Hacking WBFS for Wii U, is it a thing?

[emmanu888]

Do people still even use WBFS to this day? Use FAT32 or NTFS instead.

 

[nikeymikey]

Game images in WBFS format are contiguous...

<....................................................HARD DISK............................................................>
<Game1><Game2><Game3><Game4><Game5><Game6><Game7><Game8>

If all the games were the same size that would be fine but they are not so if you decide to delete game 3 and add a different game, if the new game was larger than game 3 was it wouldn't fit.

After a while you end up with blocks of unused space that can't be used by any new game and you have to reformat it and recopy everything to regain space.

WBFS doesn't allow for folders as it isn't a real file system - it is simply a layout for how games are stored contiguously on a hard disk.

Yes this is exactly what I meant when I said wbfs was flawed.

 

[Dungeonseeker]

I will never understand why people want worse versions of things to be developed when better things exist

I'm confused as to what better solution currently exists on Wii U exactly? SSD?

Ftr I wasn't asking for WBFS support per se, just if anyone was working on decrypting the Wii U FS and/or bringing HDD support (in the same way it works for Wii) to the Wii U.

 

[Cyan]

WBFS allows file fragmentation, it doesn't run out of space at all.
you could install any files to it, but only USBLoaders read that format, so it's not "gamecube games don't work on it", but more "gamecube loaders are not developed to read that format".

The issue of WBFS was :
- not recognized on a computer, you have to use a Manager.
- There were a library developed (I think for Linux!) to make the drive compatible and make it a normal mountable storage device.
- There's no folder, the format is not intended as file management, it was developed as a vector (array) of games, to be accessed by a loader. it never have been developped as a way to put anything else than Wii games on it. no gamecube, no picture, or any other files.
- The game table is based on the sector size, old HDD allowed only 500 games (512bytes/sector -12 byte header), new hdd allows up to 4084 wii games (4096 byte/sectors -12 byte headers). a new format was developed later to make a "fake" 4096 header on 512bytes/sector drives, so that limit is not relevant anymore.

- Some first released libraries had a bug and marked some "cluster" (being fragmented, it's using a list of used blocs per game) for games still on the drive as "being free to use by another installed game". THIS is the biggest issue of that format, the library used to manage its content, not really the format itself.

The result is that lot of users don't even know their drive and their games are already corrupted. it plays, but one day, inside one game, you can have crashes because the cluster is from another game than the expected one!


FAT32 and NTFS have both better way to manage the used sectors, with CRC and checks and error correction. thing that WBFS format doesn't have, making it more easily corrupted.
Using a "one WBFS partition per game" image file became the norm to use FAT32/NTFS/ext error correction and safest format to keep that "wbfs partition" from being corrupted when adding games. one game per WBFS, no more issue when adding a game to the WBFS partition. We still could put more games in a single .wbfs file, but nobody tried to request that (hopefully).


The format didn't have only defaults, it also had benefits, like the cluster size, it was big enough to not fragment a lot, making defrag unneeded, making the drive fast to load games.
it's irrelevant when stored as a .wbfs file on another partition type, as one "wbfs cluster" can be span over multiple split "host cluster" (FAT32, NTFS, etc.).
Some games with too many "host fragment" could have issues, keep your drive less fragmented.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

Possibly, I have no idea. I've had no issues personally and not having a "format" pop up everytime I start the Wii U is great.
A wbfs formatted drive with wbfs manager works with usb loader gx fine in my experience, but I stress that's just me, I'm not claiming it to be superior only that it bypasses the format prompt on wii u.

WBFS Manager is known to corrupt games. At least use Wii Backup Manager.
As for the format prompt, you can get rid of that with uStealth without resorting to using the inferior WBFS partition.

 

[cinhomartins]

WBFS allows file fragmentation, it doesn't run out of space at all.
you could install any files to it, but only USBLoaders read that format, so it's not "gamecube games don't work on it", but more "gamecube loaders are not developed to read that format".

The issue of WBFS was :
- not recognized on a computer, you have to use a Manager.
- There were a library developed (I think for Linux!) to make the drive compatible and make it a normal storage device.
- There's no folder, the format is not intended as file management, it was developed as a vector (array) of games, to be accessed by a loader. it never have been developped as a way to put anything else than Wii games on it. no gamecube, no picture, or any other files.
- The game table is based on the sector size, old HDD allowed only 500 games (512bytes/sector -12 byte header), new hdd allows up to 4084 wii games (4096 byte/sectors -12 byte headers). a new format was developed later to make a "fake" 4096 header on 512bytes/sector drives, so that limit is not relevant anymore.

- Some first released libraries had a bug and marked some "cluster" (being fragmented, it's using a list of used blocs per game) for games still on the drive as "being free to use by another installed game". THIS is the biggest issue of that format, the library used to manage its content, not really the format itself.

The result is that lot of users don't even know their drive and their games are already corrupted. it plays, but one day, inside one game, you can have crashes because the cluster is from another game than the expected one!


