The Final Topic on Supercard vs. M3 (and some G6)

Discussion in 'NDS - Flashcarts and Accessories' started by ceraphis, Aug 14, 2006.

Aug 14, 2006
  1. ceraphis
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    Member ceraphis GBAtemp Regular

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    Just to preface, this is a topic that will hopefully end up containing everything you'd want to know about the differences between the Supercard and the M3. I tried to gather my thoughts as un-biased as possible, but remember, I have been happier about the M3 in the end than I was with my Supercard. Granted, I gave my supercard (CF) to my girlfriend and I actually still use it since it is one of the only cards that can singlehandedly transfer GBA savegames from original carts to its filesystem, but like I said, I like the M3 more. The main point of me starting this topic is because everywhere I looked, all I saw was Supercard users lauding the praises of their supercards, but I couldn't see anyone talking about what really is great about the M3 and what really makes it great.

    I got the Supercard CF in January when I got my first phat silver DS. It worked great for a long time. I never really liked the menu as everyone seems to agree about, it is ugly but quick with no pausing for a stupid disclaimer. I also got a M3 miniSD in June and a DS Lite and Superkey as an early birthday present from my girlfriend and then she had the Supercard CF and DS Phat and recently she traded it in for a DS Lite on my Gamestop warranty for a DS Lite by saying that the DS Download Play didn't work (what we didn't tell him was it was through an M3 DS Lite) but I digress. Later on I got my G6 Lite because I like to waste money and I knew I'd love it. Realhotstuff just shipped me a supercard lite today as well because I wanted to try it and it was the cheapest flush card so I bought it for my girlfriend's and her shiny new DS Lite.

    Anyways, that was just so you could know that I've experienced all the menu crap, saving problems, compatibility issues, etc. I probably know most of everything about these 3 cards now, including how they interact with each other and such. There are alot of other things about Supercard (they're all generally the same I believe) and M3 Lite (based off what I know about M3 miniSD....probably as close as you can get to knowing about M3 Lite right now) that you should know. I apologize if it is a little disoragnized, but I have a lot to say about them so I'd rather write more than spend my time organizing it into a pretty little walkthrough or something.

    1. The backup (not saves in general) system is probably the best at least in my opinion. There is no restarting for saves, but I'll talk about that when I discuss the M3. The thing you should know is that when you place games on your supercard, the only restriction is that the savegame and the converted ROM must be in the same folder. What I liked about this was that I could make separate folders for every game I had, and when I wanted to move game+savegame off or on the card, it was an easy cut+paste operation for every game I was interested. What's different about the M3 is that when you move games to or from the card, all your savegames have to be in a folder on the root called DSSAVE or correspondingly, GAMESAVE/GBASAVE for GBA games. What I didn't like about this was that in order to move as fast as possible when choosing games for the card, I decided to open two folders taking up half the space of the screen each and ctrl-click the left side (my computer's/M3's Rom storage) and then ctrl click the right side (my computer's/M3's save storage) then copy paste both at the same time. Ok whatever, I digress again. My point is that it's faster to transfer files in my experience using Supercard rather than M3.

    2. Not to rain on the M3's parade, there is a lot that makes up for the first part. The M3 has an extremely effective saving system, both for DS and GBA. Real-Time savegames aren't possible for the DS yet, but as an alternative, M3 allows you to have like 200 saves for every DS game. The Engrish used to make this possible in the M3 manager is a little unwieldy, but with a little cunning you can get very used to it. I used this in Animal Crossing to test out like 10 custom maps I made while in the process of trying to get my girlfriend interested in ACWW by writing a little message in Black and Pink Roses on her (newly made) town, all while not having to access the computer every time I wanted to try something new or take up lots of space on the card by making 15 copies of Animal Crossing like I would've had to do with Supercard (correct me if I'm wrong). On the GBA side, I am more than happy in every way with the M3's savegame menu. It allows you to have 3 real-time saves (more than enough) and again, 200 (maybe even more) regular savegames. In addition, you don't even have to make the 2nd or 3rd real-time save until you really need it, since the M3 itself will create one on the fly, and then you can delete it later if desired. GBA save menu points, and some DS save brownie points easily go to the M3 (assuming you care at all, of course). Only point of annoyance with M3 real-time saves is that it takes a few seconds to save the game when you do, but it's worth it. As a side note, the G6 even takes this further

    3. It's been said before, but I'll say it again, GBA compatibility on the supercard sucks. It really sucks. Many games don't run at all, others run too slow to care. This was one of the main reasons I got the M3 in the first place, and looking back, I'll boldly say I wish I got an M3 in the first place, although I appreciate the fact that since my girlfriend has had my supercard CF for a while now (yeah...in a DS Lite now, no less) she has been playing Mario Kart, ACWW, Metroid Prime and Tetris with me 3 states away. I digress again...Back on topic, the GBA compatibility really does add that much more value for me. I gave up trying to play GBA games on my Supercard quick after realizing no game seemed to impress me after seeing how slow they ran. All that needs to be said is that Supercard needs a GBA compatibility list, and I've never needed or found one for the M3. Go take a look at M3wiki.com, the best place to find DS compatibility for the M3 and you'll see their GBA compatibility list is like 10 titles long, with every other of the 2500 roms conspicuously absent.

