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Message: <blockquote data-quote="RationalityIsLost101" data-source="post: 8871918" data-attributes="member: 505808">I'm not really working on assumptions. He solicited assistance from a foreign power twice (Ukraine and China) to investigate a political opponent. I'm principled and consistent in that I supported a bipartisan congressional investigation of Biden and spoke of congress having the proper authority to oversee the executive branch. This is from our constitution you so dearly claim to support and accuse the democratic party of not adhering to. When Trump blocks congressional oversight he is in fact not adhering to the constitution yet I see no outrage from you because you work in the premise that the ends of what you desire justify the means. That breeds lawlessness and will unravel our republic. Whether or not you can swallow your pride or hatred for those that hold different political beliefs will determine if you will be willing to at least go read our constitution and reassess your position. If you still hold true to your position would you at least provide logical reasoning from US law or our constitution that would support such a position?  (Have you even read the US constitution in its' entirety within your lifetime? Fun Fact: most registered voters have not, not even speaking for most Americans.)The whole trump is guilty/innocent is something that I think requires context - innocent until proven guilty derives from the legal principle of The Presumption of Innocence. "Under the presumption of innocence, the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_burden_of_proof" target="_blank">legal burden of proof</a> is thus on the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prosecutor" target="_blank">prosecution</a>, which must present compelling evidence to the trier of fact (a judge or a jury). The prosecution must in most cases prove that the accused is <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt_(law)" target="_blank">guilty</a> beyond <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_doubt" target="_blank">reasonable doubt</a>. If reasonable doubt remains, the accused must be <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acquittal" target="_blank">acquitted</a>."This might upset you but this isn't a criminal trial but a political one. Something that enough people aren't appreciating to motivate me to once again restate that yet again. The appearance of impropriety alone is enough for a political impeachment. However, that is at the discretion of the jurors (congressional senators). The House serves as the prosecution which will determine the evidence in which to charge articles of impeachment. During this process they certainly are not subject to any restriction under 'presumption of innocence'."Furthermore, the accused is not obligated to affirmatively prove his innocence or to provide exculpatory evidence. However, to provide counter-evidence or exculpatory evidence is a right that the defense may exercise in order to rebut the charges, which in turn the accusing party bears the burden of disproving"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presumption_of_innocence#cite_note-32" target="_blank">[32]</a>."This quote is to explain why the Bidens' involvement will be allowed to be scrutinized in a senate hearing. If it is claimed to be part of Trump's defense upon his actions then they will be allowed to provide any 'proof' as counter-evidence. I chuckle when I see people think its plain that Biden committed bribery and should be jailed but argue that Trump hasn't attempted anything improper and scream about innocent until proven guilty. I also am amused by logic that states because democrats have insisted multiple impeachable offenses have occurred, but only until this year have committed to an impeachment inquiry that all other potential offenses are invalid or worse that this inquiry into soliciting assistance from a foreign power to investigate a political opponent doesn't matter. They have had hearings the past two weeks where alleged bribery and extortion through witness testimony was presented to the public. I have not seen ANY evidence that vindicates the President. I have seen enough to know that he can be charged for it by the house. The senate will then decide to convict or acquit.I will conclude with this. I intend to keep a discussion that is based on logic. Let us stop with the vitrol, it provides nothing to a substantive discourse on this topic.OFFTOPIC?: I am in complete agreement with Dr. Fiona hill in one aspect that republicans refuse to address due to cowardice or due to an effort to influence domestic politics. We have a president that still believes a Russian birthed narrative that Ukraine was solely behind election interference not the Russian government, that Ukraine gave the dnc server to crowdstrike. I find that a travesty, but no one speaks of it because doing so would show how little judgement is being exercised by the President regarding this matter. Just watch his latest fox -n- friends interview. It is appalling.<a href="https://www.rev.com/blog/donald-trump-fox-and-friends-interview-transcript-trump-interviewed-after-impeachment-hearings" target="_blank">https://www.rev.com/blog/donald-trump-fox-and-friends-interview-transcript-trump-interviewed-after-impeachment-hearings</a>Donald Trump: (<a href="https://www.rev.com/transcript-editor/shared/9rTeFRk6ql3KfvjYnNOhooEtk7gnvWSnqhYaca2qN0YMq3tMQN6PRs8vujFHu3fyT8iR7mUTxf2ovdwkhyPcF0duJJk?loadFrom=PastedDeeplink&ts=362.53" target="_blank">06:02</a>)It’s very interesting. They have the server, right, from the DNC, Democratic National Committee-Brian Kilmeade: (<a href="https://www.rev.com/transcript-editor/shared/9rTeFRk6ql3KfvjYnNOhooEtk7gnvWSnqhYaca2qN0YMq3tMQN6PRs8vujFHu3fyT8iR7mUTxf2ovdwkhyPcF0duJJk?loadFrom=PastedDeeplink&ts=367.9" target="_blank">06:07</a>)Who has the server?Donald Trump: (<a href="https://www.rev.com/transcript-editor/shared/9rTeFRk6ql3KfvjYnNOhooEtk7gnvWSnqhYaca2qN0YMq3tMQN6PRs8vujFHu3fyT8iR7mUTxf2ovdwkhyPcF0duJJk?loadFrom=PastedDeeplink&ts=369.3" target="_blank">06:09</a>)The FBI went in and they told them, “Get out of here. We’re not giving it to you.” They gave the server to CrowdStrike or whatever it’s called, which is a company owned by a very wealthy Ukrainian. And I still want to see that server. The FBI has never gotten that server. That’s a big part of this whole thing. Why did they give it to a Ukrainian company? Why-Steve Doocy: (<a href="https://www.rev.com/transcript-editor/shared/9rTeFRk6ql3KfvjYnNOhooEtk7gnvWSnqhYaca2qN0YMq3tMQN6PRs8vujFHu3fyT8iR7mUTxf2ovdwkhyPcF0duJJk?loadFrom=PastedDeeplink&ts=391.57" target="_blank">06:31</a>)Are you sure they did that? Are you sure they gave it to Ukraine?Donald Trump: (<a href="https://www.rev.com/transcript-editor/shared/9rTeFRk6ql3KfvjYnNOhooEtk7gnvWSnqhYaca2qN0YMq3tMQN6PRs8vujFHu3fyT8iR7mUTxf2ovdwkhyPcF0duJJk?loadFrom=PastedDeeplink&ts=395.09" target="_blank">06:35</a>)Well, that’s what the word is. That’s what I asked, actually, in my phone call if you know. I mean, I asked it very point blank because we’re looking for corruption. There’s tremendous corruption we’re looking for. Why should we be giving hundreds of millions of dollars to countries when there’s this kind of corruption? When you look at my call, I said corruption … I think he said it to me. He’s looking. He got elected on the basis of corruption. And I also, by the way, going back to that, why isn’t Germany putting up money? Why isn’t France putting up money? All the European nations, why aren’t they putting up? You have the European Union, and they’re benefited a lot more by the Ukraine than we are.TLDR: Our president is either a fool or a liar. You pick. July 25th call nor the first call on April 12th have the word corruption in it. His own words Trump is looking for 'corruption' of a political opponent and he's asked Ukraine and China to investigate Biden on the south lawn in front of reporters. It is the only corruption he is looking for per his own words to Zelensky and is the reason he resisted giving the aid. He is his own worst enemy, trailing closely by only his own lawyer. Ah the best people.</blockquote>

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