I lose power, it will turn back on whenever the power supply detects power.

Finally, this part is optional, but the way I get my videos is via torrenting. I'd like to know if it's possible to do all these and to still be seeding the torrents. Do I need something extra if I want to use the NAS to seed torrents? Extra CPU power? more RAM?

Last thing, I'd need a ethernet port, not negociable :)

What else do I need to know?
Anyone have experience with NAS?
Thanks :)
 

FAST6191

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NAS and plex are not the same thing.

NAS is just a storage means, can have a variety of protocols by which it is accessed but that is what NAS extends to.

At the same time plenty do have other options, including plex servers and torrent clients (you usually upload a torrent file, or possibly magnet link these days on a web page it hosts, and it sorts the rest for you, whether you stuff that down a VPN or need to sign into a private tracker then getting a bit more tricky).
https://www.truenas.com/apps/ but we will return to that shortly.

For my money there are three types of NAS.

The cheap junk they sell to consumers to have a couple of drive bays possibly in a RAID and serving files via windows file sharing, FTP and maybe something else. Fairly narrow in their use but OK enough for a small office to share files* when the main PC is not on/not having a main PC, or some nerds to use in their own house knowing the limitations.

The expensive nonsense they sell to businesses with all manner of extras you can pay for to do real things, and might well come with enough drive bays to do something real.

Those that get an old PC, a copy of FreeNAS, or truenas core as it is known these days https://www.truenas.com/truenas-core/ , and get something real going on. Some also do fun things with raspberry pis here but that is a more specialist thing more in line with the cheap junk albeit the with the ability to run a few applications on top of it. I already linked https://www.truenas.com/apps/ but have a look and see what is available.
Some will go the other way and run your Plex server setup as the storage platform itself (though it seems standalone ones are gone and instead it wants to be an application on a more general server) before manually setting up everything else -- many motherboards will have RAID if you want that and it is not hard to set up SMB (windows file sharing), plex itself, FTP and whatever else.

Hard drives in NAS world are interesting thing. You might have some already, however you might also consider some of the drives designed to be run 24/7 (various companies doing it for NAS and CCTV usages). Most consumer drives will hold up well enough though.

I mentioned RAID above. If you are not familiar with RAID then it is a way of combining discs together. There are various types ranging from RAID 0 which stitches two drives together theoretically making them faster but any one of those drives failing and the whole thing goes, to RAID 1 which is a mirror of the drive (one failing does not matter as the other is an identical backup, obviously though you have half the storage if they are the same size drives), to various combinations of that (RAID0+1 needing 4 drives but theoretically being the best of both worlds), and ways of having drives hold redundancy data so one drive (of several) can fail but recovery data is held on the others such that over the next however long (potentially hours if it is terabytes) it can restore it.
https://phoenixnap.com/kb/raid-levels-and-types
Any NAS worth anything will offer this, and more, as an option. RAID is the absolute basics of big boy hard drive data storage guy skills but probably all you need here.

CPUs capable of transcoding are more or less anything that is a PC really. Time was it was a CPU killer but today then eh. Only thing I would note is if you want to use the GPU encoders that might take a real GPU. Also are you sure it needs to transcode? Most things should be able to decode the baseline video, though I suppose if you want to serve up a 360p version of a 4k blu ray rip to a phone then why not. A raspberry pi with XBMC on every TV that needs one is potentially a game changer for you in this.

RAM per user if this old PC was vaguely current in the last 7 years should not be an issue. What I am more here to say though is be very careful when speccing things out like this -- I know you want to build to the worst case scenario but it gets very expensive for what might only be a few hours per day. That said if this is a media box then everybody hammering it from end of work until midnight (any vaguely good torrent collection is going to be better than 5 streaming services combined) when they go to bed is a more plausible scenario and I doubt you can do anything cute**.

Are ethernet ports that rare these days in your searching? All but the cheapest of cheap junk tended to include one from what I saw.
Likewise all should feature some kind of management interface, usually a web server embedded within the NAS like you might have for a wireless printer but some will also give you SSH or something if you want that instead. If you are running a server machine with plex on top and whatever storage it has underneath all that then you do also have the normal selection of remote access tools like teamviewer, anydesk and whatever else the kids are using this week.

Remotely outside your house will likely involve fiddling with the router (some things can bypass it these days, quite thankful for that one with everybody wanting CCTV, but I would not lean too much into this. Instead some kind of dynamic DNS service (assuming you don't have a static IP for your house) and setting ports on your firewall. Whether you go one step further and have your users ssh into your server to do anything is another matter; a while back you mentioned being blocked by work so this would help with that as well as being generally more secure.