    4. Now, at risk of being flamed by Supercard aficionados, I'll have to say this about it's DS Compatibility. It's good, nay GREAT for it's/their price. But...my experience with the M3's has been much better. OK, you might say "Mario Basket". And I'll give you that, but I'll also say right back at you..."Star Fox", and I also remember Rockman ZX and Tetris' little problem. Now take these words with a grain of salt, and remember the price difference between Supercard and M3 because they are only a couple of examples. But anyway, Tetris came out needing to save on a similarly savegamed original DS cart. OK....well there went my Meteos save....bang. Now maybe things have changed since then, when I used a big old purple superpass and meteos (Later, Tetris when I got fed up with the little save on DS cart thingy), but as I see at (in my experience) the trusted dualscene.net DS compatibility list, it looks like Rockman ZX has the same problem. If I still had that old setup, I guess bye bye to Meteos' save again. Then again, reinmoon can help with that I suppose. But OK my point is that I've never experienced such problems with the M3. Also, the thing nobody wanted to mention during the little "M3 SUXORZ"/"Supercard SUXORZ" little flame war about Mario Basket and then Starfox is that M3 released a patch that fixed the Mario Basket problem a day, maybe two days later after the problem occurred. I KNOW that it took Supercard longer, at least a week or two, maybe longer if I'm not mistaken to release a fix for Starfox, because I wasn't able to try multiplayer out against my now-Supercard-toting girlfriend before I left NJ to drive 3 hours home when Starfox's ROM came out.

    OK....that's enough for now. I'm winded from all this talking. I know there's something else I wanted to say between M3 and Supercard but I'll add it maybe a little later tonight. Just a little food for thought. tongue.gif

    OK actually, I take it back... I remembered three (hopefully the last) things, and they haven't been said yet, and I'd actually like to know what others think.

    5. It should be widely known that the M3 Lite has a side-loading microSD cart, and the Supercard Lite has a front loading one. Now, I used to think I would prefer a front loading one back when I was looking at the difference between Supercard CF and Supercard SD, and how M3 CF side loaded, yada yada yada. But my main concern was that it seemed to be common that it was hard to get the cards in and out of the DS and that the connections made strange sounds when you plugged it in/out. Well now that I've had an M3 miniSD and it seems all the cards now are made sleeker and fit nicer, I can tell you...I'd rather have a side-loader. It's happened many times where I've accidentally hit the card when it's sitting in there, and I've wondered if I wasn't as careful as I am, whether or not one day I'd just have lost my 35 dollar 1GB miniSD card. Also, It's really not that big a deal to unplug my M3 mini alot, since I do it anyway, switching between DS Lite and GB Micro. Also, I'd personally like there NOT to be a little slot for the microSD card noticeable from the outside, I like the whole "stealth" look. I guess the side/front loading really comes down to personal preference.

    6. In my opinion, the Supercard Lite is the LEAST likely to get switchable colors in the future. First, the comparably cheap cost gives them no real incentive to offere them...economically, theres no reason to. Sure it'd be great, but did they offered a change of color between the last carts? Ok maybe that's a little speculative, but what's with the matte purple CF, clear blue SD, clear purple miniSD, and don't forget again that they haven't released more than one color for their latest microSD cart, and nobody is complaining about it essentially. On the M3 front, considering what I've gathered over the past months, G6 and M3 are essentially the same company, with separate teams. No word yet about the menu differences but you have to admit, compatibility is very similar, little nuances like the similar boot up screen blah blah blah all I'm saying is that I'd bet that M3 will allow some sort of color customization with their "flush cart".

    7. Last but not least, yeah maybe the menu in the M3 is a little much, maybe they should allow you to "Supercard it up" I guess you could say, but it is what it is. It's made to have a lot of features. That said, when I switched from M3 to G6 menus, I liked it...A LOT. Just go look at my post about the G6 icons, nobody does that much work without caring a whole crap of a lot about his menu customization abilities. That said, my point is, the Supercard's menu isn't changing. Think about it, it's like a feature. Simplicity, for an affordable price. A DS cart for a DS, and it ouldn't get simpler without allowing you to psychically change the rom that will boot up before you turn on the DS. The M3 menu, however, has a lot of potential. One of their "features" is having a LOT of options, and I think they build that in fairly well. Also, lets speculate again for a bit, I'd say the M3 menu will change, for the better. If the G6 added iconifying, you can bet the M3 will be the next to do it. They're brothers, it goes without saying that one will build on the successes of the other. Would you feel more comfortable with a simple menu for a simple price, or do you want there to be a future for your menu? Anyways, thats all I have to say about that.

