Hardware PSA: Gateway Is Making More Bricks

[medoli900]

I just want to clarify something. No one stole anything from anybody. What they did is called "Copyright infringement". There is differences between these two terms. When you steal something, the other party does not have "the something" you stole, while copyright infringement is copying one other works. This may seems bickering, but they are not even under the same jurisdiction depending of the country.

 

[gamesquest1]

I just want to clarify something. No one stole anything from anybody. What they did is called "Copyright infringement". There is differences between these two terms. When you steal something, the other party does not have "the something" you stole, while copyright infringement is copying one other works. This may seems bickering, but they are not even under the same jurisdiction depending of the country.

well for it to be "copyright infringement" there would have to be copywritten work involved, i doubt for some reason gateway have copywritten any of their work

they are both shady businesses, and when one shady guy tries to take something from another shady guy (be it customers/designs/software etc)....the outcome usually isnt pretty

 

[medoli900]

well for it to be "copyright infringement" there would have to be copywritten work involved, i doubt for some reason gateway have copywritten any of their work

they are both shady businesses, and when one shady guy tries to take something from another shady guy (be it customers/designs/software etc)....the outcome usually isnt pretty

Copyright is done automatically on any works. When you write a book, you code something, you draw something, you write a scientific article, etc. You don't have to file anything to have your work copyrighted.

Edit: I seems to have mixed copyright and Intellectual property. The works we are talking about would be in Industrial Secret, not copyright. Sorry for the confusion. Although, it is still not stealing, but IP rights Infringement.

 

[Deleted-236924]

Saying rxtools is the panacea for GW bricks is a little disingenuous considering all the bricks that come from using that CFW.
(insufficient user warnings, sloppy codebase, etc.)

I also wonder how many bricks are resulting from not using the latest DS2plus plugin. I doubt that's the reason though.

If you bricked with rxTools, it's because you messed with your sysnand doing something you shouldn't have.

 

[gamesquest1]

Copyright is done automatically on any works. When you write a book, you code something, you draw something, you write a scientific article, etc. You don't have to file anything to have your work copyrighted.

Edit: I seems to have mixed copyright and Intellectual property. The works we are talking about would be in Industrial Secret, not copyright. Sorry for the confusion. Although, it is still not stealing, but IP rights Infringement.

yeah but i mean gateways code is havily based on nintendo's copywritten code and as such would most likely be exempt from any protection, but as i said this isnt a battle of laws, they dont care about laws they will handle it themselves and deal with it as they see fit regardless of laws etc

 

[medoli900]

wtf is going on in this topic now.

I didn't know my location would turn a page into a CreepyPasta page one day XD

yeah but i mean gateways code is havily based on nintendo's copywritten code and as such would most likely be exempt from any protection, but as i said this isnt a battle of laws, they dont care about laws they will handle it themselves and deal with it as they see fit regardless of laws etc

Oh, I didn't imply that lawsuit would be implied in this topic, but I saw some people using the verb stealing in this topic while it is false to call these actions stealing.
But I think I derailed this page a little too much. Sorry

 

[gudenau]

Could this get back on topic please?

 

[gamesquest1]

I didn't know my location would turn a page into a CreepyPasta page one day XD


Oh, I didn't imply that lawsuit would be implied in this topic, but I saw some people using the verb stealing in this topic while it is false to call these actions stealing.
But I think I derailed this page a little too much. Sorry

my bad i know what you meant, but just wanted to clarify that the whole subject is pretty much outside the realms of law, its like 2 gangs having a turf war

 

[Armadillo]

Unless we get some actual Gateway cards bricking, shouldn't the topic be "PSA:Supercard bricking"?

Supercard are responsible for making sure what their users use is safe.

Unless we are doing the clone thing again of:

lol I have your features without buying Gateway.
Bricks happen, fuck you Gateway, it's your fault my clone uses unsafe software.

 

[callmebob]

(edit) Sorry. Ignore. Tried to reply to a way too long post and couldn´t get rid of it otherwise. Some people need to stay on topic with short precise replies. aka STFU!

 

[Deleted User]

The bricking code was never removed from 2.02b. It was always present in the later 2.x and 3.x versions, you can ask the devs that tried to decrypt the Launcher.dat and got burned by the brick code.

It seems Gateway has perfected it to only brick DSTWO+ users, and not genuine GW users (after all, the brick code was always there and we haven't heard about a single GW user bricking since).

This is bad news for DSTWO+ users since whenever there is a new GW update, they will have the risk of being bricked, randomly.


I found this image funny I found on a spanish forum [credit Darkcloud98]:

 

[zoogie]

If you bricked with rxTools, it's because you messed with your sysnand doing something you shouldn't have.

Yes, it's ultimately the user's fault for using 3rd party software (with a don't-sue-me License) and failing to follow directions, but the devs contribute to the issue by willfully making it dangerous for inexperienced users through lack of in-app warnings and failsafes.
Read marcan's blog post for a more eloquent take on how I feel about the matter.

