Nintendo on Switch dev kits, and development info

jt_1258 · Feb 19, 2017

Foxi4 said:
Sure, it's everybody's fault but Nintendo's. Wait, what are the Switch's key launch window titles? Zelda BotW and Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, two Wii U games? Okay.

2 Wii U games...being sold on a console that hasn't had it's death certificate signed yet.
Edit: They never got a chance to sell well at all on Wii U and never will with production for it having ended. Nintendo wants to give them another chance on a new system that isn't plagued by it's past.

Foxi4 · Feb 20, 2017

jt_1258 said:
2 Wii U games...being sold on a console that hasn't had it's death certificate signed yet.
Edit: They never got a chance to sell well at all on Wii U and never will with production for it having ended. Nintendo wants to give them another chance on a new system that isn't plagued by it's past.

So it's okay when Nintendo populates their systems with ports and remasters, but everybody else is a cheat and a scumbag if they do the same thing? Skyrim didn't get to sell on the Wii or Wii U either since it was never released for them, should we then blame third-party devs for re-releasing games into a previously untapped target audience? Your argument is rife with contradiction - either you want to give games a chance or you want original titles.

jt_1258 · Feb 20, 2017

Foxi4 said:
So it's okay when Nintendo populates their systems with ports and remasters, but everybody else is a cheat and a scumbag if they do the same thing? Skyrim didn't get to sell on the Wii or Wii U either since it was never released for them, should we then blame third-party devs for re-releasing games into a previously untapped target audience? Your argument is rife with contradiction - either you want to give games a chance or you want original titles.

Skyrim is a different story, it had a chance on other systems and did well. Mario kart 8 was only released on one system, a dead one. I choose to look on the up side that most are new games. At least it is a lot less and more with reason then 3rd party's. How difficult this is to word, I'm sorry for my waste of your time. I wasn't trying to attack 3rd partys it's just.... I am a bit scared about continuing this because this seems to be escalating into a heated argument, let's pleas try to shift closer to a calmer discussion.
Edit: I will likely revise this comment, I was a bit off with my repsonse

Shawnj · Feb 20, 2017

The Switch having its own OS shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is- the DSi and the Wii both have its own OS.

Also, that emulator WILL get leaked. It's inevitable.

jt_1258 · Feb 20, 2017

Shawnj said:
The Switch having its own OS shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is- the DSi and the Wii both have its own OS.

Also, that emulator WILL get leaked. It's inevitable.

That will be so awesome playing with the extra bits ya get goin through an emulator(save states, fast forward, ect.)

Foxi4 · Feb 20, 2017

jt_1258 said:
Skyrim is a different story, it had a chance on other systems and did well. Mario kart 8 was only released on one system, a dead one. I choose to look on the up side that most are new games. At least it is a lot less and more with reason then 3rd party's. How difficult this is to word, I'm sorry for my waste of your time. I wasn't trying to attack 3rd partys it's just.... I am a bit scared about continuing this because this seems to be escalating into a heated argument, let's pleas try to shift closer to a calmer discussion.
Edit: I will likely revise this comment, I was a bit off with my repsonse

What does it matter that it did well on other systems? It was never released on a Nintendo platform, so most Nintendo gamers never got to play it. You're looking at this from a Temper perspective - we pride ourselves on owning multiple systems because we're gaming fanatics - that's why we spend time talking about games and consoles rather than just playing them. Typical customer bases aren't like that, and they're extremely insular. Most people own one system, that's it. If the game wasn't on that system, they simply never got to play it. Even owning a console and a gaming-capable PC is relatively rare - these days people own low-power computers for browsing the web and basic office tasks, and that's about it.

TotalInsanity4 · Feb 20, 2017

Shawnj said:
The Switch having its own OS shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is- the DSi and the Wii both have its own OS.

Also, that emulator WILL get leaked. It's inevitable.

Actually the Wii didn't have an OS so much as a launcher, once you launch a title the home menu isn't loaded anymore. I'm fairly certain the same is true with the DSi

Shawnj · Feb 20, 2017

TotalInsanity4 said:
Actually the Wii didn't have an OS so much as a launcher, once you launch a title the home menu isn't loaded anymore. I'm fairly certain the same is true with the DSi

Even if the Wii and the DSi didn't have one, the 3DS certainly does, and it's been around for 6 years. The Wii U arguably also has an OS.