On BIOS (assuming you are doing the full PC route as opposed to "device") then most these days will have an option like restore last state after power loss. I will note though that if you are using a RAID setup it might take a while to come back online if it has to scan and possibly rebuild something.
It is also at this point I would suggest getting a UPS (uninterruptable power supply) such that it can keep things running if it is just a 30 minute outage or something (plug your router into it as a well) but more importantly it can initiate a proper shut down to avoid having to do said rebuild.


*I have a client who has been in business for 15+ years at this point. Ignoring his photos directory and emails (which are on another system anyway) then every spreadsheet, document and more I moved from computer to computer over the years barely totals 50 gigs and he does multiple every day, as do his people. This is then very different from what you want where a terabyte might well be a TV show that ran for a few series in super high quality (4 gigs a pop, 23 episodes a series, 10 series say and you are getting up there).

**variations of this story are told to new IT peeps wherever you go. So there was this large business and every day after lunch their login servers would get absolutely nailed and crash sometimes, work fine the rest of the time though. Obviously everybody having their 30 minutes lunch or whatever would come back at the same time and try to log in. Manglement then specs a supercomputer to handle it, until the far more obvious solution of just stagger lunches by department so everybody does not come back at once was pointed out. Harder here, that is unless you want to build a couple of these, put them in the houses of your friends/family and have access to them such that when you add things to the list it automatically replicates it on their local setups over the next few hours. Which has the added bonus that if yours gets hit by lightning or something then you can just copy it all back off one of their machines.
 
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SonyUSA

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You can buy the Dell Optiplex line of desktops off of ebay for PENNIES since they always come from expired company leases and a lot are in great shape and have really good CPUs/specs. I got a 7th gen i7 for almost nothing ($130 maybe?) and threw a couple 4TB hard drives in (if you want a lot of drives you'll need a power supply adapter for ~$15 since they use specialty plugs and only come with like a 150 watt). It runs Windows and has a soft raid for redundancy but it runs my Plex server and it can transcode to 3 clients with no issues (I'm sure more but never tried), runs my Discord music bot, and I run games off of it through remote desktop (it's headless and sits in my HVAC room next to my fiber modem and switch) if I want to farm with a second account. I threw a 1050 in it since there is a variant that doesn't use additional power (though I don't pay for Plex Premium so it doesn't use it to transcode).
 
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Sypherone

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Yeah, NAS use Linux as Operating system and run as Raid 1 (mirrored). So best if you wish to start to build your own, get a Raspberry Pi and directly a 8gb (but they get expensive over the last year). Then you can check on Pimyupmylife for a lot different tutorials to set up the needed application and functions.

To access the Pi from outside: If you have a ipv6 only network and not stacked with ipv4, you can set it up to connect from outside. Else you will need to rent a extern server to setup a vpn server, or subscribe to a vpn service that let you use and forward incoming connections on a specific port.

And a Rasperry Pi compared to a desktop or mini PC doesnt need so much power, even if it runs 24/7.
 
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Noctosphere

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You can buy the Dell Optiplex line of desktops off of ebay for PENNIES since they always come from expired company leases and a lot are in great shape and have really good CPUs/specs. I got a 7th gen i7 for almost nothing ($130 maybe?) and threw a couple 4TB hard drives in (if you want a lot of drives you'll need a power supply adapter for ~$15 since they use specialty plugs and only come with like a 150 watt). It runs Windows and has a soft raid for redundancy but it runs my Plex server and it can transcode to 3 clients with no issues (I'm sure more but never tried), runs my Discord music bot, and I run games off of it through remote desktop (it's headless and sits in my HVAC room next to my fiber modem and switch) if I want to farm with a second account. I threw a 1050 in it since there is a variant that doesn't use additional power (though I don't pay for Plex Premium so it doesn't use it to transcode).
thanks a lot for the advice

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/30404104267...wFAxSTPUl|tkp:Bk9SR9aF3u7wYQ&var=603189337262
Do you think this one looks fine?
500GB HDD should be more than enough for basic stuff I'd need on it (windows, torrent client, etc) I have multiple drive, but only one of those I'd put on it is internal, the others are external, and I guess I'll buy some kind of USB port multiplier
 

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For me I use a Synology DS1520+ for my Plex Media Server, you need a devices such as Nvidia Shield TV, that can decode so you won't put stress on the NAS.
 

