1. monkeyman4412

    monkeyman4412 Gbatemp's moronic trash
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    What on earth have I returned to. Most of @Waygeek said is unrelevent, primarily due to the fact he's mostly just spewing stuff out creating what seems to me like strawmans and or often making misleading arguments. Basically in a nutshell for the last two responses I've seen. (not worth my time responding to all of them due to how stupid this is)
    waygeek mentioned solar cycles, notimp proved no it's wrong, in regards to effecting climate change. Which waygeek refused, and attacked him claiming notimp is a flat earther, and then reinstating his argument of solar cycles, despite the fact it never addressed notimps point that has no effect on climate change in general, or to the degree we see. Which resulted in notimp attacking back/defending.
    Honestly, waygeek you sound like a moron. Kinda like another idiot on this thread. (morovan)
     
    Last edited by monkeyman4412, May 22, 2020
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  2. Waygeek

    Waygeek GBAtemp Fan
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    lmfao the fact that you don't even speak English despite being a yank (it's irrelevant, you absolute genius) renders anything you have to say absolutely worthless to even read.

    "Honestly, waygeek you sound like a moron. Kinda like another idiot on this thread."

    Deeply, deeply ironic. 'unrelevent' LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    Your tag suits you perfect.
     
  3. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    EU proposes climate taxes to finance the 'rebuild' after the Covid-19 crises.

    https://taxfoundation.org/eu-budget-proposal-next-generation/

    I'm actually somewhat fine with that.
     
    Last edited by notimp, May 28, 2020
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  4. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    Planet of the Humans (Michael Moore backed documentary that focused on energy efficiency/yield issues on renewables, environmental destruction through some renewables (biomass, mountain top removal), and billionaire involvement in prepping up the scene (other side stated, that they never took any money out of the ventures)) was taken down by youtube, after gaining more than 8 mio views. Backstory as far as I can tell is, that one of the participants on the 'this cant exist' side, claimed copyright infringement on a 30 seconds clip - which would have fallen under fair use in any documentary ever -- if we werent talking about youtube (cloud provider, that cant check this for every user, because they dont have enough people to screen, and dont want to take the legal risk).

    Youtube didnt issue a warning, like normally, so filmmakers could have removed that part, but took down the entire thing immediately.

    I call foul play.
     
    Last edited by notimp, May 31, 2020
  5. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    From goodwill to societal change:


    All grassroots.. ;)
     
  6. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    Thank you Dennis, thank you! *applause, please*

     
  7. monkeyman4412

    monkeyman4412 Gbatemp's moronic trash
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    Yes yes it does suite me well. spelling mistakes can happen you know. (sometimes people just throw the wrong prefix) Glad we can agree that a spelling mistake is all you have to clench at while you have no response to the contents of what I've said. (Probably because what I said was pretty much accurate. And you have no counter points. So it still stands, your arguments are still rendered null.)
     
    Last edited by monkeyman4412, Jun 9, 2020
  8. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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  9. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    First, Planet of the Humans is back online, with the 4 seconds clip of an acid lake in china removed, that was used by the cancel culture folks to remove it from youtube.

    Second the films director GIbbs is now just salty enough, that he stopped pulling punches - when pointing at what hasnt picked up as the messaging of the film, but what has. Which turns out to be actually somewhat interesting. (See: h**ps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ-rZAtWXyA - small warning, this is the Chris Hedges program on RT, so expect the moderation to add a slight spin at least.. ;) (Hedges in this interview is mostly useless and plays devils advocate.. :) ) )

    US 'renewable energy' is still 44.5% Biomass (with wind the fastest growing (currently at 22% of all renewables)) - general projected growth of renewable energy within the US is still positive, but less so than in the past 20 years. By 2050, renewable energy is expected to account for less than 16% of total US energy consumption, and less than 25% of their electrical energy consumption.

    (Germany has pledged 100% renewable electric energy consumption by 2050.)