Back to my main point though, rxtools bricks far more people than GW + clones, period. And they will get a free pass because it's 'open source free software' and 'homebrew'.

 

[gudenau]

Yes, it's ultimately the user's fault for using 3rd party software (with a don't-sue-me License) and failing to follow directions, but the devs contribute to the issue by willfully making it dangerous for inexperienced users through lack of in-app warnings and failsafes.
Read marcan's blog post for a more eloquent take on how I feel about the matter.

Back to my main point though, rxtools bricks far more people than GW + clones, period. And they will get a free pass because it's 'open source free software' and 'homebrew'.

Never said they get a free pass, but they are transparent; they could not hide code to brick the 3DS. That was my point.

 

[Deleted-236924]

Yes, it's ultimately the user's fault for using 3rd party software (with a don't-sue-me License) and failing to follow directions, but the devs contribute to the issue by willfully making it dangerous for inexperienced users through lack of in-app warnings and failsafes.
Read marcan's blog post for a more eloquent take on how I feel about the matter.

Back to my main point though, rxtools bricks far more people than GW + clones, period. And they will get a free pass because it's 'open source free software' and 'homebrew'.

rxTools doesn't brick you, being inexperienced and fiddling with things you don't understand well enough does.
Gateway bricks you, because even if you know how to use your DSTwo+ and use it right, you get bricked because GW purposefully included code in their launcher that bricks your 3DS if they detect you are using a clone.
I would say that Supercard is also to blame, because they really should have made their own launcher and their own "DSTwo+ Mode" rather than copy it straight from Gateway without even trying to hide it.

And I really don't think they willfully make it dangerous.
You brick from using sysupdater while firmlaunch is enabled: sysupdater should be the one warning you (which it already does, by the way), not rxTools.
You brick from messing with files in sysnand in your favourite cia manager: It isn't rxTools devs' responsibility to warn the users. You went messing somewhere you didn't understand and broke something. If anything, if a warning is needed, it should be the FBI's devs warning the users in the tool.

They are under no obligation to make it super user-friendly, but I would have to question your accusations of them "willfully" making it dangerous for inexperienced users.

 

[hundshamer]

If either of you (Rashka or n3o33) could tell me exactly what you did and what model 3DS you have. I have a N3DS with a hardmod, a SCDS2+, and a Rasperry Pi. I might be willing to do some testing with both brick and restore.
My reasoning is two fold. First so we can confirm the bricks (not to be an ass but they do have low post count), and it could be some gateway agents spreading a good scare. Yeah, I know some paranoid conspiracy blah, blah... The second reason is to test unbricking methods.
off topic: The second time I was burned by a GBAtemp contest (NOT GBATEMP'S FAULT). The first time when I first joined a sponsor of Tempmas backed out and I never received my prize. This time I get burned, because the card I won from the Halloween Pumpkin Contest can brick my machine. This is my luck!

 

[Deleted User]

DSTWO+ is very good for DS roms. Just don't ever use it for 3DS roms...

 

[gudenau]

If either of you (Rashka or n3o33) could tell me exactly what you did and what model 3DS you have. I have a N3DS with a hardmod, a SCDS2+, and a Rasperry Pi. I might be willing to do some testing with both brick and restore.

off topic: The second time I was burned by a GBAtemp contest (NOT GBATEMP'S FAULT). The first time when I first joined a sponsor of Tempmas backed out and I never received my prize. This time I get burned, because the card I won from the Halloween Pumpkin Contest can brick my machine. This is my luck!

Just use it for DS stuff. :-D

 

[gamesquest1]

yeah its a pretty decent NDS card, that's what i wanted to win one for anyway....and the good olde' brick tests, oh well cant brick em all i guess

 

[zoogie]

rxTools doesn't brick you, being inexperienced and fiddling with things you don't understand well enough does.
Gateway bricks you, because even if you know how to use your DSTwo+ and use it right, you get bricked because GW purposefully included code in their launcher that bricks your 3DS if they detect you are using a clone.
I would say that Supercard is also to blame, because they really should have made their own launcher and their own "DSTwo+ Mode" rather than copy it straight from Gateway without even trying to hide it.

And I really don't think they willfully make it dangerous.

"Users are stupid. It's their own fault if they brick with my software".
Marcan's blog I posted above goes into great depth on why that's a crappy and unethical philosophy for a dev to have.

I agree with you that DS2plus and GW are also unethical in their contributions to bricking. Def no argument there and no surprise coming from folks who profit from warez.

@gudenaurock - I agree it's a good step to be open source because it leaves the door open to improvement, but the dangerous code shouldn't be released in the first place.

 

[Deleted User]

@gamesquest1 I'm sure someone is willing to donate a DSTWO+ to you for science