Reverse-engineered code for 'Grand Theft Auto III' and 'Vice City' get a DMCA takedown notice

gta reverse engineered.JPG

Earlier this week, we reported that the source codes for Grand Theft Auto III and Grand Theft Auto Vice City were fully reverse-engineered and made available to download as re3 and reVC respectively. However, their availability was short-lived as Take-Two Interactive, the publisher of the series, seems to have taken notice of this homebrew activity and issued a DMCA takedown, making the repository unavailable. The message below can be seen if you visit the page:

dmca notice.JPG

Take-Two's request is also publicly available and reads:

The content in the links below consists of copyrighted materials owned by Take-Two. The use of our copyrighted content in these links are unauthorized and it should be removed immediately.

You can read the rest of the request here.

This takedown might put a halt to modding efforts (at least for those who did not have access to the GitHub repository before the DMCA notice) but the original modders might come with a cleaner reversed code that could be legally shared. That, however, remains to be seen.
 

Ryab

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Earlier this week, we reported that the source codes for Grand Theft Auto III and Grand Theft Auto Vice City were fully reverse-engineered and made available to download as re3 and reVC respectively. However, their availability was short-lived as Take-Two Interactive, the publisher of the series, seems to have taken notice of this homebrew activity and issued a DMCA takedown, making the repository unavailable. The message below can be seen if you visit the page:

Take-Two's request is also publicly available and reads:



You can read the rest of the request here.

This takedown might put a halt to modding efforts (at least for those who did not have access to the GitHub repository before the DMCA notice) but the original modders might come with a cleaner reversed code that could be legally shared. That, however, remains to be seen.
Can't really be upset about this. They are just protecting their intellectual property. This is especially understandable because they are still selling the games on other storefronts.
 

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Still though, using Ghidra to disassemble and/or reverse engineer the code it's fairly legal, as it's still RE and not the original source code.

It doesn't matter. Where reverse engineering is allowed, you aren't allowed to share the results of the reverse engineering.

EU for example

https://vidstromlabs.com/blog/the-legal-boundaries-of-reverse-engineering-in-the-eu/

[...] decompilation does not permit the information obtained through its application to be used for the development, production or marketing of a computer program substantially similar in its expression, or for any other act which infringes copyright.
 
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|<roni&g

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Cunts cunts cunts. Hadn't got them set up on vita yet but I WILL have em down the line when all bugs are ironed out.
And people still defend em don't care if crappy mobile versions are available, they should of been available on every Sony console after ps2.
 

FAST6191

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BTW, I never liked GTA. I don't understand those types of games where you steal cars and massacre people in cold blood.

You generally don't massacre people in cold blood -- don't think any missions call for it, doing it in free roam also tends to be discouraged.
If GTA is that then so are Fallout, Elder Scrolls, most open world RPGs and whatever else.

As far as GTA itself. Mechanically I seldom find them as satisfying as more dedicated games -- if exploration, driving and gunplay are to be the order of the day then anything dedicated to those will do it at 20 times better. As a sum of its parts though and with the ability to play along with cheesy 90s New York crime story, 80s Miami, LA gangster, outlaw biker... it is about the same as the appeal for films doing the same thing and there is a reason all of those have been popular for decades, if not the better part of a century (longer if you count pulp fiction).
 
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Medievil_0ne

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Just to get this straight to all the people saying "took them long enough", this SHOULDN'T be happening, fyi.
Reverse engineered projects are legal, if none of the original game's copyrighted assets are included.
That means, no music, no graphics, etc., just the engine/code itself that was RE'd, and some process setup to dump the assets from an original game or original game's data.

The reverse engineered code that was constructed should be good for sharing as open source, that is why the projects done this way are supposed to request for the original game, so the project can extract the assets from it, and then compile accordingly.

This stupid DMCA can, and SHOULD be countered asap.
The only reason why the DMCA could pull through is if the developers were naive enough to leave some data from the original game within the repository, and that's the ONLY way the DMCA can succeed.

I encourage the developers to counter the DMCA, but make sure the repository is clean and safe, and then counter it accordingly.
If you guys don't do this, you will be opening the flood gates for pieces of shit companies like Nintendo to effectively bring down tons and tons of community-focused repositories in GitHub that work under a similar work structure (of requesting the original game to dump the assets).

Please, PLEASE counter the DMCA!

