Net Neutrality: what it is, and why you should care

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UPDATE: It's been voted for repeal. The FCC took Net Neutrality to a vote, and it was 3-2, in favor of repeal. This doesn't mean overnight upheaval, but things will certainly change, for better or worse, in due time.
If you've been on the internet at all the past week, there's a high chance that you've heard of something called "Net Neutrality", and you've also likely heard that there might be huge changes to your usage of the internet entirely. This post serves as a quick information briefing on what Net Neutrality is, what could happen if it's repealed, and the current events going on regarding it, and just general visibility to let the community in general be informed.

What is this Net Neutrality thing?


The basic definition of network neutrality is simple: all internet traffic is considered and treated equally. It was established just a bit under three years ago, in February 2015. It prevented companies like Comcast Xfinity and AT&T U-verse from speeding up, or slowing down certain sites based upon content. If you remember, back in July 2017, mobile provider Verizon admitted to targeting Netflix traffic, and specifically throttling it, negatively affecting customers' use of Netflix. Going back to 2014, there were also issues with Comcast customers, and, that's right, Netflix users, as connections to Netflix were notoriously slow. Netflix then entered a legal deal with Comcast, in order to have Netflix connections be faster than they previously were. The 2014 incident was pre-net neutrality, and shows that before the law was enacted, certain sites like Netflix were indeed slowed, and had to specifically bargain with large telecommunication monopolies like Comcast to get fair speeds out to their customers.

In April 2017, the chairman of the Federal Communications Commission (FCC), Ajit Pai, revealed that he had plans to repeal net neutrality. It's worth noting that Pai was once the Associate General Counsel of Verizon Communications, an incredibly high up position with an ISP, who we've stated before as having throttled websites in the past.

Pai's statements on the matter included saying such things as "[the government] would be able to stop micromanaging the internet" and that the FCC and internet service providers would simply have to be "transparent about their practices so that consumers can buy a service plan that's best for them". Shortly after, Comcast began vocally supporting these statements, claiming that government regulation of the internet has been harming innovation and investments of Comcast. David Cohen, the company's Chief Diversity Officer, said that "customers would be clearly informed on our practices [...] Comcast maintains that it does and will not block, throttle, or discriminate against lawful content".

Within the movement for repealing net neutrality, also comes with power being given to the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC would then have the ability to legally charge internet service providers that were not made clear to customers.

You may notice, that within any of the claims made by Pai or Comcast, that equal traffic was never made the focus, instead putting emphasis on making sure these monopolies must be clear and transparent about what they do, but never laying down any solid rules about what they need to be transparent about or why. And, of course, if the FTC were to go after AT&T, Comcast, Verizon, Time Warner, or other assorted companies for not being transparent, these legal cases would find themselves taking years to make their way to court, allowing for them to have their way with their customers until a definitive legal ruling. Therein lies the first batch of unease and controversy with the repeal.

In short, net neutrality is a fairly new regulation, which allows for equal traffic between all sites while using the internet. The chairman of the FCC and former higher-up of Verizon wants to repeal it, however. This would allow less government interference with ISPs, but would also allow those ISPs to do what they wish, so long as they're "transparent".

Does repealing Net Neutrality have any benefits?

Spoiler alert: not really

From the inception of the internet, and up until 2015, Americans have gone without net neutrality. Ajit Pai claims that should we not have net neutrality anymore, more rural areas would be able to have more companies and providers, and it would allow for more competition and choice for the consumer. However, these smaller companies would also have to fight it out with established services, with years of experience and infrastructure refinements.

As a side note, I've spent thirty minutes researching a potential "pro" argument. I've not found many that seem reasonable. I've listed in the spoiler tag below arguments from other websites and blogs.

Green Garage Blog: While net neutrality allows for freedom of speech, the downside is that almost anything can be posted to the internet. This means that the cruelest or insensitive information imaginable can end up on the internet, and as a result, it can cause a lot of problems from people that otherwise wouldn’t be prone to being under the microscope of criticism. This means that people can post cruel, intimidating, or other harassing messages and often get away with it thanks to free speech legislation. So it can be a very toxic environment for a lot of people to put up with.

