The Illegal Immigration Non-Crisis in the USA

Discussion in 'World News, Current Events & Politics' started by cots, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. Cylent1

    Cylent1 Community Smart Ass!

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    The most communist country in the world!
    lets see you deny it now jist like every other SJW snot nosed brat does!
    And I will tell you just like I tell every bit of you bearded ladies, that 1+ 1 does = 2 and not whatever your fantasy for the day prescribes for you!!

     
    Last edited by Cylent1, Jul 7, 2019
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  2. Xzi

    Xzi A terrible fate fills you with determination

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    "When you vote...you are a citizen yourself, and there is not a situation where the voting rules somehow are transferred over and people start investigating et cetera. The sanctity of the vote is strictly confidential."

    Sounds like he either misunderstood the question or Cavuto is trying to take the last sentence out of context to suit his needs, but nowhere did he say it was legal for non-citizens to vote. And nowhere did he encourage that. As I've said twice already: if you're living in this country illegally, you'd have to be a dipshit to register to vote.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Jul 7, 2019
  3. th3joker

    th3joker GBAtemp Regular

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    natural selection should take its corse. america only wants the hard working aliens, too soft to walk and swim across, your not good enough.
     
  4. Cylent1

    Cylent1 Community Smart Ass!

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    I do agree with you that you have to be a real ignorant dumb ass to vote if you are illegal.
    But when the Faux POTUS tells illegals they can vote, there lies a major problem the the actual real citizens of this country.
    BRO... HE DID NOT SAY IT WAS NOT ILLEGAL EITHER! Are you the type of person that tries to stop a steel bladed fan with your hand?
     
    Last edited by Cylent1, Jul 7, 2019
  5. notimp

    notimp GBAtemp Addict

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    They still cant vote though.

    I wonder what that video tells you though. ;) To bad I will never know. ;)
     
  6. Xzi

    Xzi A terrible fate fills you with determination

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    Again, he didn't say that. It's just Faux News spewing more garbage and putting words in his mouth. When you vote, it is indeed confidential. Registering to vote, however, requires quite a lot of identifying information, and thus is far from confidential.

    Lol by that logic we should be deporting all the worthless idiots living in trailer parks chugging away at PBR every day.
     
  7. Cylent1

    Cylent1 Community Smart Ass!

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    You are right you will never know because you clearly do not know how to comprehend real life!
     
  8. SG854

    SG854 If It Bleeds, We Can Kill It

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    Mexico’s is mixed. Government with Private Industry. They have Universal Care but not every service is accessed free.

    And Universal Care doesn’t always mean single payer system like in Europe or Canada. In a sense U.S. has Universal Care since we provide people and illegals medical care which tax payers have to foot the bill.


    U.S. citizens scores higher then Mexico with Access to health care.

    Mexico at 62 out of 100
    U.S. at 81

    For comparison the National Average for all countries is 53.

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(17)30818-8/fulltext


    I don’t think Mexico’s covers LASIK Eye in their Universal Care.

    You have to compare apples and apples. What type of LASIK Eye procedure is U.S. getting compared to Mexico. If most Mexicans are getting the cheaper cutting then the average price Mexicans pay will be lower then most U.S. getting the more expensive no cutting which the average price they pay is higher. So then comparing what averages they pay is then not useful.

    You have to compare average prices for the services they offer to see what is cheaper instead of whats the average price they choose to pay.

    Like for example if most Americans buys a Ferrari, and most Mexicans buys the cheaper Nissan and then you say Americans pay more for the same service, this is not an apple and apple comparison.
     
    Last edited by SG854, Jul 7, 2019
  9. supersonicwaffle

    supersonicwaffle GBAtemp Regular

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    You're neglecting to mention that our health care system's quality is aboslute shite, that it's massively fucking over health care workers and disincentivzed working in health care to the point clinics are closing down entire wings.

    I'm neither for nor against it, as there isn't a perfect solution and any solution will produce victims but just not mentioning that we're in the midst of a care crisis in Germany strikes my as lying by ommision and not engaging in a good faith argument.
     
