1. ChaosEternal

    ChaosEternal GBAtemp Fan
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    If you call that antagonistic and unapologetic, then the Chinese have already succeeded in their propaganda campaign. You're right about the Chinese pressure though. This is why laws are needed that combat that kind of pressure. The sooner governments realize that pressure from rival governments on domestic businesses can be used to further geopolitical aims, the better.
     
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  2. Hells Malice

    Hells Malice Are you a bully?
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    I could really care less about a company or developer itself. There's really no point. You can kind of infer a conclusion or result based on the past but in the end it's better to just judge games individually. I love Demon's Souls, Dark Souls and Armored Core and yet FromSoft still released trash like Sekiro and Bloodborne. If I was just blindly going on faith and loyalty i'd own both but thankfully I was smart enough to judge them before buying them and ended up getting neither.

    Most of the Cyberpunk buzz is because it was highly anticipated and people expected the second coming of Jesus. The console ports thing is derpy as hell but realistically i'm not too sure what people actually expected. Last gen consoles were literally crawling on two shattered legs trying to run games by the end. Getting like 15 FPS in games. Then we get Cyberpunk which is pretty gorgeous and massive, so obviously you need some good shit to actually play it.

    It's ironic you bring up Fallout 76 since, like Cyberpunk, aside from mostly comical glitches the launch really wasn't that bad for a majority (millions) of players and if you came in with no expectations both were super fun to play even at launch. Cyberpunk falls slightly behind because it does actually have one really fucking annoying issue and that's the crashes. I have it on an NVME so it's like 30 seconds to get it back up but it's still obnoxious.

    Also Bethesda games have always been a nightmare lol. Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, Fallout 3 were all buggy messes. People just didn't really care as much back then. Most of the bugs were hilarious, and they still are honestly. Fallout 3 had an issue on consoles that the save files got so big they'd crash your damn console and corrupt the save. Amazing. I dunno why people treat Bethesda like they've "slipped" in recent years. They've stayed the exact same and that's actually the issue lol. It's just that with cancel culture becoming extremely popular it kind of bled into gaming where any sort of negative thing that happens during a popular titles launch snowballs into an avalanche of hate very, very quickly. Fallout 76 saw that in spades. When all is said and done it was absolutely no buggier than Fallout 3 or 4 and yet it got shit on for its bugs. It got shit on for not having NPCs even though it was literally announced as not having any so why did people expect them. People just wanted to bitch and cry at the sky.

    These days, the absolute last thing I will look at or care about, is community outcry. Because people are fucking idiots and cry about everything. But I won't blindly trust a developer either, even if I love their games every time.

    And I really wish people would move past review scores. They're stupid as hell and mean nothing. Either the score is for the publisher, or it's for the views. It's a meaningless and arbitrary tl;dr that delivers absolutely no information. When I reviewed games I was like Eh fuck it it feels like an 8 or whatever. That's pretty much every reviewer in a nutshell. Even with a process that's typically all it boils down to. It *feels like* this number, so here it is.

    Lets be real here you're just some kid in his basement you don't know a god damn thing about China except what your government has allowed you to see lol.
    We all know the Chinese government sucks. Just like the US government sucks. And the Russian government. It's no secret, they all suck. They're all run by money. But most of the shit you're fed with a shovel is literal propaganda to make you hate your countries enemies, and if you think what you do well then damn I guess their propaganda worked!
     
    Last edited by Hells Malice, Dec 19, 2020
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  3. the_randomizer

    the_randomizer The Temp's official fox whisperer
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    Hate to say it, I never saw appeal in their games before, and after this, I sure as hell never will. Their games are overrated and overhyped IMO.

    China's government and their fatass President Xi can piss on right off. Bunch of sensitive pantywaists.
     
  4. Digs

    Digs GBAtemp Regular
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    More laws would just remove half of the funding in the video game industry. You're not wrong though.
    I mean, mocking a world leader in their game in multiple aspects that I'm too lazy to list is kinda antagonistic. They should be allowed to do it for sure, but platforms are going to choose billions of dollars in funding over a game that won't even break a million in sales. =[
    Don't know about propaganda, it's pretty universal that everyone including their own country believes china are the bad guys.
     
  5. JFizDaWiz

    JFizDaWiz GBAtemp Regular
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    can't lose faith in a game studio/company if you never had faith in them in the first place.
    companies want your money, only give it to them when you are happy with a product.
    That is on the company and YOU the consumer, if you don't research a purchase and blindly buy it then you're just as much to blame as they are for selling a shit product.

    What this means, don't pre-order. Never.
     
