Warren Spector: "The ultraviolence, in video games has to stop&#34

[Deleted_171835]

“This is the year where there were two things that stood out for me,” he said. “One was: The ultraviolence has to stop. We have to stop loving it. I just don’t believe in the effects argument at all, but I do believe that we are fetishizing violence, and now in some cases actually combining it with an adolescent approach to sexuality. I just think it’s in bad taste. Ultimately I think it will cause us trouble.

“I left Eidos in 2004 because I looked around at E3 and saw the new Hitman game where you get to kill with a meat hook, and 25 to Life, the game about kids killing cops, and Crash & Burn the racing game where the idea is to create the fieriest, most amazing explosions, not to win the race… I looked around my own booth and realized I just had one of those ‘which thing is not like the other’ moments. I thought it was bad then, and now I think it’s just beyond bad.”

Spector said when he was working on Deus Ex, the “spreading blood pools under innocent dogs when you kill them,” was meant to make the player feel “disturbed,” when they pulled the trigger. Now, with the carnage induced on in-game beings disappearing along with the body, it erases the aftermath of said carnage from the gamer’s thoughts.

“We’ve gone too far. The slow-motion blood spurts, the impalement by deadly assassins, the knives, shoulders, elbows to the throat,” he said. “You know, Deus Ex had its moments of violence, but they were designed – whether they succeeded or not I can’t say – but they were designed to make you uncomfortable, and I don’t see that happening now.

“I think we’re just appealing to an adolescent mindset and calling it mature. It’s time to stop. I’m just glad I work for a company like Disney, where not only is that not something that’s encouraged, you can’t even do it, and I’m fine with it.”

http://www.gamesindu...=european-daily

He's 100% correct. The excessive violence put into games so that it appeals to adolescents and a so-called mature audience is just disgusting. There's too much mindless violence in games these days instead of it actually being there to advance the story or to make the player feel something.

 

[emigre]

Never has an image spoken so much truth.

 

[DragorianSword]

I kind of agree.
These days they can go really over the top with the violence.
It's just violence for the sake of violence sometimes. The killing with a meat hook is a good example of this.
Also some games could do less with the blood splashing on the screen and gushing out of bodies.
I don't say I'm against shooters and such, I enjoy them a lot too, but they would be just as enjoyable without guts flying around.

 

[snakepliskin2334]

boo hooo dont like the violence in the game your playing quit playing it nuff said move on i mean jesus get over it its called gaming for a reason !!!

 

[Deleted_171835]

boo hooo dont like the violence in the game your playing quit playing it nuff said move on i mean jesus get over it its called gaming for a reason !!!

.........



And what reason might that be?

 

[nando]

i agree with warren

i actually enjoy violent movies etc, but my problem with violent games is that the kids allowed to played them have absolutely no empathy when they do and this is further encouraged by the type of games put out there. it is one thing to have violence as a story element, it is a different thing to make violence the end goal of the gameplay.

 

[machomuu]

I agree. While I don't think it's "disgusting", I do find violence in various games to go into the realms of stupidity (just plain overly excessive for no reason) simply because they want to appeal to adolescents, and why shouldn't they, it does capture their attention. Heck, it's a great way to "engage" a player into a crappy gaming experience. Yup, these are the guys that are going to be "our tomorrow", folks.

 

[chyyran]

What is the point of making a game that appeals to adolescents when 90% of them don't have legal access to them due to their ratings? I'm pretty sure that anyone below 18 has to have parental consent before purchasing an M rated game. What type of parent lets their kids buy games with "slow motion blood squirts" (really?) is beyond me.

 

[machomuu]

What is the point of making a game that appeals to adolescents when 90% of them don't have legal access to them due to their ratings?

They still buy it, though, and that's good enough for the devs/publishers and directors.

 

[Deleted_171835]

What is the point of making a game that appeals to adolescents when 90% of them don't have legal access to them due to their ratings?

"MOMMY, CAN I HAVE CALL OF DUTY BLACK OPS 9?"

 

[Vampire Lied]

All this anti violence. You guys must've thought the snes version of the original mortal kombat was the best ever. LOL
I do think some games are over the top just for the sake of pushing the envelope.
I don't think they should be eliminated though.
I hate gears of war. It's $60 worth of guns chainsaws and horrible dialogue.
Many ppl LOVE gears though. It's a matter of opinion.
If gore, nudity, language actually tie into the game and are part of the atmosphere, why not?
If ppl are irresponsible and allow their kids to play them, that's their fault.
It doesn't mean that the game shouldn't exist at all because ppl don't parent their children.
If games like metal gear, assassins creed, la noir, god of war etc. Didn't contain blood, language or a little nudity, it wouldn't feel right.
Just how splatter movies and porn are allowed to exist, so should "tasteless" games.
I would totally support a mandatory age check as they do with alcohol, cigarettes and at movie theaters.
It comes down to how well kids are watched after.
If the guy is happier with Disney, more power to him.
If I want to play mickey mouse or killer 7, that choice is up to me and I think the choice should stay.