Vittana: Reduced income from internet uses limits infrastructure improvements.
There are certain businesses and high-use individuals who consume large amounts of bandwidth every month. If net neutrality was removed, these high-level consumers would be asked to pay more for what they consume. This added income could then be used to upgrade the infrastructure of each internet service provider, making it possible for advanced fiber networks to be installed in many communities.

AEI: But in many instances, fast lanes, zero-rating, and the like benefit customers. In separate research, both former FCC Chief Economist Michael Katz (with Ben Hermalin) and I (with Janice Hauge) showed that fast lanes benefit small content providers in their attempts to compete with established industry leaders. AEI scholar Roslyn Layton has shown that elderly and low-income consumers benefit from zero-rating services.

Basically, the only benefit would be if America's current economy wasn't dominated by monopolistic ISPs. Below is an interview with Ajit Pai, showing his perspective.


Scrapping these rules, Pai told Reason's Nick Gillespie, won't harm consumers or the public interest because there was no reason for them in the first place. The rationales were mere "phantoms that were conjured up by people who wanted the FCC for political reasons to overregulate the internet," Pai told Gillespie. "We were not living in a digital dystopia in the years leading up to 2015."

If left in place, however, the Title II rules could harm the commercial internet, which Pai described as "one of the most incredible free market innovations in history."

"Companies like Google and Facebook and Netflix became household names precisely because we didn't have the government micromanaging how the internet would operate," said Pai, who noted that the Clinton-era decision not to regulate the Internet like a phone utility or a broadcast network was one of the most important factors in the rise of our new economy.

Pai also pushed back against claims that he's a right-wing radical who's "fucking things up."

"[I ascribe to] the very radical, right-wing position that the Clinton administration basically got it right when it came to digital infrastructure."


What happens if/when this gets repealed, and what does this mean for you?


The worst part of this, is that there's no definitive answer of what WILL happen, only what CAN happen. What has people concerned, though, is the potential things that larger ISPs can do with this new power, should net neutrality be repealed. Internet service providers could slow access to specific sites, and speed up others, in theory, others specifically being sites who pay ISPs for faster access, and those partnered or in contracts with ISPs. Websites like Google, Amazon, Reddit, Etsy, Netflix, and many more have all broadcast their support of net neutrality, stating that without these rules in place thanks to net neutrality, internet providers would become gatekeepers to the internet, restricting what customers can see. Without definitive government restrictions, these companies could be free to split access to the internet into packages, like cable TV, indeed making true on the intention of lowering the cost of internet access, but also making it more difficult and expensive to see all of the internet, as you can right now.

Likely, what will happen, though everything is up in the air, is that certain ISPs will utilize what's called "fast lanes" and "zero rating". Fast lanes are sort of like what we talked about at the start, with Netflix and Comcast. Currently, these fast lanes and zero rating are used with mobile phone data. AT&T customers can watch DirecTV (owned by AT&T) via their mobile data, without it counting towards their monthly cap. These rules could be applied to home internet as well; if you're a Comcast user, and you want to watch Hulu (owned by NBC-Universal-Comcast), maybe your connection to Hulu will be lightning fast, thanks to these theoretical fast lanes, and they won't go towards your Comcast monthly 1 Terabyte home cap. But what if you want to watch Netflix? Either Netflix will have much lower picture quality, or take a longer time to connect to. And if Netflix pays a fee, or gets into a contract once again with Comcast, then that potentially means that Netflix's increased costs move down to the consumer, who also now has to pay more for a service as well.

What can we do?


The only thing left to do is let your voice be heard. Social media has exploded without people decrying the impending repeal of net neutrality, and the negatives that it would entail, to the point of where the majority of Reddit has been plastered with net neutrality posts.

zZOxMA2.png

The FCC will take the repeal to a vote on December 14, 2017. It is highly predicted that the repeal will pass, and net neutrality will come to an end. Millions have taken to the site "battleforthenet" and "callmycongress" to contact their local representatives and congressmen in order to show that American citizens don't want net neutrality destroyed.