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  10. Xzi

    Xzi A terrible fate fills you with determination

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    Again though, Mexico is just one of many examples. Americans travel to other countries all the time, because even with the cost of travel, it's still way cheaper to get prescriptions filled and medical procedures done elsewhere. Without insurance in the US, a single hospital stay can put you in debt for life. The costs are undeniably out of control. Access to healthcare is not the same as access to affordable healthcare.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Jul 7, 2019
  11. SG854

    SG854 If It Bleeds, We Can Kill It

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    Which I’m for reducing costs the best way possible. So people won’t have to travel to other countries for cheaper prescriptions.
     
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  12. th3joker

    th3joker GBAtemp Regular

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    or deport all the black people and mexicans who live off the government and say africa or mexico is better.
     
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  13. Cylent1

    Cylent1 Community Smart Ass!

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    I just don't understand why if they hate America so much they will do anything to get here even if it involves child trafficking.
    Also why is not Cory Booker in jail for escorting an illegal alien across our border? He seriously went to Mexico and transported an illegal alien across the border!
     
  14. notimp

    notimp GBAtemp Addict

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    Not so in Austria (see OECD numbers.. ;) ). ;) There is also a demographic issue currently which leads to many of those problems (minus closing of wings.. ;) but still partly to wage gauging - because its the state that has to pay much of it).

    Im only "from germany" if it suits the argument.. ;)

    In Austria there are similar issues though. A large part of the population is older, so the part of GDP that has to be spent on them is larger. So the temptation is there to cut spending - where they might not notice it as much. Also - because its a demographic bump (there is a generation of mostly old people, then there is not), you dont want to invest into it - because after lets say 30 to 40 years you would be stuck with an industry thats suddenly much smaller in size. Solution: Robots.. ;) (I'm joking.. ;) Normally, import contracters from southeuropean countries.)

    This wouldnt be much different, if it was mostly privately run.

    The reason entire wings of hospitals are closing usually is - that "another hospital with the same capability is close by (as in close enough) and not used to capacity." This is done in an effort to prevent "double spending".

    I have doctors in my family - they dont like it one bit.. ;)
     
    Last edited by notimp, Jul 7, 2019
  15. supersonicwaffle

    supersonicwaffle GBAtemp Regular

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    The state may pay for much of it when it comes to hospitals or clinics but that’s ignoring the bigger picture. We have a crisis across all sectors of care and state run nursing homes only make up about 10%, not to mention regular practices which are privately run.

    I also have both doctors and health care workers in my family which is why I know that a health care worker in a practice only starts approaching average income after 15 years and climbing to the highest union negotiated pay grades. This is also in the south which is one of the wealthiest regions. Nursing homes here barely have qualified personnel and heavily rely on underpaid staff that just takes a 6 month training.

    It’s also worth mentioning other negative effects of price fixing like doctors in rural areas operating at much lower efficiency because of population density. House calls have a much bigger cost but get paid the same.

    Working in health care is highly disincentivized here and the quality suffers.
     
  16. notimp

    notimp GBAtemp Addict

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    You are disabling market mechanisms, yes - but -

    Population density would also be a "quality driver" in a purely market based economy as well though. I mean how does that argument go in physician cycles? "I want to relocate to the countryside - so I can jack up rates..?" ;)

    The issues in the care side of the bussiness probably are "Harz 4" (efficiency push) meets demographic bump. If you havent planned for that - its hard to propose short term solutions. And again - if you train staff right now - better, they will be out of a job in 20-30 years. So the structural solution seems to be "hire temp workers" - actually.

    (I know that there are agencies that hover up willing medical students or nurses in training (six months) from south european countries, because thats how Germany has decided to tackle the problem.

    And "work 20 years in germany - then live for the rest of your life back in Greece or Italy where your savings might be worth more", is an actually viable concept, for germany and the people involved (Dont know if thats why wage structures are designed the way you describe them)). Not so great for the source countries though (brain drain).

