Logic behind Christianity?

[quote name='mcp2' post='3769365' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:10 PM'][quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3769205' date='Jul 11 2011, 09:47 PM']Indeed, and one must ask the necessity of an idea which imaginarily explains something we do not know yet. (Again, there is no actual difference between what we do not know and what we "cannot" know, because we do not know whether or not we cannot know it.")

The most perfectly honest thing we can do as human beings is to say, "We don't know.". That is the intellectual, scientific thing to do. Those that fail to do so sacrifice their human curiosity in the name of faith.[/quote]

Strong tripe. You've wrapped your warped ideas in the most convoluted way possible. Have you ever read any religious books? Religious people don't know everything either, they do say "We don't know". Of course everything isn't known. To go as far as to say it's the "intellectualy scientific thing to do" and not give a reason is even worse than these religious arguments. Oh and the Venus Project is utter shit, stopped reading at "Earth has plentiful resources" and it doesn't even take into account the other uses of money apart from it being a system of barter such as a method of controlling demand and supply via various means (detached from it's bartering value).
[/quote]

Let us take this apart, bit by bit, shall we?

"You've wrapped your warped ideas in the most convoluted way possible."

Convoluted? The basic worldview of saying, "I don't know, but maybe one day I will know", is the simplest way of looking at the world I can think of, perhaps outside of "Big Rock".

"Have you ever read any religious books?"

The Bible. All of it. I was raised to be a priest, but I guess you didn't read my first post.

"Religious people don't know everything either, they do say 'We don't know'."

You missed the entire point of it. If a person is religious, then they are looking at the basis of their worldview with a huge, huge, "I know". Their worldview is predetermined by their religion, and more importantly, their faith. If a Christian has faith in the Bible, for example, then they are definitely not saying "I don't know" about the beginning the Earth. It is predetermined for them by Genesis 1:1. The idea is to say, "I don't know" about even the basis of life, the things which have not yet been reached by science. Not just some things to concede to science, all of it. If you fail to, you are less of a scientist for it, at the core level, no less.

"To go as far as to say it's the "intellectualy scientific thing to do" and not give a reason is even worse than these religious arguments."

You didn't read any of it, did you? Any of my previous posts? I gave a very distinct reason, several, in fact.

"Oh and the Venus Project is utter shit, stopped reading at "Earth has plentiful resources" and it doesn't even take into account the other uses of money apart from it being a system of barter such as a method of controlling demand and supply via various means (detached from it's bartering value)."

1. This is off-topic.

2. You didn't read? Nothing to discuss, aside from the fact that you totally missed that all barter would be eliminated thanks to the advent of cybernetic production technology. But I won't bore you with such things; your attention span clearly does not allow you to read it.

[quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Withhout Christ there is nothing.[/quote]

Meaningless, though worthy of a Christian bumper sticker.

[quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3769412' date='Jul 11 2011, 05:33 PM'][quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Withhout Christ there is nothing.[/quote]

Meaningless, though worthy of a Christian bumper sticker.
[/quote]
Only to the blind eye, which you have maybe two.

[quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 06:31 PM']Christmas= Christ Jesus[/quote]

What would we have without Christ?

Saturnalia.

[quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 06:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Without Christ there is nothing.[/quote]
Actually Christmas wasn't a Christen holiday. And in fact Jesus has nothing to do with Christmas.

[quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Without Christ there is nothing.[/quote]

Apparently people who don't spell Christian with the phrase 'Christ' in the word for another language are all nothing?

Especially considering the originality of the idea of Christian didn't have 'Christ' in the name, the only thing you are showing is that all the above are man made ideas.

[quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769417' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:35 PM'][quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3769412' date='Jul 11 2011, 05:33 PM'][quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Withhout Christ there is nothing.[/quote]

Meaningless, though worthy of a Christian bumper sticker.
[/quote]
Only to the blind eye, which you have maybe two.
[/quote]

....You tried to use semantics and language to prove that christ is somehow essential.

Oh, and not to mention that you apparently haven't been reading any of this thread, or else you would have known that I was discussing faith as blindness, even if it's only partial.

Christmas is a pagan holiday but I don't understand how that even relates to anything.