Captain_N · Feb 20, 2017

Foxi4 said:
Sure, it's everybody's fault but Nintendo's. Wait, what are the Switch's key launch window titles? Zelda BotW and Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, two Wii U games? Okay.

I never said it wasn't Nintendo's fault they fumbled the ball also. At least they put exclusives. I just have a thing with whiny little 3rd parties that complain but never even tried. any new game that came out on ps3 and 360 would obviously run on the wii u. None of those new games came to the wii u celpt for cod ghosts, assassins creed 4,watch dogs and of course just dance. rayman was a wii u exclusive but ubi got salty that their crappy ports did not sell . The wii U is a step up from ps3/360.

New exclusives needed to be on the wiiu not their crappy ports. People were not going to buy a wii u when the games are on the other consoles. Do you think if all the new games were on both 360/ps3 and xbox one/ps4 would the xbox one /ps4 sales would better? people bought the new consoles when they knew that only the new consoles were getting those new games that are only on those consoles. What if the vita only had what the 3ds has. then vita would be on top of handheld. My point it the 3rd parties were never going to support the wii u. they just needed to say that and man up. Their E-Penises are to large for them to be bothered with Nintendo. If the switch sells well watch them all flop back like a fly to shit.

geodeath · Feb 20, 2017

Clydefrosch said:
and people will keep on complaining about lack of 3rd party anyway

Yes, until *real* 3rd party support comes in, as we expect it in 2017. Indies and the jap stuff are fine, but Nintendo needs all the help it can get from the west. Then we will all calm down and be happy about N's future.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Clydefrosch said:
yeah, they did say all that. and then people didn't believe it and didn't buy the console.
so the 3rd parties abandoned ship.

they would've come back if people had just bought the damn console, just like they came back on the 3ds. but people didn't and that was the end of that console.

and it'll potentially be the end of the switch too. its really all in the early adopters hand.

And this is exactly why, every new console needs constant excitement and hype. Nintendo hyped up for the WiiU launch, only to fall back to radio silence not a month later. The lack of software was the number 1 reason people did not buy the WiiU. Software takes years to develop now, so devs cannot just wait until a console is successful to jump ship to it, they start developing long before it is even in dev kit form, according to initial specs. Which really translates to Nintendo not building the right relationships during the WiiU development. If they did the same mistake with the Switch and they are waiting FIRST to sell, then for devs to approach them themselves, this will fail even faster than the WiiU. There is a reason you see all the big announcements at Sony and MS press conferences. They have to show the big players are on ship, then everybody is relaxed to invest in the platform. When your worldwide reveal only has Dance Dance from Ubisoft rather than another of their roster... People are going to be sceptical and it is *not* the early adopter's problem to solve.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Captain_N said:
I never said it wasn't Nintendo's fault they fumbled the ball also. At least they put exclusives. I just have a thing with whiny little 3rd parties that complain but never even tried. any new game that came out on ps3 and 360 would obviously run on the wii u. None of those new games came to the wii u celpt for cod ghosts, assassins creed 4,watch dogs and of course just dance. rayman was a wii u exclusive but ubi got salty that their crappy ports did not sell . The wii U is a step up from ps3/360.

New exclusives needed to be on the wiiu not their crappy ports. People were not going to buy a wii u when the games are on the other consoles. Do you think if all the new games were on both 360/ps3 and xbox one/ps4 would the xbox one /ps4 sales would better? people bought the new consoles when they knew that only the new consoles were getting those new games that are only on those consoles. What if the vita only had what the 3ds has. then vita would be on top of handheld. My point it the 3rd parties were never going to support the wii u. they just needed to say that and man up. Their E-Penises are to large for them to be bothered with Nintendo. If the switch sells well watch them all flop back like a fly to shit.

Nintendo is to blame for the bad relationship with the 3rd parties. Yes, they can be scum, but they ARE THE DEVS nonetheless. So you either cosy up to them while still offering your first party stuff or you slowly watch your console die. Nintendo needs to convince 3rd parties of the west to port the *current* stuff to it, *if* at all possible of course.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Foxi4 said:
Would they? Both the XBO and the PS4 are about 5 times beefier in the graphics department and *they're sweating bullets* rendering AAA titles at 1080p 30FPS, what chance do you think the Wii U had to run those games at acceptable quality and performance? People underestimate the specs gap between the Wii U and other current gens when in fact it's just as wide as the gap between the Wii and the PS3/360. You can't develop for a system that can't run your games - the Wii U would've gotten some COD and FIFA games, since those can run on a toaster - that's it. If you think it could run Battlefield 1, I've got some bad news.

