Russia jails Jehovah's Witness for being a Jehovah's Witness

[FAST6191]

Saw this in a thumbnail for another thread but thought it worth having here
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ars-in-jehovahs-witnesses-purge-idUSKCN1PV0W2
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...s-jailed-for-six-years-in-russia-in-crackdown

Russia has been having a bit of fun and games with religion for some years now ( https://gbatemp.net/threads/russian...ce-for-playing-pokemon-go-in-a-church.470334/ for a nice 2017 incident), and their case study is held to be an interesting one in general -- the general religiosity/religiousness of countries tends to decrease with time*, the main exception being Russia and other places that were forced to stop because of the whole communist lark.

Anyway it seems they have somewhat criminalised the Jehovah's Witnesses and this is the first case (possibly of many) wherein an adherent has been sentenced for the crime of simply being one, using laws on a par with ones aimed at terrorists and such like.

Now while I find most nominally Christian sects amusing I have absolutely no love for the Watchtower** , and they probably have no love for me (I might have helped a few ex members get back in touch with people, or otherwise back on their feet, making their shunning rather less effective than it can be), but this I find this to be very dubious on the part of Russia.

*a nice selection of videos thanks to Noel Plum makes a good start





**Their means, methods and approaches to the world I find horrific, and take great satisfaction in helping to dismantle. See any number of ex witness discussions/videos/whatever if you want to go further there -- the articles above might give you the impression it would be just like banging up some random baptists of something, I would however make a distinction here and categorise them far closer to cult than not. Still not dangerous enemies of the people though.

 

[spotanjo3]

Very sad. Russia is very wrong to jail Jehovah Witness because they are Jehovah's Witness. I know Russia is a stronger Catholic religion. To me, that is not called loved and respect. Disgusting. Horrible cold heartless people like that. I hope that Jehovah's Witness will be freed because its in their own right.


FAST6191,

You have no love for them and you think they might not love you ? Wow, you are CRUEL. JW are wonderful people and very friendly. Very kindly more than I know in many false Catholic Churches. I respect them and I listen. They are very nice people, really. I know because I am Catholic (No more) and I have seen many Catholic Churches are snobs and not friendly while Sunday Mass. And they just look down at you in Catholic Church. I know because I was an altar boy and I saw everything. Wow. Disgusting catholic people.

 

[Owenge]

Cold War V2?

 

[FAST6191]

Cold War V2?

Over this? I doubt it a lot. Russia has a far greater track record of suspect concern for human rights in the past, presently, and otherwise, and that is seldom held a great justification for invading/properly sanctioning somewhere.

 

[AmandaRose]

Very sad. Russia is very wrong to jail Jehovah Witness because they are Jehovah's Witness. I know Russia is a stronger Catholic religion. To me, that is not called loved and respect. Disgusting. Horrible cold heartless people like that. I hope that Jehovah's Witness will be freed because its in their own right.


FAST6191,

You have no love for them and you think they might not love you ? Wow, you are CRUEL. JW are wonderful people and very friendly. Very kindly more than I know in many false Catholic Churches. I respect them and I listen. They are very nice people, really. I know because I am Catholic (No more) and I have seen many Catholic Churches are snobs and not friendly while Sunday Mass. And they just look down at you in Catholic Church. I know because I was an altar boy and I saw everything. Wow. Disgusting catholic people.

My encounters with Jehovah's Witness is very different to yours. 3 times I have had my door knocked by 3 different Jehovah's Witness. Each time I have told them I am not interested in hearing what that have to say and all 3 times they have tried to force their way into my home while shouting abuse at me. 3 times I have had to call the police on them. I have also witnessed Jehovah's Witness verbally abuse people on the street. Sorry but in my opinion they are horrible people

 

[spotanjo3]

My encounters with Jehovah's Witness is very different to yours. 3 times I have had my door knocked by 3 different Jehovah's Witness. Each time I have told them I am not interested in hearing what that have to say and all 3 times they have tried to force their way into my home while shouting abuse at me. 3 times I have had to call the police on them. I have also witnessed Jehovah's Witness verbally abuse people on the street. Sorry but in my opinion they are horrible people

Sorry to hear that. You are Catholic ? Or just an atheist ?