[quote name='Magmorph' post='3769452' date='Jul 11 2011, 07:04 PM']Christmas is a pagan holiday but I don't understand how that even relates to anything.[/quote]
I guess he's trying to say that because "Christ" happens to be those things it's some how makes them more important or something...honestly I have no idea what that guys is getting at.

Why can we never have nice things.

[quote name='cwstjdenobs' post='3769465' date='Jul 12 2011, 12:18 AM']Why can we never have nice things.[/quote]

If we lived in a world where everything was nice, we would never learn our weaknesses

[quote name='Zetta_x' post='3769469' date='Jul 11 2011, 03:32 PM'][quote name='cwstjdenobs' post='3769465' date='Jul 12 2011, 12:18 AM']Why can we never have nice things.[/quote]

If we lived in a world where everything was nice, we would never learn our weaknesses
[/quote]

If we lived in a world where everything was nice, wouldn't we not have weaknesses?
I think it'd be nice not to have weaknesses.

[quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3768954' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:20 AM']...You know, it's really not cool to be ignored. Particularly after I wrote all that about faith being contradictory to human essence and progress. Yeah, I wish people would actually read my stuff.

Sheesh.[/quote]
lol nice. Tell me where it is and I'll read it.

[quote name='impizkit' post='3768972' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:26 AM']You experienced this and still dont believe? That is something. I have had several experiences where I should have died, no explanation why I didn't accept it wasn't my time and God wanted me to live. If I wasn't a strong believer before(I was) then my close encounters strengthened my belief. And I dont believe if religion or follow a religion. I believe that the bible is telling truths, or stories to explain the truth. There is a God, as far as Im concerned.

This will get long, so dont read if you dont want to hear a testimony(I strongly suggest you do):[/quote]So are all other lives meaningless? People that die as babies or toddlers, are they just wastes of space? I don't understand how you think you have a greater reason to be alive over another person, whoever it may be.

So...throughout the entire accident you say, "any one could survive it," but what really made you believe is the fact that you had a Bible in your trunk? What the fuck?

[quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3769205' date='Jul 11 2011, 04:47 PM'][quote name='Magmorph' post='3769170' date='Jul 11 2011, 09:26 PM'][quote name='Foxi4' post='3769161' date='Jul 11 2011, 02:22 PM']Heh, the point I'm clumsily trying to get across to you is that you cannot prove or disprove some theories because it's humanly impossible to do so, not now and not ever. You can't "die" and "come back a few days later" retaining memories of the process, you can't "find" a spirit because it's not in the mortal plane, you can't prove that there is no God, much like religious people can't prove that there is one. Those are "abstract" theories, they're uncompatible with experimenting.[/quote]
A theory that is not refutable is not a theory at all. A scientific theory has to be refutable or it is nothing more than an idea.
[/quote]

Indeed, and one must ask the necessity of an idea which imaginarily explains something we do not know yet. (Again, there is no actual difference between what we do not know and what we "cannot" know, because we do not know whether or not we cannot know it.")

The most perfectly honest thing we can do as human beings is to say, "We don't know.". That is the intellectual, scientific thing to do. Those that fail to do so sacrifice their human curiosity in the name of faith.
[/quote]
What is wrong with admitting you don't know something but thinking that a certain theory makes sense? And thus believing it's the one. And thus having faith in it?

[quote name='Pyrmon' post='3769650' date='Jul 12 2011, 03:27 AM'][quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3769205' date='Jul 11 2011, 04:47 PM'][quote name='Magmorph' post='3769170' date='Jul 11 2011, 09:26 PM'][quote name='Foxi4' post='3769161' date='Jul 11 2011, 02:22 PM']Heh, the point I'm clumsily trying to get across to you is that you cannot prove or disprove some theories because it's humanly impossible to do so, not now and not ever. You can't "die" and "come back a few days later" retaining memories of the process, you can't "find" a spirit because it's not in the mortal plane, you can't prove that there is no God, much like religious people can't prove that there is one. Those are "abstract" theories, they're uncompatible with experimenting.[/quote]
A theory that is not refutable is not a theory at all. A scientific theory has to be refutable or it is nothing more than an idea.
[/quote]

Indeed, and one must ask the necessity of an idea which imaginarily explains something we do not know yet. (Again, there is no actual difference between what we do not know and what we "cannot" know, because we do not know whether or not we cannot know it.")