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  6. DS1

    DS1 伝説のサラリーマン
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    I can’t speak to Cyberpunk (I understand it’s really popular/anticipated and Keanu is part of the advertising, but not informed outside of that), but I’ll say that nothing can make me lose faith in a studio. I still check Genki’s website every now and then with blind faith that they’ll make another 90s Japanese racing subculture game. Almost every studio I’m aware of that was “dead” has come through in the past few years (SNK with KOF, Capcom with DMC5) or even more recent (SE with TWEWY Neo, holy cow). Jut watch, Konami is gonna come back with some crazy stuff since Arcades are getting slaughtered.
     
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  7. MaxToTheMax

    MaxToTheMax GBAtemp Regular
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    I think that hype ruins game studios. The Twitter mob gets too excited for a game to come out and then the game is just a game. It wasn’t a life changing experience, and it was not nearly what the mob wanted it to be, so then the game gets shitty reviews and the studio gets fucked.

    I’m not saying that’s exactly what happened with Cyperpunk, the game was fundamentally flawed on a coding level. I do think hype played a huge part into it though.

    in short, what makes people lose hope in a game studio? Twitter. What makes me lose hope in a game studio? When their names are EA, Ubisoft, or Bethesda.
     
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  8. Seliph

    Seliph Big Communism Builder
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    Mistreatment of employees (every AAA publisher) lying to fans (most AAA publishers, especially Bethesda), Predatory business practice like loot boxes (EA), mistreatment of fans (Nintendo fucking over practically every fan project ever), transphobia, racism, and other silly things like that (CDPR), etc.

    At this point the only studios I really care about are Indie studios, however some studios like Fromsoft I still quite like. I only pay for indie games and I've pirated most of the AAA games I own except for Dark Souls and a few others.

    Oh also if a studio makes bad games, that'd make anyone lose faith I'd think.
     
    Last edited by Seliph, Dec 19, 2020
  9. bobmcjr

    bobmcjr GBAtemp Maniac
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    Honestly that's a sacrifice I'd be willing to make. Restraining China's political influence on the world should absolutely be a priority over maximizing corporate profits, and in this particular case, losing out on funding for some titles in an already saturated market.
     
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  10. Digs

    Digs GBAtemp Regular
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    Again, you're not wrong, but that's also a countless number of developers left jobless in an already crowded industry. Removing billions of dollars in funding and forcing billions of dollars of lost profit in an already unstable market could cause another crash.
     
    Last edited by Digs, Dec 19, 2020
  11. bobmcjr

    bobmcjr GBAtemp Maniac
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    Ah yes, all countries and their governments are equally evil and we should treat them all as the same threat. I totally I got disappeared for mocking the US president. Oh wait.

    No country is perfect, and the US has certainly made poor decisions at times, but it isn't unreasonable to consider a country that punishes its citizens and attempts to punish foreigners for the sole crime of insulting its politicians as a greater concern than other countries.

    I would absolutely rather the video game industry shrink than be subsidized by a country that is likely doing so for the primary purpose of expanding its influence. If the these companies' business models can't sustain themselves, perhaps they should reconsider their operations. But really, you're not going to get a "video games are dead" crash like what happened with Atari in this day and age. There will always be indie devs who's works are more accessible than ever. And I get it, there's a ton of people that want to make video games, but the industry really is saturated and it's not like their skills aren't applicable to other sectors. Not everyone can be a self-sustaining artist, musician, or athlete. Video games aren't much different. Honestly I'm surprised AAA studios aren't hemorrhaging developers 24/7 given the conditions so many work under.
     
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  12. eriol33

    eriol33 GBAtemp Maniac
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    I lost my faith in Squenix's Final fantasy after that disaster called FF XV. Everyone said FF XIII trilogy was the worst entry of FF games, but at least we had a complete experience. FF XV splits the story into movies, DLCs, radio dramas, trailers, and a novella. The result was so disappointing. FF XVI would be their last chance to regain trust of this dying franchise.
     