I am still laughing every time somebody compares the Switch to the current console gen specs, thinking that excitement alone will drive the console's success. The even funnier thing is that with just a little bit of logic, everybody can understand that if the Switch is selling at a *more expensive* if not equal price to the ps4 slim, with all the added stuff and R&D they threw into it (that costs money), it is obviously less powerful. Everything comes at a cost and making the switch portable & home compatible, means that cost needs to be cut (as well as power) and all this cut money goes towards the mobile/motion controls innovation. So, we should not really consider the Switch a £280 console when played mainly at home, but really a £150-200 one, as without all the mobile innovation, if you only were able to buy a black switch box with no screen or other stuff, that would probably be the price of the hardware.

Now, exactly how somebody thinks a £150-200 hardware (1st gen too - more expensive) compares to a £250 second revision one is lunacy at it's finest. Yet people still dream of UE4 full spec games.

TotalInsanity4 · Feb 20, 2017

Shawnj said:
Even if the Wii and the DSi didn't have one, the 3DS certainly does, and it's been around for 6 years. The Wii U arguably also has an OS.

I do agree there. I think the reason that everyone's so excited about this one is that it's snappy and relatively seamless, as opposed to the Wii U's and 3DS's, which, for instance, force the menu to completely reload every time you exit settings

Foxi4 · Feb 20, 2017

geodeath said:
Yes, until *real* 3rd party support comes in, as we expect it in 2017. Indies and the jap stuff are fine, but Nintendo needs all the help it can get from the west. Then we will all calm down and be happy about N's future.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

And this is exactly why, every new console needs constant excitement and hype. Nintendo hyped up for the WiiU launch, only to fall back to radio silence not a month later. The lack of software was the number 1 reason people did not buy the WiiU. Software takes years to develop now, so devs cannot just wait until a console is successful to jump ship to it, they start developing long before it is even in dev kit form, according to initial specs. Which really translates to Nintendo not building the right relationships during the WiiU development. If they did the same mistake with the Switch and they are waiting FIRST to sell, then for devs to approach them themselves, this will fail even faster than the WiiU. There is a reason you see all the big announcements at Sony and MS press conferences. They have to show the big players are on ship, then everybody is relaxed to invest in the platform. When your worldwide reveal only has Dance Dance from Ubisoft rather than another of their roster... People are going to be sceptical and it is *not* the early adopter's problem to solve.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Nintendo is to blame for the bad relationship with the 3rd parties. Yes, they can be scum, but they ARE THE DEVS nonetheless. So you either cosy up to them while still offering your first party stuff or you slowly watch your console die. Nintendo needs to convince 3rd parties of the west to port the *current* stuff to it, *if* at all possible of course.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

I am still laughing every time somebody compares the Switch to the current console gen specs, thinking that excitement alone will drive the console's success. The even funnier thing is that with just a little bit of logic, everybody can understand that if the Switch is selling at a *more expensive* if not equal price to the ps4 slim, with all the added stuff and R&D they threw into it (that costs money), it is obviously less powerful. Everything comes at a cost and making the switch portable & home compatible, means that cost needs to be cut (as well as power) and all this cut money goes towards the mobile/motion controls innovation. So, we should not really consider the Switch a £280 console when played mainly at home, but really a £150-200 one, as without all the mobile innovation, if you only were able to buy a black switch box with no screen or other stuff, that would probably be the price of the hardware.

Now, exactly how somebody thinks a £150-200 hardware (1st gen too - more expensive) compares to a £250 second revision one is lunacy at it's finest. Yet people still dream of UE4 full spec games.