    Whew, I'm even more winded now, but I felt like all this had to be said. Read over my post again if you like, but really it all comes down to preference. Price can be a big factor, I know...but In my opinion I think you're getting your money's worth with an M3. Of course you could argue that if you never play GBA roms, and absolutely adore the Supercard's design, have a white DS lite, and don't care about any whiz bang added value. The Supercard Lite is without a doubt a wonderful starting flash card, I know I was amazed at even the Supercard CF when I got it, it was great. But now my tastes have changed, I realized what else was out there, and I knew the M3 was for me.

    At the very least, now you can't say nobody covered the M3's bases, right? Funny story: I just realized you said you already ordered SCLite from Kicktrading. Oh well, hopefully someone else will find my post helpful. [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]


    (I copied most of this from a previous post I made)

    Let me clarify, that I am getting an SC Lite for my girlfriend today, so I will try it out and see if it made improvements to what I experienced on my SC CF.

    Also, When I say GBA compatibility is bad, I mean that what I experienced GBA-side with my SC a lil while ago was enough for me to get pissed off at the terrible playing of the games I decided to put on my card, which made me forget GBA entirely, and later get an M3 so that I could play GBA games. Since I got the M3, I have sometimes had and enjoyed more GBA games on my card than DS games. There's really not much else to say about the GBA compatibility.

    Also, I was asked to talk about the saving systems more specifically. On my Supercard CF, for DS Games, it was really simple. You played a game, and, assuming it worked, you never had to manually save or watch the card save. So it's great in that respect. However, GBA game saving was a really bad experience for me. Whereas the M3 (and G6) has a really great saving system (although a tad slow when actually writing the saves), The Supercard had a couple really bad aspects. First of all, at least for an old phatty DS, it seemed to strain my fingers when I had to press whatever silly combination I had to to get to either type of save (realtime vs. regular save). On the M3, you hit LRAB and then select an option. To each his own, but I liked the M3's better. Also, if you didn't manually back up GBA saves before you powered off, you lost the save unless you remembered very quickly to do some process to hopefully get the save before it was deleted into the void. I lost many saves this way.

    This may not apply any more, but my Supercard CF ate the battery up like a hungry....something. Whatever, no simile required, it killed my battery very very quickly. My new M3 miniSD around June was the complete opposite, however, and it lasted a very long time. I'd have to say almost twice or three times as much as the Supercard. For all I know, with SC Lite, the battery is not drained as much. If so, great. But I do know this was a great difference between the M3 and supercard for me.

    OK, anyways if you have ANYTHING to say that you like/hate about the M3 or supercard, please post it in this topic. Hopefully this will clear up some confusion among potential buyers as to the pros and cons between these two seemingly most-popular cards, and help them to make a more informed decision.

    Also, feel more than free to disagree partly or completely with my post, but please try to make your arguments rational and logical as opposed to simple "You Sux, SUPACARD ROXORZ!", so that I have reason to rethink or discuss my opinions later on. [​IMG]
     


  2. 754boy

    Banned 754boy :D

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    I'm tired of these kinda posts. I love my SC brand because it was the first flashcart I ever had and I'm familiar with the sotware so I'm gonna stick to it. All these products do the same thing so honestly I dont see how one is better than the other.

    So, my opinion is this: It came down to price. I think the M3 is cool and all but I hate the price. GBA roms can kiss my ass so I went with the SC cuz NDS compatibility is equal and price is lower.
     
  3. science

    Member science science rules

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    I got supercard because the other one (I think it was M3) looked really big and more expensive. Like why would I pay more for something bulkier?
     
  4. Nocturno

    Member Nocturno GBAtemp Fan

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    overall I like m3 more, but one thing I like more about supercard is the case, it look like it is more robust while m3´s case is kind of loose in the inferior parts.. and this goes to g6 lite too..
     
  5. Hanafuda

    Member Hanafuda GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    it's all about the direct saving to the media card for me. Supercard doesn't need a battery, and I think except for the miniSD (which I have) it doesn't have one, either. I'm watching what goes on for the next 5-6 months before "upgrading", but it'll probably be for the SCLite. I do wish it had better GBA compatibility, but I didn't really buy it for GBA, so I'll live with that. I've got a good GBA cart anyway.

    Also, we haven't seen yet that the M3Lite will be able to equal the SC's speed optimization on microSD. It's a pretty safe bet they'll figure it out I guess, but EZ hasn't, so maybe its something SC's got "exclusive."