Noctosphere

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Well guys, the thing about why I need a way to transcode is because my family has kinda old equipment and I don't know their specification.
I mostly download video with a HEVC codec, which isn't compatible with everything.
So, unless you guys know how to make their equipment (firetv, roku, etc) 100% compatible with HEVC, I'll need a way to transcode :(
 

Hayato213

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Well guys, the thing about why I need a way to transcode is because my family has kinda old equipment and I don't know their specification.
I mostly download video with a HEVC codec, which isn't compatible with everything.
So, unless you guys know how to make their equipment (firetv, roku, etc) 100% compatible with HEVC, I'll need a way to transcode :(

You can use PC but you need a raid setup unless you just want to use a single large drive, if that drive die your library die.
 

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I think really you need to decide how properly you want to do this, buying a random old PC and connecting usb drives to it will work for Plex, however is not ideal from a NAS point of view as you have no redundancy for your data, if the hard drive fails you have lost that data.

Do you just want a Plex server or an actual NAS where their is some redundancy to protect you if one of the hard drives fails?

Either way you want an Intel processor as Plex can use this to transcode multiple video streams very efficiently with low power usage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video#Hardware_decoding_and_encoding - the newer the intel processor the more capable it is for transcoding. You don't really need a powerful processor for transcoding video with Plex, the processor just needs to support Quick Sync. You will need a Skylake or better processor to transcode HEVC.

If building a proper NAS then i'd recommend UnRaid for the OS, the advantage of UnRaid is you can mix and match drive sizes in your nas and have a large parity which will allow you to recover the data on a single drive failure. Another advantge of UnRaid is you can just spin up the actual drive(s) in use, this is a lot more power efficient when you have a lot of hard drives.

TrueNAS is also a good option for the OS, however its more enterprise based and will require you to purchase all the drives you wish to use up front as adding drives at a later date while is possible, is far from ideal. All the drives will be spun up 24/7 due to the way ZFS (the file system) works so will not be as energy efficient.

Either of the above NAS OS's can run Plex and various other useful apps in a Docker container.

Also regardless of the NAS OS you should backup your data if you care about it.
 

Noctosphere

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Ok, i think Ihave to clarify something
I don't care at all about hard drive faillure and loss of data in this case
Those hard drive don't contain anything of value. Everything in these can easily be downloaded back whenever i get another hard drive.
It'll be a pain, but it's no problem for me :)

However, I'd obviously take the option where if an hard drive fails, I don't lose all data on other hard drive.
I've already lost a couple of drive, but never lost anything of value, but I still find it a pain having to redowload TBs of videos. I'd prefer not losing dozens of TBs if possible you see ;)

From my experience, I've started buying drives around early 2010's and have lost drive to age faillure about twice or trice, so they last long enough for me (about 5-6 years of lifespan for a drive).
 

Hayato213

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Ok, i think Ihave to clarify something
I don't care at all about hard drive faillure and loss of data in this case
Those hard drive don't contain anything of value. Everything in these can easily be downloaded back whenever i get another hard drive.
It'll be a pain, but it's no problem for me :)

However, I'd obviously take the option where if an hard drive fails, I don't lose all data on other hard drive.
I've already lost a couple of drive, but never lost anything of value, but I still find it a pain having to redowload TBs of videos. I'd prefer not losing dozens of TBs if possible you see ;)

From my experience, I've started buying drives around early 2010's and have lost drive to age faillure about twice or trice, so they last long enough for me (about 5-6 years of lifespan for a drive).

It is no fun to rebuild your library. You want to use NAS grade HDD anyway.
 

Noctosphere

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Plex has a buildin transcoder but you will need plex pass.
I have Plex Pass but that's not the point
Even if it has a built-in transcoder (which I already knew) it still needs good hardware to use it :)
 

Hayato213

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I have Plex Pass but that's not the point
Even if it has a built-in transcoder (which I already knew) it still needs good hardware to use it :)

You don't really need plex pass if you got media that doesn't need to be converted, anyway you want to stick to original format instead of converting into other format.
 

The Real Jdbye

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Hello

Let me get straigth to the point. I want a NAS.
Let me get straigth to the point agai. I know nothing about NAS.

In short, I have a Plex media server I use to stream all my videos everywhere. My family outside also use my server.
I'd like a dedicated machine to run the server and to be powerful enough to transcode videos whenever needed.

I'd need a poweful enough CPU to transcode, but that's all I know I'll need.
I already have a couple of hard drive I can use for the stockage.
What else do I need? I see some NAS online, but I don't know what I'd need for what I'll use it for.
For example, how much RAM would I need for each user? As in, if we are 6 person at the same time using the PMS, how much ram would I need? How much RAM if we are 8 to use it at the same time?
I'd like to acces it from distance, as in that I wouldn't need a dedicated monitor to use it. Either that I could a wire from the NAS to my actual computer or use a wireless connection to manage it.

