Hacking Discussion What do I need to prepare for the emuNAND/Thermosphère to be released soon?

[Deleted User]

Hello gbatemp community,

I have some questions regarding the emuNAND of Atmosphere, which is still in the development phase.
I know it's not much known about the function type of emuNAND, but I still hope that you can answer my following questions

- How much storage space on the SD card is needed for the emuNAND extra?
- Can emuNAND also be used with exFAT normally?
- Is there a firmware that is best suited for emuNAND?
- Are all Nintendo contents of sysNAND also visible and playable in emuNAND?
- If the USER partition is redirected to the SD card and the partition size can be adjusted?
- Is the emuNAND recognizable for Nintendo, so that a ban is guaranteed as soon as you go online with it?
- Will it also be possible to switch between sysNAND and emuNAND during operation, as with 3DS, without completely restarting the system?
- Which SD is recommended for the emuNAND and what is the minimum size?
- And the question is specifically addressed to the developers of Atmosphere. What's the official name: emuNAND or Emu-eMMC?

Thank you for all your replies

thanks and greeting
RyuSeisuke1992

 

[Kubas_inko]

We don't know in the first place!!

- 29.8gb
- Exfat will probably be needed.
- 1.0.0 is best. Then up to 3.0.2, because of possible codlboot.
- EmuNAND is separated from SysNAND, so no. (everything will be copied but won't be shared)
- Definitely can be done but probably won't happen.
- Nope, but who knows...
- How is it possible on 3DS?
- 32gb for bare emunand (right now)
- EmuNAND as it is Emulated NAND.

 

[Lacius]

Hello gbatemp community,

I have some questions regarding the emuNAND of Atmosphere, which is still in the development phase.
I know it's not much known about the function type of emuNAND, but I still hope that you can answer my following questions

1. How much storage space on the SD card is needed for the emuNAND extra?
2. Can emuNAND also be used with exFAT normally?
3. Is there a firmware that is best suited for emuNAND?
4. Are all Nintendo contents of sysNAND also visible and playable in emuNAND?
5. If the USER partition is redirected to the SD card and the partition size can be adjusted?
6. Is the emuNAND recognizable for Nintendo, so that a ban is guaranteed as soon as you go online with it?
7. Will it also be possible to switch between sysNAND and emuNAND during operation, as with 3DS, without completely restarting the system?
8. Which SD is recommended for the emuNAND and what is the minimum size?
9. And the question is specifically addressed to the developers of Atmosphere. What's the official name: emuNAND or Emu-eMMC?

Thank you for all your replies

thanks and greeting
RyuSeisuke1992

Please note that the following answers are largely speculative and are subject to change. Many of my answers are based in part on how emuNAND works on the 3DS and Wii U.

1. An emuNAND will likely require about 32GB of space (rounding up).
2. An emuNAND will likely require its own partition next to the exFAT partition. Your exFAT partition will function normally.
3. As an entrypoint to loading your emuNAND, lower is always better. Lower system versions have the potential for untethered coldboot exploits. For the actual emuNAND itself, there will probably be no reason not to keep it on the latest version.
4. No, the system storage contents on the sysNAND will not be visible on the emuNAND. During the process of creating your emuNAND, however, you will likely be able to duplicate them over. As for the contents of the microSD card, they will only visible on both the sysNAND and the emuNAND if they are "linked." If you format one of them, they will no longer be linked. For obvious reasons, keeping the two linked will not be recommended.
5. Maybe, but it probably won't work like this if/when it's first released. I wouldn't count on this.
6. A well-implemented emuNAND probably won't be easily detected by Nintendo.
7. Switching between the sysNAND and the emuNAND will probably require you to reboot the console.
8. As big as possible, considering it will take up 32GB alone, and that's not including most of your games. The minimum size SD card will probably be 64GB, since a 32GB microSD card is not going to have a full 32GB available to you.
9. Both would be correct from a technical perspective. I'm sticking with emuNAND for now.

 

[Resaec]

Switching between the sysNAND and the emuNAND will probably require you to reboot the console.

I can see warmboot above hekate from sysNAND to EmuNAND and back if you are:

1. on the same FW
2. using the same keys

As some (console unique) keys get locked in key slots while booting you can only switch if they stay the same or are irrelevant (patched out).
Also your FW should be the same as they have different keys needed to be loaded (again maybe patchable)

 

[RitchieRitchie]

Would a 128 sd card formatted to Fat32 (due to not having the ex-Fat update on a 3.00 switch) be able to create an emunand? Appreciate any thoughts on this!

 

[tech3475]

Would a 128 sd card formatted to Fat32 (due to not having the ex-Fat update on a 3.00 switch) be able to create an emunand? Appreciate any thoughts on this!

There is a way to install the exfat update without needing to connect online such as this:
https://gbatemp.net/threads/how-to-install-the-exfat-driver-without-updating-2-x.505176/

 

[RitchieRitchie]

There is a way to install the exfat update without needing to connect online such as this:
https://gbatemp.net/threads/how-to-install-the-exfat-driver-without-updating-2-x.505176/

Thanks for the link but I'm pretty hopeless at this sort of stuff and I could guarantee you 100% that I would brick my switch attempting it!