The most perfectly honest thing we can do as human beings is to say, "We don't know.". That is the intellectual, scientific thing to do. Those that fail to do so sacrifice their human curiosity in the name of faith.
[/quote]
What is wrong with admitting you don't know something but thinking that a certain theory makes sense? And thus believing it's the one. And thus having faith in it?
[/quote]

It isn't a theory if it isn't based on scientific testing, trial and error. When you simply believe something to be true without any foundation, you reach outside your finite perception of the world and into the realm of imagination. Nothing wrong with that, I suppose, it's just that you'll be a little more blind.

There's a rather sizable difference between saying "I don't know", and saying, "I don't know, but this story this person told me this one time makes sense, so I'm going to have unshakable faith in it, because it requires me to.".

[quote name='Uncle FEFL' post='3769527' date='Jul 12 2011, 01:40 AM'][quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3768954' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:20 AM']...You know, it's really not cool to be ignored. Particularly after I wrote all that about faith being contradictory to human essence and progress. Yeah, I wish people would actually read my stuff.

Sheesh.[/quote]
lol nice. Tell me where it is and I'll read it.
[/quote]

A few pages back, man. Just keep looking until you see a big one.

[quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3768954' date='Jul 11 2011, 02:20 PM']...You know, it's really not cool to be ignored. Particularly after I wrote all that about faith being contradictory to human essence and progress. Yeah, I wish people would actually read my stuff.

Sheesh.[/quote]
I myself was ignored as well, but seeing that everyone here is having a deep conversation, I don't see why not. I myself have read your post, and have also actually copy+pasta'd it into a text document for future arguments and/or conversation. I actually find your posts quite interesting myself.

I'll just toss this out there for people:

I am the second coming of Christ. Because of faith, you have to believe me, or burn in hell. I have no proof, nor reason to be that, I just am.

Do you a believe me? If not, then I just proved that you following Christianity as pointless as well, because you don't have faith that I am the second coming of Christ. Why would you believe someone from over 2000 years ago who spread Christianity around? In a time where they didn't even know the world is a sphere? You can't really say "faith", because you don't have the "faith" do believe me.

There are certain signs that will preceed the Second Comming. Not only that, you should probably be a bit more modest if you want to impersonate the Christ. Sorry lad/lady, but as of now, you're full of "it".

[quote name='Hikaru' post='3769676' date='Jul 12 2011, 03:50 AM'][quote name='Wolvenreign' post='3768954' date='Jul 11 2011, 02:20 PM']...You know, it's really not cool to be ignored. Particularly after I wrote all that about faith being contradictory to human essence and progress. Yeah, I wish people would actually read my stuff.

Sheesh.[/quote]
I myself was ignored as well, but seeing that everyone here is having a deep conversation, I don't see why not. I myself have read your post, and have also actually copy+pasta'd it into a text document for future arguments and/or conversation. I actually find your posts quite interesting myself.
[/quote]

Why thank you, my dear. I am glad to have my arguments redistributed.

[quote name='A Gay Little Catboy' post='3769424' date='Jul 11 2011, 11:45 PM'][quote name='P-CHYLD' post='3769407' date='Jul 11 2011, 06:31 PM']Christian= Christ Jesus
Christian= Christmas= Christ Jesus
The word Christ is the key.
Without Christ there is nothing.[/quote]
Actually Christmas wasn't a Christen holiday. And in fact Jesus has nothing to do with Christmas.
[/quote]
I was about to go and point that out; you beat me to it.

[quote name='shinkukage09' post='3769689' date='Jul 12 2011, 04:01 AM']I'll just toss this out there for people:

I am the second coming of Christ. Because of faith, you have to believe me, or burn in hell. I have no proof, nor reason to be that, I just am.

Do you a believe me? If not, then I just proved that you following Christianity as pointless as well, because you don't have faith that I am the second coming of Christ. Why would you believe someone from over 2000 years ago who spread Christianity around? In a time where they didn't even know the world is a sphere? You can't really say "faith", because you don't have the "faith" do believe me.[/quote]
That's massively flawed.
For one thing, Jesus isn't even coming back to Earth.