You can learn more at the links below. Hopefully this is helpful in describing what net neutrality is, and why it shouldn't be taken away.

:arrow:Techcrunch: These are the arguments against net neutrality and why they're wrong

:arrow: Extra Credits: What a closed internet means

:arrow:Phillip DeFranco: The Internet is under attack

:arrow:Save the internet: What you need to know


:arrow:Ars Technica: RIP net neutrality
 

Skelletonike

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I'd welcome it if it helped to reduce piracy in any way. I don't really care about the rest tbh. People are too dependant on the internet nowadays.
 

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I'd welcome it if it helped to reduce piracy in any way. I don't really care about the rest tbh. People are too dependant on the internet nowadays.

Good luck with that, piracy will continue regardless of any rules/laws that are changed.

It should realistically affect everyone who uses the internet in some form or another (considering a not insignificant amount of content creation and consumption happens from within the US)

I don't know what will happen, just want to close my eyes and plug my ears to the world.
 
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TotalInsanity4

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I'd welcome it if it helped to reduce piracy in any way. I don't really care about the rest tbh. People are too dependant on the internet nowadays.
You can't honestly tell me that you don't read news or stream video online... stuff like that would be subject to selective censorship/blocking if net neutrality is removed

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

As long as it becomes just slightly more difficult, I'll be happy.
Considering it's possible to directly connect to Nintendo's servers and download games currently, I doubt that
 
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How would this not affect more than 5% of people?
Because if anything were to happen, only a fraction of people would truly be stuck with it. In any other situation where even *one* competing ISP isn't misbehaving, the offending ISPs will just bleed customers to another. Hell, even *having* competition means you get cheaper prices in general. See here: https://www.cio.com/article/3133611...et-market-can-signficantly-reduce-prices.html
http://www.analysisgroup.com/upload...roadband_competition_report_november_2016.pdf
https://www.cio.com/article/2988881...ut-cost-of-gigabit-service-in-some-areas.html

Companies are already fucking people, so the 5% I'm talking about are the ones mentioned at the headline for the last CIO.com link I posted -- namely the people in areas where there are absolutely no competitors beyond one company, and thus get higher rates for much worse service. I think it's a bit much that people are acting like the rules Ajit Pai is proposing to remove are going to turn the internet into a complete wasteland, considering that nothing that isn't already happening is going to happen, and ISPs are going to have to factually report their practices, without any jargon, beating around the bush, or anything like that. They have to specifically say "Yes, we are throttling these services/blocking these sites/whatever" in a cleanly legible page that's accessible by the disabled as according to the FCC's plans and regulations.
I can't access a cached copy of the original PDF at the moment, probably being DDOS'd by some loser skiddies. I'll hunt around for it and edit my post to have it, but for now here's a cached rundown of their plan. https://webcache.googleusercontent....d=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1-ab

This line specifically is one I like, because history (and various sources I've linked) aligns with this statement.

MYTH: Broadband providers will charge you a premium if you want to reach certain online content.
FACT: This didn’t happen before the Obama Administration’s 2015 heavy-handed Internet
regulations, and it won’t happen after they are repealed.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

You can't honestly tell me that you don't read news or stream video online... stuff like that would be subject to selective censorship/blocking if net neutrality is removed

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


Considering it's possible to directly connect to Nintendo's servers and download games currently, I doubt that
But you can block torrent clients and their data easily (assuming they aren't being run through VPNs/Proxies and what have you) because Comcast has done it in the past when their entire network was brought to its knees by rampant piracy torrents.
 