    By the time I make my mind up of how to upgrade from my SCminiSD, SC and M3 will probably be announcing their DS-card sized models, after they figure out what DSLink and DS-X are up to.
     
  6. kalibar

    Member kalibar GBAtemp Regular

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    gee fuckin' six
     
  7. leoedin

    Member leoedin GBAtemp Regular

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    great write up

    its worth noting that the company behind the M3 actually hold a license with sandisk for their hi-speed SD technology, so they are able to read and write SD cards faster than other companies. Its also worth noting that the M3 has 32MB of RAM built in, which can be used to swap out parts of a game for faster loading.
     
  8. Hunter

    Former Staff Hunter i'ma stuffup the board

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    anyone wanting to turn this thread into flames will see a nice BANNED! in their member groups
     
  9. pelago

    Member pelago Member

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    What a long (and somewhat difficult to read) post ceraphis. I admire your optimism that this will be the final SC vs M3 topic!
     
  10. Jefklak

    Member Jefklak Advanced Member

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    Can someone confirm my last post for M3 or SC Lite or so?
     
  11. Linkiboy

    Member Linkiboy GBAtemp Testing Area

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    To the "many copies of Animal Corssing due to saves" issue: that can easily be resolved by copying all your saves into the same folder, and using DSOrganize to rename when you want ot use a different save, it takes like 3 secodns.
     
  12. DjoeN

    Member DjoeN Captain Haddock!

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    Te problem is that he add's his point of view from an old FW/software on his supercard CF

    Supercard CF/SD/MiniSD/Lite both work great, Same for G6/G6 Lite and the M3 series.

    It really is up to the user what he wants

    G6 series: Limmited to 4G max (512mb), nice interface, bit of clumsy software for starters, good GBA support, Homebrew is descent supported on SC
    M3 Series: Works great, has good GBA support, (see G6 about there pc software), use of memorycards till ..gb, Homebrew is descent supported on SC
    Supercard series: Works Great, The lite has a bit better NDS support (Ultimate spiderman works perfect on it, (it's the only rom with probs on supercard SD/MiniSD))
    GBA support isn't that great but ok for most users, Homebrew is descent supported on SC, use of memorycards till ..gb.

    Some ppl like it that you don't have to remove the supercard to write games to the memorycard, also supercard is a tight fit in your DS/DS Lite for the first weeks of use [​IMG] you can solve that by sanding it a bit down [​IMG]

    M3 has no lite yet, but i bet it will be of the same quality as the M3 CF/SD i bet

    For the changebility of the covers, it would be a problem on the SC Lite:

    http://users.skynet.be/DuNe/NDS/sclite.html

    SC Lite uses 2 PCB's, connected by a very breakable flatcable, U have to bend the first pcb up to remove the screws for the second pcb, this can result in breaking some traces on it. Anyway if you like to change covers, G6 sends a few with it (no black so far :/ ) hope M3 will to.

    I'm happy with my Supercard, i have them all and i have most M3's as well as G6 and i still preffer my supercard minisd above all
    (think the reason is cause i test all stuff on my phat grey DS for my comp. list This way i keep my lite only for my real game play.)
     
  13. rkenshin

    Member rkenshin GBAtemp Fan

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    Or, ask romman to support multiple saves, problem solved..
     
  14. pelago

    Member pelago Member

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    Actually several people, me included, got a black cover with their G6 Lite.
     
  15. kalibar

    Member kalibar GBAtemp Regular

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    Word up, my main homeslice -- black case in da house! I ordered from KickTrading, and I thought that case looked darker than Navy in those pictures.
     
  16. yuyuyup

    Member yuyuyup GBAtemp Psycho!

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    m3 is so great I crap my pants every time I think about it
     
  17. Hanafuda

    Member Hanafuda GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    I've also gotta ask about this claim, cuz if M3 had a license for SD, there never would have been any slowdowns on the M3-SD and M3miniSD versions. As I understand it, its because of the lack of the SD license that all the carts (M3, SC, EZ) have to run at MMC speeds rather than SD speeds.

    Based on the trickle of info we have on M3Lite so far though, it looks like they've also got whatever microSD speed trick that SCLite uses.

    Of course both SCLite and M3Lite will be obsolete by Christmas, so doesn't really make much difference in the long run.
     
  18. heyyouguys

    Member heyyouguys GBAtemp Fan

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    If by obsolete you are saying there will be new equipment, I agree. Though I most likely will not upgrade my sclite unless the new "whatever" can make me a sandwich afterwards. [​IMG]
     
  19. gokong

    Newcomer gokong Member

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    ditto!
     
  20. dongle

    Newcomer dongle Member

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    I don't disagree that there will be new products by year's end, but what major changes are we going to see that will make the M3l/SCl obsolete?
     

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