I'll use Windows, but I'd like to acces the BIOS to configure it so that if I lose power, it will turn back on whenever the power supply detects power.

Finally, this part is optional, but the way I get my videos is via torrenting. I'd like to know if it's possible to do all these and to still be seeding the torrents. Do I need something extra if I want to use the NAS to seed torrents? Extra CPU power? more RAM?

Last thing, I'd need a ethernet port, not negociable :)

What else do I need to know?
Anyone have experience with NAS?
Thanks :)
Sounds like what you want is a home server. Some premade NAS products can run Plex but with limited or no transcoding functionality.
There are many avenues you could take, simple stuff like Plex doesn't require much as far as specs go, so you can get away with using whatever cheap used hardware you can find (hardware transcoding has been a standard feature on Intel for a long time now), or you could make something purpose built in a special NAS case with a ton of drive bays, it's all up to you.
Torrents do need a little bit of ram, 2 GB should be enough for that. Most PCs have a minimum of 4 GB, even older used hardware will usually have 4 or 8 GB, so you shouldn't have to worry about RAM, unless you want to use zfs as that uses ram for cache. I don't personally use zfs, I use unraid (which doesn't currently support zfs), which I can recommend. Unraid makes managing the server convenient, and you can easily add docker containers for Plex or anything else you want. TrueNAS is another option, both have slightly different feature sets but you can use docker containers on either.
I wouldn't use Windows, there is no advantage to running Windows on a home server, it just makes it more complicated to manage since you will probably not have a display plugged in to the server and most Windows tools are GUI based. It also adds a lot of unnecessary bloat.

Depending on how many drive bays you want, Fractal Design has some cases suitable for NAS use (like the Node range)
There are also cases designed specifically for NAS use like this one from Silverstone with 12 bays: You might not need 12 bays, but having plenty of room to add more drives in the future as they fill up is never a bad thing. Most mini ITX motherboards only have 4 SATA ports, but there are these LSI SAS HBA pcie cards all over eBay for a reasonable price that add another 8 ports.

Building a server from new parts can get quite costly especially with the cost of drives included, so you may want to consider buying a used Dell or something similar, you can get these for cheap as businesses get rid of large amounts of them when they upgrade. It'll only fit a few drives but you can always get a better case for it later as long as the parts are standard form factor (Dell sometimes uses non standard motherboards and PSUs), the Node cases are quite reasonably priced.
 
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Noctosphere

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You don't really need plex pass if you got media that doesn't need to be converted, anyway you want to stick to original format instead of converting into other format.
I'm not really converting anything myself
I download what other people ripped, whether from DVD/BD or from VOD services
Those media, even if some are encoded, sometimes are in their original codec, and sometimes, this original codec is HEVC and would still need to be transcoded
Post automatically merged:

Anyway, thanks everyone, I think I got my answer, and it seems a NAS is not what I'm looking for.
From the needs I have that I gave you, and the answers you all gave me, it seems that what I'd need is a home server

I'll try to shop for some used computer that fits my needs

Thanks :)
 
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Hayato213

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I'm not really converting anything myself
I download what other people ripped, whether from DVD/BD or from VOD services
Those media, even if some are encoded, sometimes are in their original codec, and sometimes, this original codec is HEVC and would still need to be transcoded

When I said converting it is when you play a file and your device can't play the original format then it needs to be converted, so if you were using a Synology the synology NAS would do the converting.

1681600575020.png


1681600647959.png
 

Noctosphere

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When I said converting it is when you play a file and your device can't play the original format then it needs to be converted, so if you were using a Synology the synology NAS would do the converting.

View attachment 365175

View attachment 365176
what you are talking about isn't converting
converting a file would change its nature (Example : AVI to MP4, H264 to X265)
What you are talking about is transcoding, it doesnt change the file itself. Plex reads it, converts what it read and then send it to the client.
the way the guy above was talking about, it sounded like he though i wouldnt need much for transcoding, like if just having plex pass would be ok, but no, I'd need a CPU good enough to handle it
 

Hayato213

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what you are talking about isn't converting
converting a file would change its nature (Example : AVI to MP4, H264 to X265)
What you are talking about is transcoding, it doesnt change the file itself. Plex reads it, converts what it read and then send it to the client.
the way the guy above was talking about, it sounded like he though i wouldnt need much for transcoding, like if just having plex pass would be ok, but no, I'd need a CPU good enough to handle it

When you play a video on the plex on the web if it can't transcode it convert it to the next available best format, so it use the nas or your computer in your case that you running your media off from to convert, you want to stick to no converting as much as possible.

If you install the plex app on your computer if you run a video that you need to convert, it use your computer to convert in my case.
 

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