  13. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    We knew that the PS4 and Xbox One were reaching their limits way back when Fallout 76 just barely chugged on them, so I wasn't surprised that Cyberpunk 2077, a game that heavily relies on streaming assets on the fly, has issues with LOD. Cyberpunk is patient zero and the first example of storage making or breaking a game - Sony and Microsoft weren't kidding when they said that SSD's will be used to leverage modern games - they're not optional anymore, you only have so much RAM/VRAM to work with. I suspect that the problems will be ironed out eventually and having spent a good few days playing Cyberpunk on the PS5 I think people are doing themselves a great disservice by not playing it - it's great, even without a native PS5 version that will really let it spread its wings. I've suffered quite a few crashes myself, but I don't know how many of them could be attributed to poor optimisation and how many are a result of early days PS5 firmware - probably 70/30, given the fact that Demon's Souls crashes in a similar manner, but not as frequently. I try to keep in mind that throughout the bug fixing process the team was working remotely from their homes, so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt in these rather unique circumstances. It's hard to judge the game you've been waiting almost a decade for that managed to deliver exactly what you expected in terms of narrative and gameplay, but failed at optimisation out of the gate - if I were to review it, I'd have to score it on the grounds of what's in front of me here and now, which would dock the score, but the potential is there to become possibly the best game this generation, period.

    As for Devotion getting delisted, GOG is a business and China is a growing market, I'm not surprised that financial interests trumped principle - in fact, I would expect no less. I'm not in support of censorship and I don't think that the game should be delisted from anywhere - in a perfect world, that is. Principles are great, but you can't eat them, CD Projekt's first and foremost responsibility is maintaining the business on behalf of their investors, and that means sacrifices. I don't remember a similar stink being raised over controversial titles getting delisted from Steam when they insulted western sensibilities. Ideally the marketplace should be welcoming for all content and it's the customers who should choose how to spend their money without outside interference, whatever the game might be - I'm no fan of moral policing. Sadly we don't live in an ideal world and both government interference and online mobs made deplatforming an everyday occurrence, so nothing shocks me in this regard anymore.

    So, what's the conclusion here? Play Cyberpunk, just play it on hardware that can support it properly or wait for patches, or the inevitable GOTY edition which will run like butter, the same as Witcher 3 which had similar, albeit less pronounced issues. Support developers who get deplatformed, support independent platforms. GOG is still one of the good guys and the only storefront that delivers DRM-free copies of software for the customer's convenience, but if they are to grow, they need to operate internationally - this includes China, which happens to have an oppressive government with "special" requirements. You can clutch your pearls and take your money elsewhere, just be aware that by doing so you are fueling far inferior alternatives that are not interested in your digital rights nearly as much as CDP is.
     
  14. hamohamo

    hamohamo GBAtemp Fan
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    For the game studio to be anti consumer, not respect the fans and continue to use cash grab services and take advantage of the fans for money. Nintendo and ea being the example here.

    A studio can make a bad game or riddle it with bugs. Doesn't mean It's a bad game studio.
     
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  15. scroeffie1984

    scroeffie1984 GBAtemp Regular
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    not caring about the first gen ps4 and xbox one like we dont have 120+ sold ps4 units 17 fps
    stupid hacking etc etc
     
  16. raxadian

    raxadian GBAtemp Addict
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    Hey, remember EA? Remember when thrir games were not full of micro transactions crap?
     
  17. wonkeytonk

    wonkeytonk GBAtemp Regular
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    I haven't lost faith in them one bit after this.
     
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  18. tomasowa

    tomasowa GBAtemp Regular
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    If we're drawing parallels with Bethesda, as an Elder Scrolls fan, I lost faith after Morrowind; if some of you are too young to remember, it's about that time they started shutting out the Modding community which was fixing their asinine bugs for free. They also removed Levitation from the gameplay mechanics which drained the joy of exploration for most, including myself; nothing like enchanting a Soul Gem with a Golden Saint and using Levitation to fly around the World.

    Similarly, Fallout 3 was my cut-off point, so much so that I digressed to playing Fallout Tactics which feels like the last best representation of the game, albeit non-canonical. Overall, Bethesda looks like they're still using Poser to model their 3D game assets from those days to 2020.

    Conversely, CD Projekt Red always seemed to try too hard at bringing realism above what is physically possible for the generation's hardware; it's a nice self-serving ideal but is a pathetic way of marketing to Gamers.

    There have been decades of Gaming history that made the best use of their respective current-generation hardware to make memorable Hall of Famers, so I see little point in patronising the Community with a title that's, to paraphrase, "Too good that it can only work with the Next-Next-Generation."

    Sounds like a you-problem with optimisation to me, Developer.
     
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  19. pedro702

    pedro702 GBAtemp Legend
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    to be fair on an interview the devs adimited lying to sony and microsoft when they were asked about the game bugs, the said to sony and microsoft they would fix the bugs with a day one patch which didnt fix much, that is why sony and microsoft let it pass.
     
  20. Lumstar

    Lumstar Princess
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    Pardon me for being out of the loop, what do we have for tangible evidence anyhow? I wasn't aware GOG or its parent company have conducted business in an official capacity in China to date, nor has announced plans to begin releasing their games in China.
     
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