U.S. pulling out of the INF treaty

[WD_GASTER2]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/19/us/politics/russia-nuclear-arms-treaty-trump-administration.html

This feels kind of surreal. I do wonder how europe is going to feel about this as well.

To me this feels like we are being pulled back to early 1980's and it seems scary to me.

any thoughts or opinions on this?

 

[Song of storms]

Time to invest in a bunker.

 

[WD_GASTER2]

so would you be in favor of staying in the treaty?
I am just curious to hear opinions on this.

 

[Localhorst86]

While the treaty was seen as effective for years, Russia has been violating it at least since 2014 in an effort to menace other nations.

What good is a treaty that gets violated anyways?

 

[The Real Jdbye]

I don't really know enough about this to comment much on it, but I will say that I see where Trump is coming from as far as Russia is concerned. Seems like the treaty hasn't exactly been effective anyways.

 

[kuwanger]

What good is a treaty that gets violated anyways?

A lot of treaties get violated. Part of the point of treaties is to establish what a "violation" is and use it as a basis for sanctions or other actions. It's also a basis to establish a new treaty that's less likely to be violated and/or has different conditions that makes it harder to violate. Basically, your question is like asking, "What good is a law if it gets violated anyways?"

 

[Localhorst86]

A lot of treaties get violated. Part of the point of treaties is to establish what a "violation" is and use it as a basis for sanctions or other actions. It's also a basis to establish a new treaty that's less likely to be violated and/or has different conditions that makes it harder to violate. Basically, your question is like asking, "What good is a law if it gets violated anyways?"

Did russia receive any sanctions from their INF violations?

 

[kuwanger]

Did russia receive any sanctions from their INF violations?

A quick google, and I'd say no. It sounds like both sides say the other is in violation by having short-range missiles (or equivalents) built or tested that fall under the scope of the treaty. So, it's something of an impasse to try to use sanctions. Since the core purpose of the INF treaty was achieved back in 2001, it sounds like it would make more sense to establish a new treaty to replace the INF treaty. The real issue then is that Russia and the US aren't on good terms to establish said new treaty. Also, it would make sense to include China in the treaty.

The general issue I'd say in this instance is the same as Trump with the ACA: lots of talk of repeal but no real idea of what to replace with. The underlying need for what the INF represents is still needed. If there's no serious talk of some sort of replacement for INF or a move towards some equivalent, then it's clearly an unwise move because all removal of the treaty achieves is on paper removing "violations" without in any way removing the actual problem.

 

[Taleweaver]

What good is a treaty that gets violated anyways?

Aside from what @kuwanger mentions, it also holds a lot of diplomatic power. In a way, it's a blockade that prevents the US-China trade war to escalate in an actual war.

 

[linuxares]

Can you FUCKS stop trying to destroy the world? Thank you! - Humanity

 

[Deleted User]

At this point, I really do think they're planning to create a 1984 world. They're gonna start ww3 and sit back as they rule their totalitarian nations.

 

[AtsuNii]

I think it is a bad plan, seeing the rising tensions already again in the world. This could lead to another arms race and might even cause a 2nd cold war if not a 3rd world war. People should just learn to live in peace together.

 

[Viri]

Yes, time to invest in bunkers, and prepare for a nuclear war! We're all going to die!

Spoiler

Nothing is going to happen or change at all.

 

[CORE]

Wait I thought Trump was a Russian Agent of Putin? Why would he do this.

 

[chrisrlink]

Can you FUCKS stop trying to destroy the world? Thank you! - Humanity

and why do we need that? if earth was a computer......it needs a Good reboot once in a while and sometimes a fresh OS install

 

[Viri]

Wait I thought Trump was a Russian Agent of Putin? Why would he do this.

He's trying to make people think he's not a Russian agent, that plans to gas Mexicans and trans people in concentration camps. Duhh! He's going to start demanding Vancouver and Baja California. Fucking Orange Hitler.

 

[WD_GASTER2]

Yes, time to invest in bunkers, and prepare for a nuclear war! We're all going to die!

Spoiler

Nothing is going to happen or change at all.

historically we have come very close several times and we have been very lucky that people with nerves of steel where in charge during those incidents. I dont think humanity should keep pushing its luck

Wait I thought Trump was a Russian Agent of Putin? Why would he do this.

Russia does benefit out of this mostly believe it or not. NATO has come on record and have said they dont want to turn the temperature and place mid range stuff on their turf at this time.While Russia has said they will respond as youd expect by going in to an arms Race.

As a matter of fact Bolton apparently is scheduled to meet with NATO with an explanation for all of this.

I am no conspiracy theorist by the way. However this is not good overall

 

[CORE]

The Earth is Flat (And he will make it Round Again)

 

[the_randomizer]

Can you FUCKS stop trying to destroy the world? Thank you! - Humanity

Every single government has assholes in it, one way or another. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I weep for the future.

 

[SG854]

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