Actually this is not correct.. yes you can decompile code to learn, but you can not release that code, it is still the copyright holders IP.. you can decompile, re-write it to be YOUR code and release it, but 100% of the time, you release code as is from a decompile (which is just the binary in c form) you are committing an illegal act!!!... A simple decompile is NOT reverse engineering... reverse engineering is a ground up rewrite of the original code that performs and does the same as the original...DarkXL (dark forces engine) is a good example, they do not use any original lucasarts code in the engine.... the game engine is ALSO protected under copyright the same as the assets....dunno why anyone would think it isn't
 
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ClickCLK

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...you can decompile, re-write it to be YOUR code and release it, but 100% of the time, you release code as is from a decompile (which is just the binary in c form) you are committing an illegal act!!!

Decompiled executables will not produce C code, i'll be in assembly code for the platform it was meant to run on. To get C code you pretty much NEED to rewrite the program from scratch. There is no point in dumping the output of a decompiler to github, it is pointless.

So, I don't understand how a DMCA claim for this project could be valid, I thought they hadn't used any assets from the games and was a clean room project. If I'm not wrong then this is unacceptable and Take Two must be punished for that, but who am I kidding. The maximum here of what can be achieved is a removed DMCA claim, and thats it.
 

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It appears that a counter claim 'may' have been made but they have to wait 13 more days. I can't quote the source as the affected github user has redacted their statement. Only a quoted snapshot remains but it is not difficult to find.
 
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FAST6191

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Decompiled executables will not produce C code, i'll be in assembly code for the platform it was meant to run on. To get C code you pretty much NEED to rewrite the program from scratch. There is no point in dumping the output of a decompiler to github, it is pointless.

So, I don't understand how a DMCA claim for this project could be valid, I thought they hadn't used any assets from the games and was a clean room project. If I'm not wrong then this is unacceptable and Take Two must be punished for that, but who am I kidding. The maximum here of what can be achieved is a removed DMCA claim, and thats it.
Disassemblers will product assembly code.
Decompilers (which have just about become something useful and more than computer science phd subject*. https://www.hex-rays.com/products/decompiler/ https://www.retroreversing.com/intro-decompiling-with-ghidra https://github.com/avast/retdec-r2plugin ) often will produce quite readable C (sometimes even compilable), and if you have a list of function/variable names/symbols and whatever else because some developer left them in (see Diablo, though far from the earliest example https://www.pagetable.com/?p=28&cpage=1 ) or were present elsewhere (I don't know if this used the ones found in other language ports and mapped them back but that is what I heard) then so much the better.

*for the sake of others playing along while most learn in intro to computer science about the halting problem then in most cases for practical day to day reality then most branches are not taken, or will end the program quite quickly (and thus can be ignored). If you run the program you might also generate data on what calls what and conditions (dynamic recompilation emulators doing a more advanced version of http://fceux.com/web/help/TraceLogger.html and you can also note common data sets passed to functions or indeed infer them from conditionals/checks). Certain common C constructions and libraries with certain compilers (and it is not like programmers really used much more than MS' efforts, GNU/GCC, Borland and a handful of others provided by system makers/integrators/CPU makers) will also produce certain assembly instructions as there are limited numbers of ways to sensibly do things. C programs/OS level stuff will also often keep function names ( http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/dll_export_viewer.html ).
Combine all that together with modern computing power and the amount of assembly you have to contemplate over straight disassembly, and amount of stuff you can soon fill in, makes decompilation a sensible notion rather than theoretical for plain C family languages where it is classically considered a one way affair.
Gets far harder/far more potential branches to keep track of when you move up to C++ with all its object oriented stuff, hence why that needs considerably more computing power before it gets realistic and why this glut of game decompilation will probably not get too far into the PS2 era (later for handhelds, earlier for PC) before it stalls out, and possibly sooner than that when devs start to use serious optimisation options in the compiler that reduce a few of the clues.

Anyway if you start from that position then you started from a tainted source and thus the rest of the project can fall.
Clean room would likely entail you sitting there with a game, screen recorder and timer, maybe a memory viewer (could be contentious in some circles, https://h2o.law.harvard.edu/cases/4365 being a fairly relevant case, but most likely clear), and noting a jump held for this long reaches this many pixels, gun climb/recoil is this much, damage taken is this much, bailing from a car happens like this, motorbikes have this acceleration, weather does this, pedestrian normal AI, pedestrian panicked AI, normal driving AI, panicked AI, aggressive AI, how business buying works, and on and on and on and on, or maybe "just" figuring out how to interface with the assets and doing what needs doing from there (which is still going to be a lot of code and observing game behaviours). This is to say an absolute nightmare which is why nobody does it for anything other than simple file formats, simple protocols, things you can partially implement and still have something useful (SMB file sharing/user logins and SAMBA, openoffice/libreoffice and MS Office formats, WINE and Windows API) and likely even then still things that have serious demand to spend the several programmer months poking at it with a stick.
 
