Re strikes of actors and writers in 2023. Is anybody caring?

[FAST6191]

Background. Originally the writers guild (union) responsible for no small amount of US TV and film went on strike. Pay and conditions coming up, in this case residual pay from streaming (seems you get a continuous cut for things you write even if nominally a work for hire type arrangement) and wanting assurances of so many people in the writing rooms, more interesting for many is they want assurances AI will not be used in the writing process. They have since been joined by the screen actors guild (actors union for much the same) and while the directors are contractually unable to strike it seems to be supported there as well, similar pay concerns and also some questions about AI (scan an actor's face and you can probably get it done with just that if not now then very soon). Some in Europe may also be joining at some point in the not too distant.
With just the writers out much could proceed, though hampered somewhat (you tend not to write the script and pass it off and have to be around for rewrites throughout shooting and even maybe a bit later). The money people in Hollywood (who don't have that much money right now) have also intimated that it is going to be a showdown on who blinks first with them prepared to be in for the long haul (with said lack of money they might not be able to last so very long, but probably longer than the actors and writers) or indeed use it as a purge. The AI thing also seems to be a hard limit for both camps (existential threat to the former, not employing it an existential threat to the latter).

Ignoring my general ambivalence towards unions (especially national ones) and my questions on how reasonable the claims are (residuals is nice if you can get it but I don't know why it wants to be assured, I will hire as many as I need to and boo luddites vis a vis the AI stuff) my question is then how much is it likely to trouble you?
So I was around/paying attention for the 2007 writers strike (might have even been in the US for it) and several shows were impacted, storylines truncated, episode counts reduced.. and actually bothered me a bit, might even find a post around here to that effect.
Nowadays I don't watch TV, might watch something that others would stream in the future maybe and frankly trying to find anything good these days from Hollywood/the US film and TV industry is difficult in the extreme (actually been quite enjoying some things South Korea, India and Japan are putting out), and part of the reason said studios have no money is because I am seemingly not unique in this -- between cord cutters (made may of their TV stations not worthless but worth an awful lot less, streaming has also somewhat nailed the DVD market too) and dubious domestic returns (make good films maybe, start by finding some good writers) then they are hurting. Indeed I only know a strike is on because some internet videos like to point and laugh, and ponder numbers.

 

[Przetrosz]

The strikes will have a strong impact on the majority of upcoming Hollywood movies and series. Many of them will be delayed, and some may even be suspended. This means fewer new productions in theaters and on streaming platforms in the years to come. People paying monthly subscriptions for streaming platforms will probably face the question of whether to give up one of them.

 

[hippy dave]

I've got viewing backlog coming out of my arse, let them strike.

 

[Veho]

The previous writers' strike ruined a whole bunch of shows that either got cancelled, had seasons chopped down from 30 to 10 episodes with no resolution, or were finished by interns, because the producers decided to plow ahead regardless. It also gave rise to reality shows.

 

[RJmiles]

Background. Originally the writers guild (union) responsible for no small amount of US TV and film went on strike. Pay and conditions coming up, in this case residual pay from streaming (seems you get a continuous cut for things you write even if nominally a work for hire type arrangement) and wanting assurances of so many people in the writing rooms, more interesting for many is they want assurances AI will not be used in the writing process. They have since been joined by the screen actors guild (actors union for much the same) and while the directors are contractually unable to strike it seems to be supported there as well, similar pay concerns and also some questions about AI (scan an actor's face and you can probably get it done with just that if not now then very soon). Some in Europe may also be joining at some point in the not too distant.
With just the writers out much could proceed, though hampered somewhat (you tend not to write the script and pass it off and have to be around for rewrites throughout shooting and even maybe a bit later). The money people in Hollywood (who don't have that much money right now) have also intimated that it is going to be a showdown on who blinks first with them prepared to be in for the long haul (with said lack of money they might not be able to last so very long, but probably longer than the actors and writers) or indeed use it as a purge. The AI thing also seems to be a hard limit for both camps (existential threat to the former, not employing it an existential threat to the latter).

Ignoring my general ambivalence towards unions (especially national ones) and my questions on how reasonable the claims are (residuals is nice if you can get it but I don't know why it wants to be assured, I will hire as many as I need to and boo luddites vis a vis the AI stuff) my question is then how much is it likely to trouble you?
So I was around/paying attention for the 2007 writers strike (might have even been in the US for it) and several shows were impacted, storylines truncated, episode counts reduced.. and actually bothered me a bit, might even find a post around here to that effect.
Nowadays I don't watch TV, might watch something that others would stream in the future maybe and frankly trying to find anything good these days from Hollywood/the US film and TV industry is difficult in the extreme (actually been quite enjoying some things South Korea, India and Japan are putting out), and part of the reason said studios have no money is because I am seemingly not unique in this -- between cord cutters (made may of their TV stations not worthless but worth an awful lot less, streaming has also somewhat nailed the DVD market too) and dubious domestic returns (make good films maybe, start by finding some good writers) then they are hurting. Indeed I only know a strike is on because some internet videos like to point and laugh, and ponder numbers.
Well, there will be more time to read books. No film or series can compare to a good book. I think this is hype that will get to the point where good writers will be appreciated even more. It's like writing for students who rushed to the gpt chat in the hope that it would solve all their problems, only to find that services like https://ca.edubirdie.com/write-my-essay-for-me are out of the competition if you need a quality essay. It will be interesting to see where this strike goes — stocking up on popcorn.