FAT32 and NTFS have both better way to manage the used sectors, with CRC and checks and error correction. thing that WBFS format doesn't have, making it more easily corrupted.
Using a "one WBFS partition per game" image file became the norm to use FAT32/NTFS/ext error correction and safest format to keep that "wbfs partition" from being corrupted when adding games. one game per WBFS, no more issue when adding a game to the WBFS partition. We still could put more games in a single .wbfs file, but nobody tried to request that (hopefully).


The format didn't have only defaults, it also had benefits, like the cluster size, it was big enough to not fragment a lot, making defrag unneeded, making the drive fast to load games.
it's irrelevant when stored as a .wbfs file on another partition type, as one "wbfs cluster" can be span over multiple split "host cluster" (FAT32, NTFS, etc.).
Some games with too many "host fragment" could have issues, keep your drive less fragmented.

Thanks for shedding light on the matter Cyan!

Enviado de meu ASUS_Z00AD usando Tapatalk

 

[Risingdawn]

WBFS Manager is known to corrupt games. At least use Wii Backup Manager.
As for the format prompt, you can get rid of that with uStealth without resorting to using the inferior WBFS partition.

I haven't added a game to that drive for years, I've had zero problem's so what's the point imo. Like I said I never claimed wbfs was superior at all just that for me personally it was simpler to add large games, didn't trigger a prompt, didn't need ustealth, games were smaller and once my games were on that was it done and dusted.
I've only even touched the drive to remove it for wup installer.

 

[Cyan]

I just want to add (for other users) that formatting to WBFS to not see the format prompt will work only if you format the drive without partition table.
if you make a partition table, and use wii backup manager to add games to it (it relies on partition letters) then you will still have the format prompt, and will still find Ustealth useful.

formatting to WBFS is not a fix for the format message, it's more because users already had HDD in that format from the beginning USB Loader's day, and it happen to not trigger the prompt, they just kept it like that (I also have a WBFS hdd, I'm happy with it).
if you have the prompt and want to hide it, use Ustealth.
if you don't have the prompt (whatever the reason), keep your drive the way it is.

 

[Alanoide97]

if you have too much space because you only want a few games, take a USB stick instead ? ^^

On a side note, please, don't use thumb drives, my Wii U killed two of mine, way too much write cycles it seems

Edit: To give an alternative if money is really the problem. I'm using a 5 thousand something rpm IDE 150gb drive with an external adaptor. Difference in loading times between this drive and nand are negligible ( 1-3 seconds )

 

[bostonBC]

WBFS allows file fragmentation, it doesn't run out of space at all.
you could install any files to it, but only USBLoaders read that format, so it's not "gamecube games don't work on it", but more "gamecube loaders are not developed to read that format".

The issue of WBFS was :
- not recognized on a computer, you have to use a Manager.
- There were a library developed (I think for Linux!) to make the drive compatible and make it a normal mountable storage device.
- There's no folder, the format is not intended as file management, it was developed as a vector (array) of games, to be accessed by a loader. it never have been developped as a way to put anything else than Wii games on it. no gamecube, no picture, or any other files.
- The game table is based on the sector size, old HDD allowed only 500 games (512bytes/sector -12 byte header), new hdd allows up to 4084 wii games (4096 byte/sectors -12 byte headers). a new format was developed later to make a "fake" 4096 header on 512bytes/sector drives, so that limit is not relevant anymore.

- Some first released libraries had a bug and marked some "cluster" (being fragmented, it's using a list of used blocs per game) for games still on the drive as "being free to use by another installed game". THIS is the biggest issue of that format, the library used to manage its content, not really the format itself.

The result is that lot of users don't even know their drive and their games are already corrupted. it plays, but one day, inside one game, you can have crashes because the cluster is from another game than the expected one!


FAT32 and NTFS have both better way to manage the used sectors, with CRC and checks and error correction. thing that WBFS format doesn't have, making it more easily corrupted.
Using a "one WBFS partition per game" image file became the norm to use FAT32/NTFS/ext error correction and safest format to keep that "wbfs partition" from being corrupted when adding games. one game per WBFS, no more issue when adding a game to the WBFS partition. We still could put more games in a single .wbfs file, but nobody tried to request that (hopefully).


The format didn't have only defaults, it also had benefits, like the cluster size, it was big enough to not fragment a lot, making defrag unneeded, making the drive fast to load games.
it's irrelevant when stored as a .wbfs file on another partition type, as one "wbfs cluster" can be span over multiple split "host cluster" (FAT32, NTFS, etc.).
Some games with too many "host fragment" could have issues, keep your drive less fragmented.

Thanks and I could have sworn it didn't allow fragments but I stopped using it years ago and went to a single FAT32 partition which everything seems to play with much better.

 

[NWPlayer123]

I've mentioned before, if you can get your SEEPROM and OTP, you have the USB seed and key to decrypt and encrypt your external drives
1) Encrypt the SEEPROM seed with the USB key from the OTP (same for all Wii U, seed is regenerated every system format)
2) Use AES-128-ECB -nosalt -nopad, only tried with openssl, should give you the encrypted seed which is now your decryption/encryption key for your drives
3) Use that key to decrypt a chunk or all of the drive, AES-128-CBC with an IV of 0, looks like chunks are 0x200 bytes