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ShadowOne333

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Again, it's all technicalities. ¯\_ (ツ)_/¯
It can be discussed whether disassembly or decompilation of the game can be legal or not, but the fact is that a lot of decompilation projects are open source, and most of the ones that have been counter-claimed have won, and remain active. Just look at SM64 PC.
So yeah ¯\_ (ツ)_/¯
 
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Lostbhoy

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The funny thing is that you must purchase the Steam version in order to build the port for Wii U which is what I did.

There is absolutely no way I would have purchased the game from Steam just to play on my PC, hadn't even thought about the game in nigh 20 years, so they gained actual cash money just so I could play a port on Wii U.

Remind me... who's losing anything in that scenario??
 

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What ones saw a counter claim? Also a simple DMCA response is effectively "OK, let's take it to court then" and that still means little as to what is legally allowed or what might trip up some aspect of the DMCA, copyright law, trademark law, patent law or something else in that whole realm.

As it stands I can't see a free and clear path to use someone else's code to reproduce essentially the same product (possibly even starting from the base of a functionally identical one). That just seems like textbook example of derived work, and one that does not really satisfy any aspect of fair use I can think of, nor have seen either in statutes or play out in case law for hacking related cases, emulation related cases or anything that falls from that, give or take a "Dhalsim from Street Fighter says that is stretching a bit" thing for interoperability of code (one of the main "substantial non infringing uses" behind emulation being free and clear, usually along with homebrew dev and accessibility for blind/deaf/hard of movement peeps, and this demonstrably allowing consoles that would never real time emulate a PS2, xbox or PC of the era to play this one).

I imagine most devs it happens to don't really care (usually such things are old enough that it acts more as a draw or possibility for someone to buy to get assets and those without it would not have cared anyway), realise that Streisand effect is a thing (wouldn't be the first thing to have leaked or open source revoked* code), maybe don't want to set a bad precedent if their lawyer happens to be a crack smoker (I imagine various cases like Galoob vs Nintendo http://museumofintellectualproperty.org/features/game_genie.html and Sega vs Accolade http://digital-law-online.info/cases/24PQ2D1561.htm becoming solid law/legal precedents rather than murky and "I don't know" being the answer from any lawyer you ask did not thrill said companies that like to lock things down), and outside of trademark fun ( https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/...-require-companies-tirelessly-censor-internet ) can generally ignore it and still release a remake/revisit/remaster/recompile/rerelease/... quite happily (possibly even with their game kept alive in the public consciousness for longer).

*there have been a few games that people wanted to release, or indeed did release but usually because of Rad/bink video, http://www.radgametools.com/binkgames.htm , not allowing it had to revoke it afterwards. You might not see them on https://osgameclones.com/ but anybody that wants to play with such things can, and it keeps on circulating.
 

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Rockstar like bethesda doesn't give a shit about modding it's take 2 that does hell RS told them to cool it (Take 2) several months ago if it wasn't for legal contract shit they'd probably jump take 2's ship
 
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Just to get this straight to all the people saying "took them long enough", this SHOULDN'T be happening, fyi.
Reverse engineered projects are legal, if none of the original game's copyrighted assets are included.
That means, no music, no graphics, etc., just the engine/code itself that was RE'd, and some process setup to dump the assets from an original game or original game's data.

The reverse engineered code that was constructed should be good for sharing as open source, that is why the projects done this way are supposed to request for the original game, so the project can extract the assets from it, and then compile accordingly.

This stupid DMCA can, and SHOULD be countered asap.
The only reason why the DMCA could pull through is if the developers were naive enough to leave some data from the original game within the repository, and that's the ONLY way the DMCA can succeed.

I encourage the developers to counter the DMCA, but make sure the repository is clean and safe, and then counter it accordingly.
If you guys don't do this, you will be opening the flood gates for pieces of shit companies like Nintendo to effectively bring down tons and tons of community-focused repositories in GitHub that work under a similar work structure (of requesting the original game to dump the assets).

Please, PLEASE counter the DMCA!


It's trademark infringement/misappropriation:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property

Look at "
Infringement, misappropriation, and enforcement"


Remove any likeness or references to gta .... gta is a brand/trademark owned by take two logos, name, content is owned exclusively by them



Nobody cares about ip law, until it's their shit getting leaked, ripped off, copied, pirated, then they wanna load the the C&D gun

This is an example of Trademark infringement:

230px-Nike,_McDonald’s_copyright_infringing_sandals_in_China.jpg



^ ip violation

Ip law isn't just limited to code

This like saying if I reversed engineered the xbox one console or switch, then made a clone using off the shelf parts, and wrote my own os, or you would have to use your own nand dump, and released it

Can't do that (not since the 1980s), its patent infrigement
 
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