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Skelletonike

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You can't honestly tell me that you don't read news or stream video online... stuff like that would be subject to selective censorship/blocking if net neutrality is remove

As I've said, people depend too much on the internet. I do read news online sometimes, but I much prefer buying an actual news paper, online newspapers are mostly crap nowadays, badly written, weak arguments and a lot of major websites make 'news' about what someone said on twitter or facebook. Online news are for the most part, utter garbage. Heck, I mostly only read online news to laugh at the comments.

As for the videos... I don't really watch that much stuff online, I have a netflix and a crunchyroll sub, but that's it, at most they could be slowed down, which I doubt.

My internet is 200mbps, but I have no real use for it aside from when downloading a large MMORPG.
 

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As I've said, people depend too much on the internet. I do read news online sometimes, but I much prefer buying an actual news paper, online newspapers are mostly crap nowadays, badly written, weak arguments and a lot of major websites make 'news' about what someone said on twitter or facebook. Online news are for the most part, utter garbage. Heck, I mostly only read online news to laugh at the comments.

As for the videos... I don't really watch that much stuff online, I have a netflix and a crunchyroll sub, but that's it, at most they could be slowed down, which I doubt.

My internet is 200mbps, but I have no real use for it aside from when downloading a large MMORPG.
That's fair, I guess. I would still rather be able to access breaking developments, though. That way I can actually form an opinion on stuff as its evolving through multiple outlets/firsthand accounts rather than have my view be limited by what a single outlet is reporting
 

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Because if anything were to happen, only a fraction of people would truly be stuck with it. In any other situation where even *one* competing ISP isn't misbehaving, the offending ISPs will just bleed customers to another. Hell, even *having* competition means you get cheaper prices in general. See here: https://www.cio.com/article/3133611...et-market-can-signficantly-reduce-prices.html
http://www.analysisgroup.com/upload...roadband_competition_report_november_2016.pdf
https://www.cio.com/article/2988881...ut-cost-of-gigabit-service-in-some-areas.html

Companies are already fucking people, so the 5% I'm talking about are the ones mentioned at the headline for the last CIO.com link I posted -- namely the people in areas where there are absolutely no competitors beyond one company, and thus get higher rates for much worse service. I think it's a bit much that people are acting like the rules Ajit Pai is proposing to remove are going to turn the internet into a complete wasteland, considering that nothing that isn't already happening is going to happen, and ISPs are going to have to factually report their practices, without any jargon, beating around the bush, or anything like that. They have to specifically say "Yes, we are throttling these services/blocking these sites/whatever" in a cleanly legible page that's accessible by the disabled as according to the FCC's plans and regulations.
I can't access a cached copy of the original PDF at the moment, probably being DDOS'd by some loser skiddies. I'll hunt around for it and edit my post to have it, but for now here's a cached rundown of their plan. https://webcache.googleusercontent....d=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1-ab

This line specifically is one I like, because history (and various sources I've linked) aligns with this statement.

MYTH: Broadband providers will charge you a premium if you want to reach certain online content.
FACT: This didn’t happen before the Obama Administration’s 2015 heavy-handed Internet
regulations, and it won’t happen after they are repealed.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


But you can block torrent clients and their data easily (assuming they aren't being run through VPNs/Proxies and what have you) because Comcast has done it in the past when their entire network was brought to its knees by rampant piracy torrents.

I don't know what to think, all I'm gonna do is sit back and let the shit hit the fan, because I sure as hell don't see anything we do is gonna somehow stop them.
 
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This is not reality. Comcast/TWC fucked people over all the way to the top of the chain. EA is another great example. Capitalism works best for those that know how to fuck people over just enough.
But it is. Funny you bring up EA as an example. The sales for the highly controversial Battlefront 2 (2017) have actually failed to even break 1 million. https://www.forbes.com/sites/insert...t-20-of-call-of-duty-wwii-sales/#20178fda2b38

For contrast most AAA titles at least reach a million. Even Halo 5, which is controversial for it's single player, sold around 4.88 million copies. Suffice to say capitalism clearly has an effect on this. Practices which people dislike are not profitable because they just won't buy it. You can't attribute BF2017's commercial shortcomings to lack of advertising because like everything EA does (besides Titanfall 2 strangely) this had shittons of advertising, and was by their big cash cow company, DICE.