Anyway.. What they did was wrong. My experienced with Jehovah's Witness knocking at someone else's and someone said he/she wasn't interested and JW respected their wish and move on. They never knock on someone's house ever again. Obviously, those jw are properly and understood Bible. Jesus himself said if someone isn't respect then knock your shoes's dust off and walked away. Jesus means that dont knock at their door again ever because they weren't interested. Its called RESPECT. Those people does that to you are wrong.

And I have heard from someone who experienced woman who was JW but she was VERY cruel and mean to people but she was JW. Obviously, those people became JW doesn't understand what they are doing and they dont understand what Bible is telling them to do. God is loved and God is happy. Obviously, those people are confused or misunderstood.

I understand what you mean. Sorry about your experienced with them. They are wrong. Doesn't mean all JW are like that. No.

 

[DinohScene]

History always repeats itself but we're a couple of years early for pogroms and another kristall nacht.

I meself am not religious and I'll never be so I don't care to much, however jailing people based upon their religious beliefs is silly.

 

[ShadowOne333]

If you knew how they operate, you'd jail them too.

 

[FAST6191]

Missed the later edit.

FAST6191,

You have no love for them and you think they might not love you ? Wow, you are CRUEL. JW are wonderful people and very friendly. Very kindly more than I know in many false Catholic Churches. I respect them and I listen. They are very nice people, really. I know because I am Catholic (No more) and I have seen many Catholic Churches are snobs and not friendly while Sunday Mass. And they just look down at you in Catholic Church. I know because I was an altar boy and I saw everything. Wow. Disgusting catholic people.

I know you have something of a history with them (certainly we have discussed it in the past). As you asked though

I really don't like the shunning thing they do to ex members (apostates in their terminology), and the rather closed off nature before then when it comes to outsiders. For the former then you commonly see people deny their kids any kind of conversation if they have left the fold... that is fucked up on so many levels for me.

I don't like the watchtower organisation's higher ups. I am about 10 years out of knowing who they are and their various abuses so you might tell me they have changed, however that I have not seen them broadcast that far and wide says most of what I would need to know.

I don't like how they constantly revise their scriptures when they run into a problem, and then try to discourage people from reading the older versions.

I don't like their logic with regards to blood transfusions, and find it very difficult to watch people that really want to live ultimately die or suffer horribly because of a very old line of thought, one with no scientific or even widely accepted religious basis, that has stuck around into the modern world.

I don't like their approaches to their members getting educations, and the nature of the family units they try to promote.

You say I should visit them and see. That would be another part of the problem -- they commonly employ a technique called love bombing, which is well known to psychology as having all sorts of odd effects. If you are going to employ suspect tactics like that rather than trying to stand on intellectual merits we are going to have a problem.

I have had fewer issues with the knocking on the door people (though I have seen cases where they have not, to say nothing of the fun and games I have seen with people not so mentally well or with some measure of learning difficulties) but I know the magic words there (for others playing along then "I'm an apostate" works very well).

Also I am fairly sure they would not care for me. As mentioned I have previously helped people that left get in contact with their other family members that have left. I have got them set up with a job, some skills (higher education and serious skills are discouraged, which makes leaving that much harder on a financial level), helped them deal with the paperwork for the modern world, and otherwise get a means to earn something, and sometimes helped them get other family members out as well. I was not particularly subtle about it either at times, and those they occasionally sent to "persuade" people back I had less than pleasant dealings with. I don't know if they know my name or have photos*, but my deeds were known to various people there at points.

*I am presently near where I did a lot of this in the past (technically a different kingdom hall but people will have gone to the town with the other one where I was at for the previously mentioned stuff to get things), such that those that try to sell people on the lifestyle (you will usually see them with a nice sign saying something like "have you ever truly thought about god", white with dark blue square containing JW.org) at various car boot sales, markets and whatnot could reasonably know who I am. Never detected any displeasure at my appearance from them though, and while most sit there those few that do reach out do so seemingly oblivious of my past interactions with their group. It has been some years since all that, and I have not done anything terribly overt during that time, so maybe I slipped off the radar.


All that said, and with all my misgivings with the group, I am still going to look harshly upon Russia for their actions here.

 

[spotanjo3]

Okay. Everyone changed. I said nothing.

 

[gman666]

They're taking a "no soliciting" sign to the next level... In all seriousness, this is very sad and I hope they (Jehovas) find religious freedom elsewhere if not in their home country.