 

[Deleted_171835]

All this anti violence. You guys must've thought the snes version of the original mortal kombat was the best ever. LOL
I do think some games are over the top just for the sake of pushing the envelope.
I don't think they should be eliminated though.
I hate gears of war. It's $60 worth of guns chainsaws and horrible dialogue.
Many ppl LOVE gears though. It's a matter of opinion.
If gore, nudity, language actually tie into the game and are part of the atmosphere, why not?
If ppl are irresponsible and allow their kids to play them, that's their fault.
It doesn't mean that the game shouldn't exist at all because ppl don't parent their children.
If games like metal gear, assassins creed, la noir, god of war etc. Didn't contain blood, language or a little nudity, it wouldn't feel right.
Just how splatter movies and porn are allowed to exist, so should "tasteless" games.
I would totally support a mandatory age check as they do with alcohol, cigarettes and at movie theaters.
It comes down to how well kids are watched after.
If the guy is happier with Disney, more power to him.
If I want to play mickey mouse or killer 7, that choice is up to me and I think the choice should stay.

You don't seem to get it. I'm not against violence in general. I'm against violence that has no reason to be there, mindless violence. Violence that actually serves a purpose in the story is fine but when it's used to just make games appeal to adolescents and "mature gamers", then it's being used wrong.

The difference with excessive violence in the videogame industry compared to the movie industry is that it's the main part of so many games released nowadays. With movies, we have things like Inception, The Avengers and The Dark Knight. In the violent movies, it usually serves a purpose (Michael Bay is a glitch in the system) rather than just being there for the heck of it. Even so, there are so many different types of movies out that it isn't even a problem there.

In the games you mentioned, most of them use violence correctly. Like you said, MGS wouldn't be MGS if you didn't have guns. But even then, Snake doesn't go around blowing brains out just for the heck of it. It's there to enhance the story and gameplay. God of War is expected to be a violent game too although I do think they are going too far in the latest one (Ascension), with the skull of an elephant-man being ripped open showing his brain.

The modern videogame industry is plagued by tons of games that feature violent material for no other reason but to appeal to adolescents and frankly, it's damaging to the industry as a whole.

 

[DarkShinigami]

i somewhat agree

i mean i love violent games to relieve stress but there is a point where its going over the top and we are well past that point

i mean what happened when games were about story lately its all about new or more gory ways to kill

 

[notmeanymore]

I would love it for violent video games to be disturbing and not frivolous. I haven't played any of the Deus Ex series, so reading how he described the violent portions sounded like exactly what adults should be looking for.

Violence doesn't make a game, there are amazing non-combat games out there(Portal, sorta), just as there are amazing games with non-violent combat(Pokemon). There are even non-violent games with blood and guts everywhere (Trauma Center).

I do find violence in various games to go into the realms of stupidity (just plain overly excessive for no reason)

See: Bulletstorm and Sniper Elite.

 

[Deleted_171835]

I would love it for violent video games to be disturbing and not frivolous. I haven't played any of the Deus Ex series, so reading how he described the violent portions sounded like exactly what adults should be looking for.

ಠ_ಠ

Is that not worse?

 

[DigitalDeviant]

I don't understand his notion of the "fine line" being crossed. He describes how he made Deus Ex to make the player feel 'disturbed' and not desensitized but even he admits he's not sure if that was successful. He now feels it's gone too far, but where is the evidence for that?

 

[Zarcon]

I would love it for violent video games to be disturbing and not frivolous. I haven't played any of the Deus Ex series, so reading how he described the violent portions sounded like exactly what adults should be looking for.

ಠ_ಠ

Is that not worse?

If it makes you feel bad about killing things then no.

 

[DS1]

Not sure how desensitized anyone is to anything, stuff that disturbed me as a kid still disturbs me now. Not everyone is disturbed by gore, which is generally all anyone talks about in these arguments. I wasn't like, "AHHHH!" the first time I saw a fatality in MK, I was like, "that's stupid."


On the other hand, my friends and I got freaked the hell out when we booted this one up for the first time:

Spoiler

I don't care if it's cartoony, that's an otherwise happy character screaming in pain from being cooked alive!

 

[nando]

Not sure how desensitized anyone is to anything, stuff that disturbed me as a kid still disturbs me now. Not everyone is disturbed by gore, which is generally all anyone talks about in these arguments. I wasn't like, "AHHHH!" the first time I saw a fatality in MK, I was like, "that's stupid."

I don't care if it's cartoony, that's an otherwise happy character screaming in pain from being cooked alive!

gore and disturbing are completely different things imo.

 

[MelodieOctavia]

It's funny because he thinks ultraviolence and gore is a new thing in Video Games.

People seem to think Mortal Kombat was the only offender back in the day. wrong, wrong wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9H4A2MIIy4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AapB7dW3HA


(I could also show the arcade game called Chiller here, made in 1986, but that's disturbing even today)

Then you have Resident Evil, Splatterhouse, Doom...I could go on.

The point of the matter is, as games get more photorealistic, so does the gore. If we could have games like Gears of War back then, they probably would have been made back then. All this is, is a progress of technology. As the graphics get better, so does the violence and gore.