I'm gonna wait for some examples on Comcast's fuckery though. Because from my understanding a lot of it is contextless """violations""" cited by biased sites like FreePress, ironically enough.
 
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Xzi

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But it is. Funny you bring up EA as an example. The sales for the highly controversial Battlefront 2 (2017) have actually failed to even break 1 million.
Their stock is way up over last year because Battlefront 2 is just one game and they've shoved P2W MTX into nearly all their games at this point.

I'm gonna wait for some examples on Comcast's fuckery though.
You don't have to wait for those, every single person who has ever had Comcast as an ISP has plenty of horror stories. Myself included.
 

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Their stock is way up over last year because Battlefront 2 is just one game and they've shoved P2W MTX into nearly all their games at this point.


You don't have to wait for those, every single person who has ever had Comcast as an ISP has plenty of horror stories. Myself included.

Only thing Comcast is good at is their fast internet, currently have 100 mbps as part of a free upgrade. Google Fiber can't go to my own because Comcast is a dick to them.
 
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Only thing Comcast is good at is their fast internet, currently have 100 mbps as part of a free upgrade. Google Fiber can't go to my own because Comcast is a dick to them.
Well, now they're pushing for NN repeal so they can dip their speeds well below 100 mbps on websites/traffic they don't like and still advertise it the same. I'm on Comcast now, and I get 150 mbps, but service drops more than it should to internet, cable TV, or both at the same time. Our other option for TV here is satellite, which means crappier reception on stormy days. Our other option for internet is DSL, and that's like no joke 20 mbps down tops.

Comcast will always find a way to make you hate them. FYI, if you're not calling in once a year and demanding to get your price lowered, they're already gouging you. I've been loving Mutant Football League on Steam, and one of the fake advertisements is "Comcrack Entertainment, they're not happy until you're not happy." I might've literally laughed my ass off.
 
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Xzi

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Then surely you can give me some and I shouldn't have to repeatedly drill you about it.
Sure. At the last place I lived, the install guys had to come twice, and still didn't get it right after the second time. Finally I just went into the crawlspace below, re-did everything myself, and then re-did everything upstairs and got it working perfectly. Customer support is a nightmare every time you call, assuming you can even get a real person. And get this: I'm the lucky one supposedly because in other areas, Comcast imposes data caps for the same price I get unlimited. Probably only because of state regulations, but the government is trying to eliminate states' rights to their own net regulations as well.

might i say SSI is a trap the ppl on it refuses to work cause of the (very) low safe cap for wages $80 to be exact (I should know i draw SSI AND tried to work to make a little extra and pay excess bills) for work training for 3 months i only worked at min wage (7.25/hr) 4 hrs a day 5 days a week and got a biweekly check by month 1 of 3 my SSI got cut in half YES HALF AND it took double the time (6 months) after finishing training to reinstate my full benifiets
Yeah I think it was mostly intended for the older generations, and I have no doubt it's been corrupted by the (capitalist) system after all this time.
 
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Sure. At the last place I lived, the install guys had to come twice, and still didn't get it right after the second time. Finally I just went into the crawlspace below, re-did everything myself, and then re-did everything upstairs and got it working perfectly. Customer support is a nightmare every time you call, assuming you can even get a real person. And get this: I'm the lucky one supposedly because in other areas, Comcast imposes data caps for the same price I get unlimited. Probably only because of state regulations, but the government is trying to eliminate states' rights to their own net regulations as well.
As in "your state (most likely) says that ISPs have to give unlimited data to customers for a reasonable price, and theirs don't," or "their state imposes data caps, and yours doesn't"?
 