As I understand it, writers are outraged that AI will take their work, and it is beneficial for production to replace human labor and automate some processes. Many industries are facing this at the moment. As for the consequences, the purpose of the strike is what Przetrosz writes about. Just my opinion

 

[AsPika2219]

Some movies, tv etc release dates was changed because of strike...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...d_by_the_2023_Writers_Guild_of_America_strike

Thanks to strikes, some movies, TV etc was affected. Some was not and will continues normally.

 

[CoolMe]

It is taking a long time, hopefully they reach what they're after soon, as it's affecting alot of people in the acting biz and not just the writers.

 

[linuxares]

Let them strike. It's about their lively hood. We can do something else while they fight for their right.

 

[FAST6191]

Let them strike. It's about their lively hood. We can do something else while they fight for their right.

I am still in the nothing of value has been lost approach to life. That said you think they have a leg to stand on and deserve without negotiation a cut of things going into the future, to dictate minimum numbers of people in a writing room and to veto AI from being used in writing? Or in the case of actors then no face scans and animated beyond that?

 

[linuxares]

I am still in the nothing of value has been lost approach to life. That said you think they have a leg to stand on and deserve without negotiation a cut of things going into the future, to dictate minimum numbers of people in a writing room and to veto AI from being used in writing? Or in the case of actors then no face scans and animated beyond that?

No I mean, I don't really care as I'm not involved in this strike nor does it really affect me.
That's why I feel it's their fight. I do agree with their demands of course, but just no something I gonna go "gun-hoe" about.

That's why I said we (as in the consumers) can try to do other things and let them (the strikers) try to force their demands.

 

[FAST6191]

I am not sure what you are aiming for.

I have no troubles about the right to strike.

Taking a generally indifferent stance is OK if you want (though any half decent collective action will aim to also get the enthusiastic support of the general public, whilst also inconveniencing them in some way so as to help realise their value within their lives).

The demands I think are ridiculous (even if by some miracle they win they will just be signing their own unemployment as those outside their union* will take the massive upsides for not dealing with it), though I can at least understand why they think they want to make them.

*they do have a bit of a stranglehold within the US, albeit waning, but a lot of stuff happens outside it, even totally outside it (South Korea doing their own thing and doing it very well).

I should also note the phrase is gung-ho; gun-hoe is probably a woman of dubious morals that wields guns (seemingly a popular trope in modern films).

 

[Veho]

Intellectual property laws are some advanced fuckery the world over, and US in particular is at the cutting edge of intellectual property shenanigans but what they boil down to is "if you have enough money you can write your own laws", and that's how Disney has perpetual copyright on "their" works but everyone else can go pound sand.

There is no such thing as "guaranteed" terms or protections, and the second you have to work with anyone else on a project involving intellectual property, you have to negotiate every single bit of now and future payment and if you don't have enough leverage you might end up without your property and owing the publisher your firstborn. (okay for some, I guess, but not everyone)

The labor part of the equation is just as wonky, since we all know (and examples that have come alight during the strike confirm) that "minimum wage" is a suggestion and not a law or anything, so that's an issue.

A worse issue is that "intellectual property", "trademark", "copyright", "brand" and even "labor" are defined so loosely that nobody is certain what anything belongs to and for how long and why.

But the "we'll scan your face and get perpetual exclusive rights to your likeness that we can animate with AI and use forever and you get paid $2 as per the going rates for extras and you can then fuck off" idea that one side of the table with zero self-awareness decided to float by is the shit icing on the crap cake.

So yeah, the whole thing is one big tangled mess and I hope the strike gets everyone one step closer to settling it once and for all, for better or for worse.

 

[SylverReZ]

Hollywood is one example of how actors are mistreated as complete shitholes (or probably the opposite).

 

[N7Kopper]

Actors aren't afraid AI will lose them their jobs, the SAG (or rather, the Film Actors' Guild) is afraid that an alternative will exist that will allow independent creators to escape their ideological stranglehold. This is the very socialist infiltration that Walt Disney's animators alerted him about when it was happening to their union, except that it's already finished.

The lockstep that union voice actors walk in regarding impersonations of their characters reveals this - not only are the impersonations covered under Fair Dealings/Use laws, the voices aren't even theirs. The voices of the characters belong to the rights holders of those characters, not the actors who play them. But they can't dangle the Sword of DamocleSG's with all their fascist friends if Friend Computer comes along and is just as good at being Futaba as Erica Lindbeck is. Nobody's complaining about actually potentially extremely dangerous impersonations like Joe Biden, Donald Trump, and Barack Obama: only of something that could wind back one of many institutional marches.

 

[RAHelllord]

The strike doesn't affect me in the least but I'm still rooting for them to win. The people actually creating the entertainment that others consume get the smallest portion of the revenue and that's bullshit.

This is one of the many reasons why I try and get my entertainment from sources where the creators actually get a decent share of my money, or I buy some of their merchandise instead.

 

[hippy dave]

When I need to figure out who's in the wrong, between the actual people trying to make a living, and the multi-billion dollar corporations, I honestly don't even need to hear the arguments.