Why shouldn't I consider the Switch a 280 quid console if that's the price tag? The PS4 sells at 249 quid and comes with a game in the box, it's tough to compete with that. As for computing power, just switching from Maxwell to Pascal would give the Switch a 30% boost in compute power at minimal extra cost, and not bundling it with a game is a huge mistake. Nintendo should at least throw in
1-2-Switch with the console, the fact that there are no game bundle SKU's is what I call lunacy. I fully understand that the screen costs money, but they could remedy that by adding games to the package, and since they're made in-house, they come at a negligible cost. Not only that, the system isn't ready for release - it should be pushed out during the holiday season when all the key titles are available, right now there's almost no content available Day 1. The whole Switch release is one big trainwreck.

jt_1258 · Feb 20, 2017

Foxi4 said:
What does it matter that it did well on other systems? It was never released on a Nintendo platform, so most Nintendo gamers never got to play it. You're looking at this from a Temper perspective - we pride ourselves on owning multiple systems because we're gaming fanatics - that's why we spend time talking about games and consoles rather than just playing them. Typical customer bases aren't like that, and they're extremely insular. Most people own one system, that's it. If the game wasn't on that system, they simply never got to play it. Even owning a console and a gaming-capable PC is relatively rare - these days people own low-power computers for browsing the web and basic office tasks, and that's about it.

I only have a 2ds, a Wii, and decent computer for gaming, soon I will get the switch. I am one of the people who are happy to get skyrim on the switch despite owning it on pc, I am a gamer who loves playing my games anywhere, anytime, I rarely touch my pc despite it being a more capable system then my 2ds is with there even being a rough emulator for it.

geodeath · Feb 21, 2017

Foxi4 said:
Why shouldn't I consider the Switch a 280 quid console if that's the price tag? The PS4 sells at 249 quid and comes with a game in the box, it's tough to compete with that. As for computing power, just switching from Maxwell to Pascal would give the Switch a 30% boost in compute power at minimal extra cost, and not bundling it with a game is a huge mistake. Nintendo should at least throw in
1-2-Switch with the console, the fact that there are no game bundle SKU's is what I call lunacy. I fully understand that the screen costs money, but they could remedy that by adding games to the package, and since they're made in-house, they come at a negligible cost. Not only that, the system isn't ready for release - it should be pushed out during the holiday season when all the key titles are available, right now there's almost no content available Day 1. The whole Switch release is one big trainwreck.

I am not saying it is wrong or right to think of the Switch as a £280 console, all i was trying to get across is that people look at the price tag and expect it to match the other systems simply because the price is up there. Dream on folks. UE inclusion does not mean anything. It is how it runs it. To put it simply, many multiplats appeared in both older and newer generations, the difference is almost like another game.

TeamScriptKiddies · Feb 23, 2017

Chary said:
View attachment 78781

The Game Creators Conference was recently held in Japan, where Nintendo got to divulge some more details about the Nintendo Switch, along with some input from Capcom. There was some discussion of things like how Nintendo is focusing on having their own OS for the Switch, so that it can have plenty of resources for using gaming apps alongside your game without the console slowing down.

Most interestingly, Capcom's Masaru Ijuin talked about how they got their games to run on the console. They used the MT Framework engine, and after, which, Nintendo gave Capcom access to an emulator that could recreate the Switch's graphical output on a PC. According to the 2-person team that ported Street Fighter II to Nintendo's latest console, it's exceptionally easy to port things to the Switch, rather than it is to the 3DS or Wii U. They also mention that, "the hardware structure was very easy to understand, and had similarities to the Wii U." The Switch also had far less memory available initially, and Capcom's complaints managed to convince Nintendo to offer more memory capacity in the console.

Capcom also expressed a lot of interest in bringing the RE Engine, which is what Resident Evil 7 runs on, to the Switch as well, which could mean a potential port of Resident Evil 7, and any upcoming game that uses that engine, could very well get a Switch port in the future. The company is excited to develop more AAA games for the Switch, too.

Lastly, development kits for the Nintendo Switch will cost around 50,000 yen, which is around $450-500 US dollars after conversion.

Source

Dang the dev kits are cheap! I got rooked on my refurbished Wii u dev kit XD In all seriousness, I'm glad to see the big N open up more and more to indie and 3rd party devs!

jt_1258 · Feb 23, 2017

TeamScriptKiddies said:
Dang the dev kits are cheap! I got rooked on my refurbished Wii u dev kit XD In all seriousness, I'm glad to see the big N open up more and more to indie and 3rd party devs!

ya, that was one more thing that signed the wii u's death certificate, being hard to dev for, either ya couldn't afford it or it made so little sense that it took infinity to accomplish anything if you even can, so yeah, fingers crossed nintys fixed enough up to sell this on wii scale of sales almost

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