    And imho even more shockingly, China only has 3x the wind energy capacity of germany, and the US doesnt even have 2x. On solar china has about 4x the capacity of germany, and while that sounds nicer, actual yield of solar power in Germany is lower, than for wind.
    src: http://css.umich.edu/factsheets/us-renewable-energy-factsheet
    src: https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/145159/solar-powered-china
    --

    What Gibbs doesnt get is, that to get renewable energy developed, you need to look at this as a business, so if in the US biomass is currently more viable, you push biomass - with the idea hopefully being to expand other sectors (wind is the fastest growing), as they become more viable, because biomass probably has less growth potential.. ;)

    Looking at current US renewable numbers and trends vs what would be needed for climate goals (and eventually what would be needed to replace fossile based energy - although this is an entirely different story, with the viewpoint much further in the future), I entirely understand the pessimistic outlook Gibbs is selling.

    Of course, PR has to stay positive - which is an aspect they also talk about as having gotten as a response, in the RT video.

    edit: More facts and numbers:
    https://www.engineering.com/Designe...mans-Is-The-Film-Scientifically-Accurate.aspx (Although pumped hydro is not a scalable storage solution. ;) )


    edit: Also, someone has to explain to me, why according to the first source Biomass accounts for 44% of US renewable energy production, while by this source ( https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3 ) it only accounts for 8% a year later.. (What?) edit: Ah, probably got it.. Biomass would be mostly used for heat and fuel generation, not electricity generation, so if you look at it through the prism of just electrical energy production you get the smaller value. Probably. :)

    edit:

    Primary energy consumption (thats everything) US vs Germany (for germany the numbers are from 2017), to be able to compare percentage values:

    US:
    [​IMG]
    src: https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/us-energy-facts/

    Germany:
    [​IMG]
    src: http://www.fnr.de/fileadmin/allgeme...e_basisdaten_bioenergie_2018_engl_web_neu.pdf

    I draw two conclusions, one - we are still in the same ballpark of renewable energy production all things considered, two - that said, germany still has a more export oriented economy, with more industrial production in country. US should have outsourced them to mexico by now.. ;) (edit: Yup, quick google for 'industrial production, percentage of gdp' shows, that germany has 2x the amount of industry still in country compared to the US. :) )
     
    Last edited by notimp, Jun 24, 2020
  10. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    Last edited by notimp, Jul 1, 2020
  11. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    More insight into a liberal leftist perspective of the future:


    First talk is entirely BS, second talk is fully naive, but with an interesting insight on 'we need to brainwash people into thinking less is more', third talk should be better. ;)

    edit: Oh, there is no third talk. Pitty. (But Mazzucato should speak on this topic next month. I'll update the thread with her position then.)

    edit2: The discussion goes a little bit into why everyone wants to kill GDP as a comparative measurement.

    Comments are deactivated.

    see also
     
    Last edited by notimp, Aug 11, 2020
  12. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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  13. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    Next issue for europe (not sure how big). "Value added" on the electric car revolution is largely in energy storage (batteries, charging tech).

    Germany is pushing for investments in that sector to prep up its car industry (to play a role in car manufacturing in the future). Currently to build batteries you need lithium.

    Here is how known lithium reserves are distributed around the world (in Mio tons):
    [​IMG]
    https://www.dw.com/de/natrium-statt-lithium-die-akkus-der-zukunft/a-54512116 (german)

    What germany and africa can produce will not be enough for european demand. Long story short - value add on batteries in germany has to come through innovation in that sector, or there isnt any. In addition currently we have no R&D advantage.

    And now we reflect the position of the green and social movements in country again. "Show the rest of the world how its done, and that it can be done". While as a first mover you get all the advantages of 'being unsure if the US will ever become a market you can sell to (next election basically might decide that)' and having to innovate like heck to be competitive at all.

    In essence - same as it ever was (recently) (we never had that many natural resources) - but now, batteries and cars, essentially are tech that you can manufacture anywhere in the world, so competition increased.

    Other forms of energy storage (like the kinetic tower thingy built in italy) dont solve energy distribution (power delivery (when needed, over longer distances is still an issue)).

    edit: Also notice how the middle east is not showing up on that map.
     