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As in "your state (most likely) says that ISPs have to give unlimited data to customers for a reasonable price, and theirs don't," or "their state imposes data caps, and yours doesn't"?
Weaken states' rights on the matter of Net Neutrality altogether, and probably weaken their ability to impose (or keep) other regulations contrary to Comcast/TWC/AT&T/Verizon's agenda. Don't forget how badly your mobile carriers want to charge you more for data as well. They straight complained about it under Obama.
 
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Weaken states' rights on the matter of Net Neutrality altogether, and probably weaken their ability to impose (or keep) other regulations contrary to Comcast/TWC/AT&T/Verizon's agenda. Don't forget how badly your mobile carriers want to charge you more for data as well. They straight complained about it under Obama.
I'm grateful I have charter. They're behind the times in terms of speed, but I've never been throttled and don't have a watchful eye looking down me. Cell service is a nightmare though. I'm stuck with Verizon or AT&T.. Or prepaid... But meh.
 
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Sure. At the last place I lived, the install guys had to come twice, and still didn't get it right after the second time. Finally I just went into the crawlspace below, re-did everything myself, and then re-did everything upstairs and got it working perfectly. Customer support is a nightmare every time you call, assuming you can even get a real person. And get this: I'm the lucky one supposedly because in other areas, Comcast imposes data caps for the same price I get unlimited. Probably only because of state regulations, but the government is trying to eliminate states' rights to their own net regulations as well.
I don't know, I consider these kind of arguments to be an enigma because while the internet provided by my ISP is great, there's been fringe cases with mine, where the technicians came in reeking of marijuana and left butts in the yard of a friend of mine. Net Neutrality regulations (at least the Obama administration's anyways) aren't going to change that though. This is something I'd chalk more up to just having shitty customer service more than full on regulation violations regarding the service provided. I don't personally consider my ISP to be awful since I've never been throttled, and the worst thing they've ever done is charge an extra 5$ for "tech advancement."

So in that case I'd definitely say that's shitty service and a paying customer deserves a *fuck* of a lot better, but at the same time this is a case that can vary from state to state, or even city to city -- some can be shitty, and some can be fantastic. My question to you is what this actually has to do with net neutrality, because as bad as the story is I don't see what relevance it carries when the context is internet regulation violations.
 
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So in that case I'd definitely say that's shitty service and a paying customer deserves a *fuck* of a lot better, but at the same time this is a case that can vary from state to state, or even city to city -- some can be shitty, and some can be fantastic. My question to you is what this actually has to do with net neutrality, because as bad as the story is I don't see what relevance it carries when the context is internet regulation violations.
The moral of the story is that when shitty companies like Comcast and TWC get near-monopolies and then push for Net Neutrality repeal, they're obviously not doing it out of love for their fellow human being. Nor are they doing it to introduce more competition against themselves.
 
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The moral of the story is that when shitty companies like Comcast and TWC get near-monopolies and then push for Net Neutrality repeal, they're obviously not doing it out of love for their fellow human being. Nor are they doing it to introduce more competition against themselves.
No one said it was out of compassion or anything like that. No one was even arguing that.
http://corporate.comcast.com/comcas...classification-title-ii-is-not-net-neutrality
Before you screech at me linking a corporate comcast link, read it in full, and click the sources.
Now read this part at least three times.

We all need to step back from the partisan rhetoric that has too often impeded rational discussion on net neutrality. There is widespread consensus on what strong net neutrality rules should look like. It’s time for all of us to work together to protect American consumers and to advance those important principles without a misguided Title II overhang. We are committed to getting there – and through every step of the process, we are committed to preserve net neutrality rules and to protect our customers.

The key to take from this is the partisan "us vs them" shit is getting no one anywhere. Hopefully you can agree with me on this. People are wrongly demonizing Ajit, myself, and literally anyone who is critical of the current classifications and regulations, as if we're all preaching for the internet to get murdered or some shit. Likewise, I've found in places like 4chan (which is already a shithole so this is probably to be expected) anyone who argues for net neutrality is just a reddit shill. I think there's a validity to both arguments, and that is people are taking sides on topics they do not fully understand. Computerus3r is the absolute best example.
 
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