"waiving your class-action lawsuit rights" should be made illegal

Discussion in 'Xbox One - Games & Content' started by GoldenSun3DS, Jun 15, 2013.

  1. GoldenSun3DS
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    GoldenSun3DS GBAtemp Regular

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    From the home page:


    Stuff like this in the Terms of Use really should be made illegal.
    It's completely unfair to the consumer because you agree to it just by owning an Xbox One and you can't even negotiate the ToU with Microsoft because they're set in stone.
     
  2. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    It actually is illegal in many countries. The ToS and ToU are not law - the worst they can do is revoke your warranty if you cross the line, but they still have to follow Trade Standards. They realize that, it's the consumers that don't. Moreover, you don't really sign any agreement when you purchase the system, the agreement concerns the service which you sign up for when launching the console for the first time, meaning XBox Live. Goods are not services, and the console itself certainly isn't a service as much as Microsoft would want you to think that it is.

    That being said, vote with your wallet. If you think their new ToS/ToU is unacceptable, don't buy the system until they change it.
     
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  3. FireGrey

    FireGrey Undercover Admin

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    You can easily cheat this term, just go get someone else to fill in the lawsuit.
     
  4. Ray Lewis

    Ray Lewis Banned

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    Thought I would check out this section to find MS apologists. My theory is the MS market is rich people who don't care about privacy or the NSA goldmine this looks to be.
     
  5. eyecat14

    eyecat14 GBATemp's Lovely Jizzing Mordecai™

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  6. Walkin

    Walkin travel

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    I'm going to put a bumper sticker on my car that says that you wave any rights to sue me for any reason.
     
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  7. Xuphor

    Xuphor I have lied to all of you. I am deeply sorry.

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    Make a class action lawsuit comprised of nobody that buys an Xbox One (so you don't "waive your rights to do so") saying that they can't demand such outrageous things when you pay them $500 + A ton more for the Xbox Live subscription.

    Being serious here, it's illegal in many countries, and if you make sure that the class action lawsuit is filled with people that are not already restricted by it, you stand a pretty good chance of winning.
     
  8. SuzieJoeBob

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    It is illegal, as this is a form of entrapment.
     
  9. dickfour

    dickfour Banned

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    You can't wave your rights to file a law suit. All of those wavers companies make you sign aren't worth the paper they're printed on just ask a good lawyer
     
  10. Gahars

    Gahars Bakayaro Banzai

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    You are still allowed to bring a lawsuit to Microsoft, it just has to be on an individual basis, if I remember correctly.

    Unfortunately, it seems that a lot of companies have started to include this clause - after all, if you can get away with it, there's no real incentive not to. I know Steam and a bunch of other services use it, and the number's only going to increase.
     
  11. JoostinOnline

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  12. the_randomizer

    the_randomizer The Temp's official fox whisperer

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    Dr. Wahwee's castle
  13. JoostinOnline

    JoostinOnline Certified Crash Test Dummy

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    Well it's not just Microsoft. Sony and Steam do the same thing (probably Nintendo too).
     
  14. the_randomizer

    the_randomizer The Temp's official fox whisperer

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    Still a stupid thing to do. If a TOS is signed, no rights should be forced to be waived. Besides, is someone like Steam decided to render my games unusable, I'd just find a way to make them work without Steam's services. I can't sue them for disabling the games, but people will find a way to make them usable once more. Slightly off-topic, sure, but the whole TOS-signing-waiving-your-rights-to-sue is convoluted and BS.
     
  15. whinis

    whinis Member

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    Alright, while I believe "waiving" any rights is stupid, this is entirely legal and the only reason they are including it is due to a supreme court case which says that they can. However it doesn't prevent you from suing them, it just prevents you from getting together in a group and suing as a group. As wierd as this sounds I support this small term in ToS as most time class action lawsuits cost the company the fucked up but gives nothing to the consumers that were hurt, the only people that benefit are the lawyers who bring the lawsuits. The past 5 class actions I was apart of I had less than $15 of payout each even though it was hailed by the lawers as "reasonable terms".
     
  16. Apache Thunder

    Apache Thunder I have cameras in your head!

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    My mother was included in a class action lawsuit regarding SSI and received $25,000. So yeah you can bet removing class action will negatively impact people.

    Many lawsuits have varying results, but denying class action status to everyone is just bad policy and is morally wrong. Class action status generally is meant to benefit those who were wronged by a company or government agency but aren't able to afford the process to sue.

    Sure you can sue Microsoft your self, but I would imagine you would have difficulty in doing so because "good" lawyers are expensive not to mention any possible fees associated with filing the paper work and such.

    Even if you win, your friends and other folks who had also been wronged may have to sue as well since it wasn't a class action suit and you bet the company would try to avoid to pay them as well and force them to have to spend money to get an attorney/lawyer to sue to get it.


    So yeah, buy something from Microsoft but get royally screwed over by them. I bet then you will change your mind real quick on this!
     
  17. whinis

    whinis Member

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    Considering the terms are now in all Steam, EA, Microsoft, and Sony Terms of use You can't really game anymore without being screwed over by them. Also, a few "good" anecdotal evidence isn't really a good measure of the normal class action results, its similar to the lottery tickets with "Up to $10 million in prizes" when most people either won't win get get less than $10. A good example of this is the recent class action lawsuit against Bank of America and the wrongful foreclosed on houses, the only people who got over $1000 in the settlement was Military personal who got the maximum allowed full valve of their house. Keep in mind cost of lawsuits shows that in 2004 the lowest percentage of legal fees was 12.5 % on 1 billion dollars, the rest of then split to the number of affected which is often in the hundreds of thousands.

    EDIT:More REsults