    That even bavarians have that issue is something that breaks my heart, really... ;)
     
    Last edited by notimp, Jul 7, 2019
  17. supersonicwaffle

    supersonicwaffle GBAtemp Regular

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    Which is why I said I’m neither for nor against it. It’s a very difficult situation.
    In rural areas you have to weigh access to expensive care against having any access at all.
    Overall you have to weigh access against quality and exploitation of the workforce.
    With regards to temp workers it’s fair to say the problem isn’t gonna vanish either, these workers will have made a home here over decades and are not gonna leave. If anything they will be more of a problem than better qualified personnel to the economy.
    Also, studies are expecting the population above 64 years old to rise by almost 5 million until 2035. That’s 16 years out, so forgive me that I believe an estimation of 20-30 years needed for care workers to be quite incorrect. In reality it’s likely much closer to 45 years which means someone starting now would be able to retire properly. Again, it’s also missing the point that we’re already missing a shitton of workers NOW.
     
    Last edited by supersonicwaffle, Jul 7, 2019
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  18. diggeloid

    diggeloid Advanced Member

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    Seems like everyone in this thread defending the mistreatment and deportation of immigrants are using the fact that they're criminals for entering the country illegally to justify their position.

    So wouldn't a possible solution be to let them stay? Make it easier to enter the country legally and even gain citizenship? Because that would mean that they're not illegal aliens anymore, just regular aliens. @cots mentioned that immigrants in his area can't get jobs because some employers don't hire illegal aliens, which means they resort to crime to survive. So making them legal would make it easier for them to find a job, and will also reduce the crime rate.

    It's also a more sustainable solution because even if we deport all the illegal aliens currently in the US, it's not going to stop more of them from coming in. Even if we build a border wall, the coyotes will find a way to get past it. I'm pretty sure they have ladders in Mexico, pickaxes, shovels, bulldozers, etc.

    Of course, this won't solve the problem of those damn brown people and non-english speakers in my country. But that's a separate issue; we're not conflating the two as a way to have our cake and eat it too, right?
     
  19. Pippin666

    Pippin666 SSF43DE Master

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    USA ctizens are just a bunch of wussies, scared of sick women and starving children.

    Those people have to sneak in the USA illegaly because because of the long waiting bureaucracy time. Most of those people live in poor country, under bad political condition and war because it fits US politics.

    Like, south american drug traffickers controlling and corrupting the police, abusing the population to do their durty work for the right to stay alive. Then the CIA let that drug enter the US in exchange of spy informations.

    One would think that after 9/11 the US population would understand that their gvt is a piece of lying douchbag, but no.

    They believe in lies from a wife-cheating-narcissic-rapist-scamartist prick and elect him as president.

    Super rich, but can't see his tax report. Super genius, but can't see his school result.

    Americans washed their hands of everything by blaming other.

    Enough said.

    Pip'
     
  20. cots
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    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    While I couldn't just your system I would welcome having the option to pay for private and better care, but as it is now promises like "you can keep your Doctors" fall on flat ears. With Medicare and Medicaid you're limited to receiving services from lower quality Doctors and facilities, basically whomever offers the lowest prices and usually what these insurance plans do is never pay the full amount of costs back to the doctors so the Doctors have to eat the costs, futher reducing the quality of care. Plus, you need authorization from your primary Doctor , who you can only choose from a short "approval list" to see any other type of Doctor and that also requires authorization from your insurance company and then you're limited even more to the places you can get these specialized services (like an endocrinologist). You're basically getting much poorer and limited quality services from using the current Obamacare system. If you have money though to spend, you can go to any Doctor you want and some of the best Doctors can only be seen this way. You won't see any Democratic leaders in the general public Doctors offices, they're using your tax money to get services you could never afford. Plus, it's not free as you're paying for it one way or the other. A mandated health care tax per person still means you're paying money for it.

    — Posts automatically merged - Please don't double post! —

    Did you hear Trump's now negotiating to pay drugmakers prices comparable to what they charge other countries. I wonder how the Liberal haters will try to spin that as a bad thing. Won't surprise me though, Trump wants to work out better prices for the shit China produces and suddenly the Lefties support child slavery and forced labor on minorities and then complain the next Switch may cost more. What exactly will the New Green Deal do to prices and will the results be temporary - answer, you'll be paying more for everything and it'll be permanent so a temporary price increase on your video gaming system will pail in comparison.

    — Posts automatically merged - Please don't double post! —

    They're criminals and being treated better than we treat some of our own citizens. Do it legally or GTFO.
     
    Last edited by cots, Jul 7, 2019
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