 

[tech3475]

Thanks for the link but I'm pretty hopeless at this sort of stuff and I could guarantee you 100% that I would brick my switch attempting it!

If you're planning on hacking/modding a system, you should have a backup of your NAND/keys anyway.

 

[andijames]

Thanks for the link but I'm pretty hopeless at this sort of stuff and I could guarantee you 100% that I would brick my switch attempting it!

Probably will require exfat as emunand is essentially a copy of your sysnand as a file. I.e a 32GB (or there about) single file. If you're worried then you can always officially update and still be able to install CFW. At least you have options

 

[Dontwait00]

could work a redirect of all the kernel calls to the copied eMMC?
i never did understand how emuNAND works

 

[TheCyberQuake]

Probably will require exfat as emunand is essentially a copy of your sysnand as a file. I.e a 32GB (or there about) single file. If you're worried then you can always officially update and still be able to install CFW. At least you have options

Usually it's not a single file within a partition on the SD, but rather a separate partition at the beginning of the SD so FAT wouldn't matter. It was the same on 3ds and that used FAT32

 

[alertipo]

One thing I still don't get is if you have Emunand on a higher firmware version than Sysnand or vice versa, wouldn't that cause the NAND with the lower firmware unbootable due to only one set of efuses?

Of course if both are on the same version than no problem - but then that severely limits what the system can do...

 

[Draxzelex]

One thing I still don't get is if you have Emunand on a higher firmware version than Sysnand or vice versa, wouldn't that cause the NAND with the lower firmware unbootable due to only one set of efuses?

Of course if both are on the same version than no problem - but then that severely limits what the system can do...

Well you can't just boot into EmuNAND without an exploit. And the coldboot exploit we have can allow us to bypass the fuse checks in the first place so fuses aren't really an issue.

 

[alertipo]

Well you can't just boot into EmuNAND without an exploit. And the coldboot exploit we have can allow us to bypass the fuse checks in the first place so fuses aren't really an issue.

I am on 4.1. Is it true that the coldboot exploit is limited to <= 3.0 currently?

 

[Draxzelex]

I am on 4.1. Is it true that the coldboot exploit is limited to <= 3.0 currently?

The current coldboot exploit we have works on all firmwares because it takes advantage of the unpatchable bootrom of the Switch making it a hardware exploit meaning Nintendo cannot patch this exploit with a firmware update. The ipatched units that recently have shown up have modified bootroms making them impervious to the exploit. There is another theoretical coldboot exploit that can be achieved on firmwares 3.0.1 and below however not a single developer is working on such exploit since it is difficult to achieve and the current coldboot exploit works on all firmwares.

 

[OrGoN3]

We don't in the first place!!

- 29.8gb
- Exfat will probably be needed.
- 1.0.0 is best. Then up to 3.0.2, because of possible codlboot.
- EmuNAND is separated from SysNAND, so no. (everything will be copied but won't be shared)
- Definitely can be done but probably won't happen.
- Nope, but who knows...
- How is it possible on 3DS?
- 32gb for bare emunand (right now)
- EmuNAND as it is Emulated NAND.

It's not.

 

[alertipo]

The current coldboot exploit we have works on all firmwares because it takes advantage of the unpatchable bootrom of the Switch making it a hardware exploit meaning Nintendo cannot patch this exploit with a firmware update. The ipatched units that recently have shown up have modified bootroms making them impervious to the exploit. There is another theoretical coldboot exploit that can be achieved on firmwares 3.0.1 and below however not a single developer is working on such exploit since it is difficult to achieve and the current coldboot exploit works on all firmwares.

Ok I think I am getting my terminology mixed up - yes. FG is cold boot and it works on all (older) booroms. What I meant was untethered cold boot - that probably will not happen any time soon for 4.1, or any firmware for that matter right?

 

[Draxzelex]

Ok I think I am getting my terminology mixed up - yes. FG is cold boot and it works on all (older) booroms. What I meant was untethered cold boot - that probably will not happen any time soon for 4.1, or any firmware for that matter right?

There is no word on an untethered coldboot for any firmware above 3.0.1 at the current time. The only other exploit we are aware of is Deja Vu which is a warmboot hack confirmed to work on firmwares 4.1 and below with it being partially patched in 5.X firmwares.

 

[Kubas_inko]

There is no word on an untethered coldboot for any firmware above 3.0.1 at the current time. The only other exploit we are aware of is Deja Vu which is a warmboot hack confirmed to work on firmwares 4.1 and below with it being partially patched in 5.X firmwares.

The coldboot can work up to 3.0.2 I think. Not sure on that through.

 

[Draxzelex]

The coldboot can work up to 3.0.2 I think. Not sure on that through.

The other coldboot exploit SciresM was referring to was said to be theoretically possible on firmwares < 3.0.2 meaning its firmwares 3.0.1 and below. If he meant firmwares 3.0.2, he would have used the less than or equal to sign and not the less than sign. However, since 3.0.2 and 3.0.1 share the same number of burnt fuses, one could just downgrade to 3.0.1 anyways if the exploit ever gets discovered and subsequently released.

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