    Last edited by notimp, Aug 11, 2020
  14. Gon Freecss

    Gon Freecss Privacy Advocate
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  15. Lacius

    Lacius GBAtemp Legend
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    I don't think I've ever heard anybody claim that she was a climate expert.
     
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  16. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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    Too reductionist.

    Thunberg is just the 'Joan of Arc' for the masses. (If I had a dime for every time I heard a current time philospher say 'finally - something that worked').

    Doesnt mean, that the issue is bogus.
    Doesnt mean, that what Thunberg said was bogus (one of her main 'science advisers' also is on a board that advices Merkel f.e. (but Merkel didn't listen to more recently.. ;) ).

    How it works is basically as follows: Everything goes. In love, in war, and PR.

    Thunberg is a child, therefore climate change cant be real - doesnt work as an argument. ;) Thats just... something you say, because it makes you feel good. :)

    Why do you need a 'Joan of Arc' figure for the masses? Because you have to induce political change to 'curb' corporate and economic interests in general, at first. So you need political action. So you need the masses to agree that this is a relevant cause.

    And because - arguably, you have to change peoples 'models' of what a desirable living in the future would consist of (growth?). So people have to vote for a state that reduces their own economic outlook eventually (around 2030, 2035), for a more long term goal.

    Issue: This impacts the poorest people most. (F.e. moving away from fossile fuel subsidies. (No cars for poor people?))

    Issue: Growth will only kick back in (probably at a lower level) at a later stage. (Probably too late for Millennials.)

    Issue: Feels like a religion (goal future orientated, tendencies contra economic growth, why is someone (pretty much actually) indoctrinating the children?!). And features boomer warcries like 'For our grandchildren!'. (While boomers still dont invest in climate action, in large numbers, as long as they are living, because they need that money to make their children do as they please. (Carrot on a stick.) Roughly spoken. So boomers now demand that the state should whip everyone, just enough. :) (At least in Europe.) So that they dont have to do something personally. :) )


    edit: Wanted to post a source for 'Greta science advisor' (one of them - mainly called that way by the press, because he himself mentioned it.. ;) ), but it turns out, that some more extreme corners of the web were busy doing a hitjob on him, and grabbing the google search terms for "Stefan Rahmstorf advisor greta". So to sum up - according to probably the same people, Greta makes that stuff up, so you cant believe her, and gets fed by an ultra radical climate alarmist, that made a businessmodel out of predicting... (Hes a scientist. That gets public grants.)
    edit: Here is at least the social media post: https://www.facebook.com/gretathunb...-for-climate-impact-research/800773206957168/

    edit2: Oh, and my personal issue with it, of course: It gives Boomers an excuse to dictate their childrens behavior pretty much to their grave (as a generation they also are larger in numbers, so politically...). It gives intellectual elites a reason to advocate for international cooperation, the need for an ethicality that pretty mich cant do much for the little person, because they always would decide against what was áctually needed. An excuse for not having to deal with the outcomes of globalization in the west. An excuse to intermingle with at least one sort of activist again. (Which then give an impression of societal progress.) A reason to push people faster into whatever gets designated as needed change. A reason not to talk about further cuts in social spending (if you also need to spend for climate action, and are reducing GDP you are lacking funds).

    A reason to feel good for investing in developing countries mainly (the argument there is actually solid - but doing that while you are facing a political backlash because of the impacts of globalization is - something).

    While indoctrinating children in mass events. ('Politicizing them' to say exactly the same thing, out loud, all choir boy/girl in appearance.)
    Making them think, that they are active to make a difference - which wile true, doest eliminate the fact, that all of this has been on the UN agenda from even before the Greta hype started, was manufactured to get public support behind ongoing UN level action. Was top down in organization structure. (At least from a certain point forward (when you hear Guterres tauting more financing opportunities prior to the NY summit, ... when in my country the popular movement was founded by...)

    All of this basically could warrant social revolt - which is exactly what you cant have, because then climate change would even be more catastrophic. Great. So shut up and take it? ;)
     
    Last edited by notimp, Aug 12, 2020
  17. notimp

    notimp Well-Known Member
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